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We have a dilema. Our son played on a legion team this summer and all along we suspected that the coaches, who are from a competing high school, were intentionally holding him back by not letting him play even though everyone knows he had the same abilities as the other players. Well a college coach told us yesterday that he really wants our son and that when he came to see him at a legion game the coaches tried to get him to forget about our son and look at one of their regular season players. What would you do? I see us as having the following options:

1. forget it because those kind of people don't listen anyway

2. report it to the legion or at least that teams board of directors

3. confront the coaches

We're concerned that this wasn't the only coach that they did this with and would like to know for sure.
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quote:
We're concerned that this wasn't the only coach that they did this with and would like to know for sure.


For that reason and that reason alone, I would contact the coach. Without being argumentative, explain that you just found out that the college coach had inquired. Explain you're interested in knowing what other schools contacted him. If he truly did what the college coach claims, then most likely he won't admit to any other schools contacting him.

Sounds like your son has the ability to attract some attention and I would just move on. He doesn't have to refer other kids to this legion program or ever play there again. Chalk it up as a lesson learned and focus on the future.
1. Deal directly with the college coaches. They make their own assessments anyway, and obviously they're interested in your son in spite of the bum steer, so stay positive with them and continue the process without the legion coaches.

The college coaches may already have an accurate assessment of the legion coaches and thus, not put much stock in what they say or even take it as a reverse barometer. Many college coaches will have local contacts they trust, and they will use those contacts to get evaluations of both your son and the reliability of information they might get from his coaches.

2. Wait to see if the same coaches are coming back to the post next year. If there is turnover, the problem is over without your having to break any eggs.

3. Even if the coaches return next year, raising this problem with the post is unlikely to result in the replacement of the coaches or anything else that helps. Look into whether your son can play for another post under a release procedure. Or, look into forgoing legion ball altogether in favor of a travel/showcase team.

I don't know your area, but around here the select travel teams offer better opportunities anyway. It's not unusual to see boys skip legion ball altogether until AFTER they are done with the recruiting process, e.g., until after their senior year and after their college freshman year. Obviously lots of elite players are still in the legion program, don't get me wrong, but the post teams don't get all the top players like they did in years past. Too many other things draw those top players away.

One of the advantages of the travel/showcase team is that you pick whom you're with. You pick your coaches and you pick your teammates, and they pick you. There are no arbitrary geographic limitations, either, so your choices are, ahem, legion. Start casting around now and I would bet you could find a good match well before next June.
Geez these types of things cause a lot of stress!

quote:
...were intentionally holding him back by not letting him play...


I would say under any circumstance your son should try to muster the courage to talk with the coach about this. The coach ?might? have some viable reasoning that your son should hear. But right or wrong, if the coach doesn't think he's good enough, then its probably time to move on. Why stay in a summer program that doesn't value your abilities?

quote:
...a college coach told us yesterday that he really wants our son...


Any chance you could ask this college coach for his advice on where to go? What to do? Change teams? Help you find a team?

quote:
...confront the coaches...


Somehow I think you should try and figure out how to talk with the coaches (after your son does) being as respectful as you can to find out why they have arrived at the conclusions they have. There's a chance you might learn something useful.

If none of this works/helps...tell him he's full of $hit!. No, not really. Eek Just realize its probably time to move on to another team. Sometimes people/coaches and even parents just make mistakes or don't see it the same way. Sounds like your son must be a decent ballplayer to have gotten the attention of a college coach, so there will be other options out there.

