what constitutes possession

The first umpire is incorrect. The fielder doesn't have to control the ball "above the ground." The second umpire is correct.
NFHS Rule 2-9-1-Note: ...For any other (other than a batted ball or pitch) thrown ball, the term (catch) is used loosely to also apply to a pick-up or to the trapping of a low throw which has touched the ground. A fielder may have the ball in his grasp even though it is touching the ground while in his glove.

Of course, it's umpire judgement as to whether the fielder is actually grasping the ball. With the bare hand it's rather easy to see. With the glove over the ball it isn't but the ump is still going to have to make a call.

quote:

Originally posted by DadCoachFan:
We had a firstbaseman that drops the cath then traps the ball under his glove. The ump called it safe and said that possession has to be above the ground.

In another game the thirdbaseman drops the trow on a force but before the runner arrives traps the ball under his hand and the ump called the runner out. The ump says you need only control of the ball whether it's on the ground or not.

Thanks

Both of these are situations where an umpire is required to determine whether control of the ball has been attained. If a player doesn't clearly demonstrate control of the ball then the umpire has no choice but to call the runner safe. This is completely up to the umpire's judgement (and since I wasn't there I won't second guess him/them). Remember that once a player messes up a play (by dropping the throw) then most umpires will tend to not reward a miss-play by giving an out unless there is undeniable evidence that the out was earned anyway. Technically that is not the letter of the rule, but it is what most umpires enforce.

Slightly different situation occurred Saturday. R1 & R2, one out. Goundball hit up the middle, ss dives, deflects ball behind second. 2b dives, grabs ball with bare hand and touches 2b with empty glove. Umpire called R1 safe, said ball had to be in glove when "tagging" base with glove. We did not believe he was correct, but had no FED rule book. Any help??

There is no need for a NFHS rule book on this one....This is a force play......Tagging the base with an empty hand is all that is needed.....imagine if the 2nd baseman was standing....and touched the base with his foot........if the runner is out when a foot touches the base, he is also out when a hand touches the base......

Umpire blew the call....