Skip to main content

23 replies

Work with your players not against them

D danramosd10+ posts
I've played for many coaches over the years, some good, some bad, and feel the ones that help the players the most are ones that work with them. I see so many coaches yelling at the players for making physical mistakes, it is part of the game! I understand that not all players will like you as a coach but when they respect you, they become much more receptive to what you have to say. Please check out this article and let me know what you coaches think. Do you agree or am I too far in over my head? Feedback is always welcomed!
Real life, in game baseball tips http://www.betterpitches.com
Original Post

Replies sorted oldest to newest

W Will1,000+ posts
when I played getting yelled at for screwing up was no big deal. you had to be tough. Ok I know what some are thinking. I am old school etc etc etc. Seems today everybody wants you to tell the kid when he screws up not to worry about it. so he does not and a couple innings later he does it again. well he did exactly what you said he did not worry about it.
D danramosd10+ posts
I agree with you two that players are getting softer today (not keeping score in little league or t ball games) but failing is part of the game. If it wasn't then there would be no point in playing the game. I completely agree w yelling at kids but doing it because they booted a ball at short stop is not the time to do. Now if he boots the ball because he refuses to change the way he fields or lack of effort and won't listen to you that is a different story. Thanks for the feedback guys keep it coming
H hsballcoach100+ posts
It depends on one's coaching style. I rarely yell. When I do, the boys know they pushed way too far. And I do this only in practice. 99% of the time I feel it is better to coach my kids than yell at them. I don't need to yell, I let them know what they need to do to be successful, if they choose not to do it, I will sit them on the bench and find a player that will. That takes care of the situation. I tell my players to play all out and loose. If we are going to make an error, then at least make it a big one. Don't make an error because you are afraid of getting yelled at and are hesitant to cut loose with a ball. Cut loose and throw the ball over the darn backstop for that matter! If I am having to yell that much, then I am not coaching them the right way to do something, or I am playing the wrong kid.
Coach_MayCoach_May10,000+ posts
Good post coach. Physical errors vs mental errors. Most errors are made because a player fails to execute from a fundemental standpoint. And this can be caused from not mentally focusing on doing it the right way. There are many errors made that appear to be physical errors but in fact they are mental. When a player fails to cut off a ball in the gap is it because he is simply too slow or is it because he failed to take the proper route? There are numerous examples I could give. Its important for the coach to understand what he is seeing and to know his players abilities and their limitations. Its also important that the coach actually work on the fundementals of the game in practice and require that his players learn the proper way to play the game. Its kind of like getting ticked off when a kid fails to get down a bunt in a game but you have not worked on it in a month.

When kids fail to hustle. When they fail to execute the fundementals that have been coached over and over again. When they fail to focus on what they have been taught to focus on. Those are the situations where I feel you need to make sure they understand it will not be tolerated. The best way to communicate this is by not putting their name on the line up card.

I am not a yeller. I dont scream at players. I talk to them and I coach them. And if they fail to get the message I deliver the best message I can. Your name is not in the line up. If it is a player that is not in the line up then I deliver that message when it should be their time in the line up.

Running, conditioning should never be used as punishment imo. It shoud be used for the proper reasons. Its helps you be a better player. Yelling at kids may help some focus better. Screaming my indeed get their attention. For others it will cause them to fear messing up not because they might hurt the team but because you might yell at them again. It adds pressure. Most players that want to succeed and win put enough pressure on themselves already. The last thing they need imo is a coach putting added pressure on them. The coach should be the calming force in the storm. The guy that they see as the one that will be there to help them and teach them.

I set a high standard because I want them to reach for the stars so to speak. I want them to understand I expect everything they have and I will demand it. But your players will respect you if you show them respect as well. Yelling at kids and screaming at kids imo is not productive. Sitting them on the bench and not playing them in situations where they expect to be played works quite well.
D danramosd10+ posts
@coach_may GREAT RESPONSE! I couldn't agree more with the physical/mental error line. And that is what I feel makes the difference between quality of coaches. The better coaches have a strong idea when a player is just refusing to put forth their best effort, and when they are just not talented enough to preform the task at hand.