Good luck! Wink Let us know how it goes.
Last edited by justbaseball
I would be cautious about how I introduce the subject to the coaches, if you do. If the college coach is really interested, indicating the college coach was the source of your information could raise an awful lot of issues and denials. May also lead to a lot of alienation.
I have a suspicion that if the college coach gave his honest impressions of what he was told, the summer coaches will deny they said anything like that. This could be an "ugly" "he said"/"I deny" type situation with your son in the center. I think you want to keep the college coach as an ally based on everything you have posted. If the summer coaches really are "culprits," I don't think they will say so. They put the focus on the college coach as the bad guy.
Personally, I would move forward but I would think this through very carefully on how to do it. It could create quite a bit of "friction."
My son was in a situation like that this summer. As bad as it was for us. It was worse for other kids. He went to the coach once to ask him why he wasn't playing. His response, "we (coaches I guess) just wanted to see how you would react to not being in the lineup". Good answer coach. His team had a starting mif from a large school with an excellent program. A coach from a 4 year D-1 school wanted to see him play during a recent popular tournament. The kid didn't play the first day the coach was there and the second day the coach was there to see him he didn't play till the 7th inning when the coach put him in at catcher. Yep, I said catcher. This is just scrathing the surface. We're not goinig back. Don't believe the hype. I have said all this to say this. So many of these coaches in youth baseball are flaming idiots and are there for the wrong reasons. I know some of you may take offense at this. I'm not going to get into a debate. You can go raise hell and then you get known as the dreaded "problem parent." Best thing you can do is let your son use this as a learning experience. You know they're going to run into plenty of idiots in the business world. Or they're going to work for a loser. Learn from it. As bad as this summer was, my son has been contacted by 2 D-1 schools and 2 D-3 schools. He has already met with one of the D-1's. This was do to our marketing him as you would market yourself in the business world and us doing select showcases. One man's opinion.
Last edited by no-e2
You didn't mention, did the college coach get to see your son play,if he did as Fungo suggests mission accomplished. No need to say a thing.

If he didn't then HE (the coach) needed to take that up with the summer coach. Coaches normally oblige other coaches upon their requests, if he really wanted to see your son, then he would not have wasted a trip. If he didn't, summer is over, move on. If the coach really wants to seehim play, give him his fall ball schedule.

I remember a scenerio similar to this a few years ago when son was playing summer ball. A coach came to watch the game, one player and his folks thought he had come to see him, he didn't play. Turned out later that coach came to see another player.


JMO.
Last edited by TPM
quote:
Originally posted by gpct8500:
He did get to see him pitch and had already seen him three times. He told us that he didn't agree at all with the legion coaches assessment. He also mentioned that the legion coaches did the same with other players. I figure that their reputation just went down the tube at least with this D1 college.


He saw him then, let it go. It's up to the college coach now to make his decision, going back to say something accomplishes nothing.

JMO
no e 2,
Many coaches don't feel they have to change their plans to accomodate players to be seen, but should accomodate coaches.
Did the coach ask to see your son play?

Parents,
I know a lot of this is BS as to how we see our sons treated. Many of us have been through it. Something you need to get used to, for the next level.
What are you all going to do when you go up for a baseball weekend, spend lotsof money to get and stay there, expecting to see your son play and he sits all weekend? Call the coach?

JMO.
Last edited by TPM
IMO - I agree with TPM.

Talking to the coaches is a waste of time - if you are sure of what they have done. Speaking to them will not automatically give them character.

Talking to the Legion Board is a bigger waste of time.

Just let it go and use your energies on finding new ideas and alternatives to get your son in a positon to be treated fairly.

Good luck!
Good advice, imo. The goal is exposure and college contacts. The goal was met. The player just got around the first major obstruction put in his way. I would find a new team for next season though.

You will never know how many times the coach trashed your kid. Don't feel like the Lone Ranger though.

There are odd twisted summmer coaches who feel more of an obligation to a college coach, than their own players, often publicizing imaginery flaws in a players skill set or personality, in order to build up their own image in the college coaches mind. It happens, a good bit. He only can go to one school though.

You learned a good lesson. Take ownership of the recruiting process. Never assume anyone has your players best interests in mind.
quote:
Sounds like your son must be a decent ballplayer to have gotten the attention of a college coach, so there will be other options out there.


