Why so touchy ?

TR - Thats a fair question. I closed one thread.

In my view, the board will die if debates are launched or perpetuated by insulting language.

If instead, the debates are respectful, well-articulated and genuine...there should be no problem. Like you, I see debate as a good and informative thing.

I cannot speak for other closures...but I saw the thread I closed as one poster put it to me, "like the bathroom wall in the boys room in a Junior high school." No need for that here. The thread-starter made his/her point using an insulting term...nothing more needed to be said or debated with that kind of a start. Its still there for all to read.

JB

I would think I wasn't in that bathroom--I didnt see it

I just think some moderators are pulling the trigger a bit to soon---language can be deleted==but spirited debate can continue the way it should

quote:

Originally posted by TRhit:
...but spirited debate can continue the way it should

Yes it can...and your initiation of this thread is essentially about the same topic, but far more respectful.

Let the debate begin!

Is this a debate about debate?

quote:

Originally posted by PGStaff:
Is this a debate about debate?

It would appear so!

You got it---we deserve the right to debate ---LOL


BTW the INMAN kid is pitching now for the Padres

quote:

Originally posted by TRhit:
BTW the INMAN kid is pitching now for the Padres

Was he in the Brewer system last year?

RZ


yes he was

quote:

Originally posted by TRhit:
are the moderators having problems/ Are they edgy adn if so why?

It's the economy and all the depressing news, man. It's got us all jumpy.

Maybe ... in a world where people have become cowed by political correctness, and where we search for wisdom in bumper stickers, rather than giving time to serious thought; too many of us have lost our ability to engage in the constructive exchange of ideas. For those struggling with this skill, here is some help:

Argument Clinic

By the way ... have you ever asked yourself if we have to identify something as "politically correct", are we not admitting that it is in reality incorrect? Otherwise, it would simply be correct, would it not?

I am one of those moderators whose actions collectively people are complaining about. No I did not erase or lock any threads recently - so it probably wasn't me personally that locked or closed that particular thread - but it very easily could have been.

Why am I a moderator? Julie asked me to join the others who play that role - and I was honored that she asked. It is a job I do - and I think many other moderators do - because I believe that HSBBW is a wonderful community and I want to do what I can to help keep it that way.

Being a moderator is in many ways like being an umpire. When I take action, often times it is not a difficult decision and I don't think anyone on this thread would disagree with those actions (spam cleaning). Once in a while, it becomes much more of a judgement call - and I simply do the best that I can.

While Julie may decide to let this thread continue, I would like to point out that most boards do not permit the discussion of moderator actions - and frankly I think that is a good policy.

08

When moderators can openly state who they want eliminated from the site than I think posters can ask the question I have asked.

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quote:

Originally posted by southpaw_dad:

Argument Clinic

By the way ... have you ever asked yourself if we have to identify something as "politically correct", are we not admitting that it is in reality incorrect? Otherwise, it would simply be correct, would it not?

It seems you've been hanging out in that clinic southpaw...you've presented a good argument.

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Makes a great stocking stuffer!

TR, I do appreciate that you have asked this question in a calm and non-threatening way.

But to address the question in general...

There are so many interesting and positive baseball topics posted every day in our forums. So many uplifting and exciting stories of baseball players and their proud parents! So many good questions asked about the recruiting process, and wonderful, unselfish members who offer their knowledge and time to answer questions and share what worked for them and what didn't work.

When a few members want to clutter up the forums with arguments or disrespect...I just don't feel guilty at all if moderators choose not to waste their time trying to manage those threads, and instead decide to close them.

I love the people of the HS Baseball Web. I am truly amazed at how many wise baseball minds we have here, and how many generous people share the most interesting stories that I continue to learn from, and that parents and players coming up through HS and college can learn so much from. Let's keep using more of our bandwidth for those positive and helpful threads, and not worry too much about the small percentage of negative input.

What a special community we have here!

Julie

quote:

Originally posted by TRhit:
08

When moderators can openly state who they want eliminated from the site than I think posters can ask the question I have asked.

Not sure what you are referring to here - but since it could be inferred you are talking about me, I have only ever suggested that one user be blocked from the system - and that was someone who had established a new ID and created 10-15 spam posts in the first hour.

Well, I've seen both sides to this issue and I think in a way TR Hit is right. If this site gets to the point where any vigorous argument (relevant to the point) is squashed it becomes lame and irrelevant.

HSBWW is not irrelevant. It is a neighborhood of people who would mow your yard while you are on vacation, wave at you from across the street but never talk, and.. not call 9-1-1 even if your house were burning down.

It takes all types in a community, does it not?