For example, when a pitcher lets up an 0-2 hit is that a physical or mental mistake? The pitcher knows that the ball shouldn't be hittable, but at the same time you never want to 'waste' a pitch, you want to set the next one up. I know for me when i had a batter 0-2, I would try and throw the nastiest slider to get the swing and miss. A majority of the time I left it hanging and it was crushed, I consider this a mental mistake because instead of focusing on hitting a spot I tried to do more than I was capable of.

quote:
Most players that want to succeed and win put enough pressure on themselves already.


You really nailed it head on with this quote. I feel some of the most competitive players out there are their own worst critics. After making an error no one feels worse, or more upset than these kind of players and these are the kind of guys I would want on my team. The kind of player whose standard is perfect and anything less is not tolerable.
D danramosd10+ posts
@hsballcoach
quote:
When I do, the boys know they pushed way too far.

I feel this way is very effective in getting your point across to players.

Players shouldn't be playing not to fail, they should be playing to succeed. It can really mess with a kid when they are scared to make an error and get yelled at.

quote:
Running, conditioning should never be used as punishment

I would have to agree with this also. Running and conditioning are done to improve a player, shouldn't be used to discipline. If you want to discipline the player, give him a responsibility (ie carry the ball bag, bring the helmets, rake the field) or better yet, take away their playing time.
Bulldog 19Bulldog 195,000+ posts
~ Success is not built on success. It's built on failure. It's built on frustration. Sometimes its built on catastrophe. ~ Sumner Redstone


Players have to fail in order to succeed. They need to learn from mistakes. Physical errors happen especially when they're going 100%. Mental errors are the ones that they need to figure out..
coach2709coach270910,000+ posts
Good stuff here but I am a yeller and screamer. But I also yell and scream on pretty much everything.....in practice. Also, I've stopped yelling and screaming as much as I used to. When I started coaching I was young and VERY dumb. I took over a team that was terrible with terrible attitudes towards winning - they wanted to win but didn't know how. I felt my biggest thing to do was to change that and mistakes were not tolerated. To nobody's surprise I created a tense atmosphere as the guys - who were young too being mostly sophomores - were scared to mess up. That being said we ended up with a great season but I don't know if it's because of the raised expectations, constant demand that they perform or what. But looking back on that season even with the success I didn't like the atmosphere I created.

I'm a totally different coach now although I still yell but instead of just start out yelling for mental mistakes I have levels the guys go through to reach that. They know each level because I tell them what to look for. First level on a mental mistake I just give them a "come on, let's go", second level is a hand on a hip / lean on the fungo bat stare that is pretty obvious that I'm not happy with where they are, third level is I'll stop the drill and talk to them that where they are is not acceptable and they need to fix it and then fourth if they haven't caught on by then I will rip them as a group and as individuals.

Now when we do good stuff there are no levels - I yell and scream right now about how good they did. I realized that if you're going to rip then you better praise and it's better if it's equal or lean towards praise. Quick funny story - one day in practice we were in a zone with our defensive drill and my guys were making plays left and right. Each play resulted in me giving them "atta boys" and it evolved into a "WHOOOO". Next thing you know the rest of the team was doing the "WHOOO - atta boy". Beside our field was a little league field and there was a team practicing. Next thing you know these little leauge kids were doing the "WHOOO - atta boy" when they made plays on their field. It sorta became a competition between the two fields on making plays. I kept doing the drill an extra 10 - 15 minutes just because it was awesome what we were doing with the little league team.

I strongly believe that praise is what allows players / teams the ability to move mountains but holding them to a high accountability is what gives them the motivation to do it. I have found that the end result where I yell and scream (good and bad) is what holds them accountable.

Whenever I do rip a player or team it will be in practice and I will always follow it up before we leave with a reassurance meeting. I talk to them and let them know I still care about them, have faith in them and let them know I have high standards and they need to meet them. It helps to bring us back to balance. During a game I will only rip those that will respond to that technique. If it's one of those guys who won't respond then I talk to them one on one.

Another thing is let your guys know if they are having a bad day to let you know. They may be having trouble at home, with girlfriend, in a class or whatever but if they let me know ahead of time I'm not going to rip them. If that kid gets in a drill and is doing terrible I just get them out and let them gather their thoughts while we continue on. Then once they have a chance to gather themself they hop back in. This teaches them to avoid high school drama. Bad things happen but the world doesn't stop just because you feel bad. You are still responsible for your own effort and attitude.