You have received great input from some of the best posters on this site. As you go through these, often times you can find a gem. I think justbb has one with the above. No matter what the summer coaches did, if your son can play and produce, he will play in college. Might not be where you expect. May not even be a school you have thought about yet. If he can play, a college coach is going to find him as long as you do what is posted on the site and follow a lot of the suggestions you receive from folks like Fungo, TPM, Dad04 and justbb. You are supported by some All Stars!!!! Big Grin
Last edited by infielddad
good advice all around, espically milodad (coaches, even bad ones, are entitled to their opinion about players) i only wanted to add that over the years from various teams my son played on i heard about actions of coaches from players/parents, e.g. coach recommended me, coach called on my behalf, coach thinks i can play div. I, etc, and i found out later these statements/stories were not just inaccurate, but completely made-up.
Thanks for all of the advice. I am now confident it's better to say nothing. The one thing that gives me solice is that I have a 14 yr old with lots of friends heading into high school. Because our 17 year old is well known in the community for his abilities and accomplishments we are continually getting requests from the younger kids' parents for information about what to do next. I can say they don't plan on recommending to any of them that they tryout out for the legion team our son was on. I don't want to see any more kids with any kind of talent go through the same thing he has.
I also would vote that it's best to say nothing to the Legion coach, but for a slightly different reason...possibly alienating the college coach who likes your son. If you use the college coach's comments as "ammunition" in a confrontation with the Legion coach, the college coach may feel like you breached some sort of confidence and put him "on the spot" in a situation he won't enjoy. Best to keep the college coach thinking "happy thoughts" about your son AND YOU!...IMHO
Been there done that, also have seen other players with tremendous talent be buried in Summer Travel teams and Legion. Causes are usually petty BS and politics.
Our son had same thing happen a couple of times. One poor college coach followed him for several games/touneys and never got to see him pitch until a National Showcase in August before Senior year. Some coaches were told he would pitch on a certain day and then they would throw someone else. We also had an experience where son's long-time coach put him back on field after he broke a bone and it was pretty obvious. He did this knowing that the kid was going onto play and had signed D-1 Ball that Fall. So a Legion Game basically cost my kid his Freshman year of Baseball in college.
Son is fine now and rehabbing playing Summer ball. But what we have learned is that, often times, high school level coaches just do not care about the health or future of their players. Apparently, my kid did not even get all the letters sent to his hs coach about him, they sat in his drawer. But it doesn't matter now. We've seen people pull some pretty disgusting stunts, and it's always humorous to hear "the rumor of the week" floating around the local baseball community.
I'm so grateful that we do not have to be around such nonsense anymore.
I will say this, regardless of Summer/Legion coaches actions or words, it did not slow down college recruiters who were interested in our kid.
If they want to recruit him, some dumb Legion Coach won't stop them from recruiting him. There is a reason some coaches coach High School and some coaches coach D-1.
As parents, we did not count on one Travel team to get our kid exposure. He also attended several Showcases and Scouting Combines. This involved a lot of research and plane tickets. I think my kid took 38 flights that summer and fall. Definitely worth it.
It was a good thing we took this pro-active action, because our son would not be at the school he is at now if he did not attend the Combine and Showcases and only relied on summer team.
My son is incredibly blessed to have chosen a university that has been a perfect fit for him all the way around. Academics and Baseball. And his college coaches have integrity and did not cut him due to the Legion injury. And they don't throw a player that is hurt. They supported him throughout the injury and rehab and did not cut him. So he still has opportunities based on his performance. We are incredibly blessed. So there are good coaches out there that look out for the players.
So my advice would be to get your son into a healthy more positive situation and don't even bother talking to that bonehead of a coach. Talking to that moron will just **** you off and you won't get anywhere because he won't listen anyway. Besides, it's obvious what his intentions are, no darned good. So best to move out of the situation quietly.

College coaches deal with this kind of thing a lot. I wouldn't bring the situation up to college coach, I would just pursue a course of action to get your kid seen by that coach, via showcase or whatever. Provided that that school is a good fit for your son. From our experience, you never know what can happen, so our son put academics first and the life on the campus as priority. His college coaches' honesty and integrity and prior track record played a big part in decision, too. Our son made the right decision for him in choosing his current school and he loves it there.

Good luck to you and your boy and enjoy the ride! And don't let people who will be insignificant a year from now trouble you or interfer with the joy of having your son recruited. Smile Have fun, it only happens once!
LHP,
Great post!

Parents,
The senior summer experience is an important one. Try to look for a travel program that brings your son to significant places to play (college campus) and against good competition (wood bat tourneys). Try to hook up with a coach that enjoys winning, but also enjoys having your son seen by college coaches. Many coaches take great satisfaction in seeing their players get college scholarships. In fact, many run their programs for this purpose alone.

Sometimes the high cost of these teams can offset your costs for college in the form of scholaship dollars. Smile

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