While I think all members have a duty to follow the rules and abide by the board principles, moderators equally have a duty not to be draconian in their application. After all, some of our best debates on this board got a little crazy then eventually settled down. Most of us can self-monitor. We're all adults. But even adults can get a little childish at times, and what's wrong with that?

As many here already know I have asked for and have not received any kind of moderator response on the question of the “line item veto” for moderators so that whole good threads are not wiped out. Is this possible or technically not? This would teach infractors where they have crossed the line and not dump the good information.
I have noticed and have been told about past Mike Marshall threads that have been wiped out because of bias towards this information from most including past moderating officials. In all sincerity I was hoping to put out results of my experiences with Marshall’s process but keep getting rude comments about some past associations that are not my doing. I understand this a special case and is an extremely emotional issue but I feel we can discuss it from a mechanical viewpoint instead of cultural one. Help!

quote:

When a few members want to clutter up the forums with arguments or disrespect...I just don't feel guilty at all if moderators choose not to waste their time trying to manage those threads, and instead decide to close them.

Mom , what if shutting down the thread was the rude ones intent? Is this then fair? This is why the line item veto would work?

Again thanx to southpaw_dad

'Debate' is what most fish I have encountered in my lifetime have done to my hook.

Yes some moderators (at least I can) go in and change a line item and modify a thread. I have done that on more than one occasion. If someone posts a obvious advertisement with a link but at the same time adds content to the HSBBW I will ***XX out the link but allow the discussion to continue. In these cases we are normally dealing with a one time poster with the obvious intent of taking advantage of the HSBBW for personal monetary gains. BUT modifying an individuals post is publicly singling out an individual poster and "correcting" that poster --- that would be improper in my opinion and lead to an argumentative response (human nature 101). On the other hand closing a thread is curt, to the point and while considered rude by some, it eliminates the possibility of personal arguments (not debates) and doesn't necessarily single out one poster. Having been here for 10 plus years I have as good an eye as anyone for seeing a thread go bad. Do I pull the trigger too soon? I'm sure I do at times --- do I allow a thread to become embroiled into a full blown argument that should have been closed --- again I'm sure I do that too.
I have to commend Julie (the owner) for her open mindness to these types of situations. While she maintains full control she does poll other people on how a particular situation should be handled. There are agreements and disagreements in these polls and the resolution she makes is always made in the best interest of the HSBBW.
Whenever a "corrective" action is taken, we should know the response from the members will seldom be 100% positive. That's human nature 101 chapter #2.
Moderating isn't fun. I take no joy in moderating a thread. If I delete or close a thread I do it for the VAST majority of the posters that will never respond to an argumentative thread. When I delete or close a thread there are MANY that say thanks (without saying it) while there are others that immediately WANT to argue vehemently about it. Case in point --- Note the title of this thread. In my opinion a less argumentative title toward moderators could have been selected that would have sparked a more objective discussion instead of immediately laying blame (mostly at me) and drawing a line in the sand. You probably don't see it as such but you weren't the moderator.
As a private business owner with about 40 employees I had to conduct business in a manner that didn't step on individuals "toes". However it is necessary at times to do just that when an individual steps on the remaining 39 employees "toes". Sometimes employees even have to be fired to protect the remaining employees. That's not fun but it is a very import part of ensuring success for the remaining employees. One bad apple can indeed spoil the barrel.
The HSBBW has had a VERY long life in a very unstable volatile environment ---- internet discussion boards. There is NO doubt in my mind that the main reason for that longevity is the ability to control the level of dissent on non- baseball threads (non-relevant) by Julie and the moderators she selects. I go back and read the board manners from time to time (written years ago by Bob Howdeshell) just to remind myself of how things need to be --- I find solace when I'm criticized for tying to maintain integrity on the HSBBW when Bob explains there will be those that "Just don't get it".
Baseball is just around the corner (for me and you) --- I feel sure these discussions will return to baseball and everything will smooth out.
Fungo

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quote:

Originally posted by Bum:
But even adults can get a little childish at times, and what's wrong with that?

What's wrong with that?



In my book Bum...nothing wrong at all.





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No one is being touchy. I completely support justbb and the other moderators. Continually starting threads calling out the moderators is counter-productive. Disagree until the cows come home but do it civilly and to the point at hand.

I totally agree with Fungo's and Julie's comments as well.

quote:

The HSBBW has had a VERY long life in a very unstable volatile environment ---- internet discussion boards. There is NO doubt in my mind that the main reason for that longevity is the ability to control the level of dissent on non- baseball threads (non-relevant) by Julie and the moderators she selects.

There are those that "just don't get it."

Here's a thanks, Fungo.

Wood Dog, THOSE are exactly the kinds of fish I am talking about!!!

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The only dog in our house!

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