As for physical mistakes we got a saying "you don't get better by going to the back of the line". In other words when you mess up in a drill get back up there and do it again. If you go back of the line then you missed a chance to get better. We got a bucket of 3 or 4 dozen balls so we can pick that one up later. Get back up, do it again and fix what's wrong.

I've used Coach May's method of sitting a player but I think it's a very last ditch effort to create change. I think this kid is the best possible choice for that position. If he's in there it gives us our best chance to win as a team. But if he's not getting the job done for whatever reason then that means I made a mistake. Now it's time to make a change and go with someone else. I tell my guys all the time "If me yelling at you is the worst thing to ever happen to you then you have lived a great life". I would rather yell at someone to create change than to sit someone and possibly lower our chances to win. But it's a tough thing to do but it can be done.

Regardless of what you do or how you do it - it will only be successful if your kids truly believe that you trust them, have faith in them and care about them.
S schwammi100+ posts
I yell, but do so to accentuate the positive, rarely if ever negative. For example, guy's been playing LF and has not figured out that he has back up responsibilities on a ball hit to the RF corner. Three times I quietly talk to him about the play after the inning. Last week, same play but this time he is in the right spot. I yell "Hey JOHNNY!". He looks at me in a total panic (as does most of the team) and I say "I saw that, NICE JOB!". Kid turns and runs back to his normal spot with a huge smile. The light bulb went on and I caught it! Now, that play is routine for him.

Similar play, we're on offense at a key point. Need a sac bunt and guess who is at the plate? Yup, the guy struggling the most with bunting. I give the sign, he drops the bunt, runner advances, perfect play. As the kid trots back to the dugout I scream "JOHNNY"...he stops and looks at me (as do many of the parents) and I say "Perfect...well done!". At that moment, he knows how much I appreciate how much work he has put into improving his game and how much it meant to the team.

It takes a few weeks to get used to playing for me, but once you understand and can acknowledge the message with that wry little smile, you realize it's all good.

Now, there is one last piece of the puzzle here. Right after I acknowledge some great learning moment in the field, I can turn to the "strugglers" on the bench and say "did you guys see that, it was awesome". They learn by a positive example of what is accepted rather than me screaming at them for what they are not doing! It is subtle, but they learn by emulating great moments rather than being told how they are living out bad ones.

So, yes, I scream, but rarely in disgust. I teach quietly, make subtle corrections, and celebrate our achievements and growth. And at the end of the day, every player that I coach knows that every action I take is to make them better as a player and as a person. Who could ask for more?
trojan-skippertrojan-skipper1,000+ posts
Great stuff here.... Love the whooo, atta boy story. My high school coach ran us for every little thing, errors, wild pitches, lost games, etc. When I was in college my coaches would look at bad play and devise drills to work on that.... I felt like a baseball player, I stayed late and went early to work on my game, I didn't leave practice feeling bad.
Coach_MayCoach_May10,000+ posts
Like the old saying "there is more than one way to skin a cat." Every coach is different and there are a lot of different styles. And each player is different as well. I know I have changed over the years. I do some things now I didn't do 20 years ago. And I don't do some things I did 20 years ago. We learn and we grow along the way. What works coaching 9-10 year olds may not work with 17-18 year olds. As long as your out there doing your best to help the players be the best they can be and your heart is in the right place everything will work out just fine.
GunEmDown10GunEmDown101,000+ posts
Interesting post... IMO, good coaches don't yell, they don't have too. Dog cussing players, throwing helmets and huffing/puffing like a madman. Yep, that's the way to get 17 year old kids to respect you and go to battle for you. Once you lose your temper, you've lost control of the situation. And, yelling at players during a game that is designed around failure is monumentally ridiculous.

A good coach recognizes and exploits his teams strengths, coaching the kids he has. Not a player he wishes he had.

GED10DaD
Last edited by GunEmDown10
H hsballcoach100+ posts
quote:
do not do what they are supposed to do


I understand your point Will, but my question is...if he is not doing what he is supposed to do, why is he out there for a game winning situation? Does he know what he is supposed to do? If he can't physically do it, why is he playing in that position? If he knows, but won't then again why is he out there?
Playing some Devil's advocate.
B bsballfan100+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by hsballcoach:
quote:
do not do what they are supposed to do


I understand your point Will, but my question is...if he is not doing what he is supposed to do, why is he out there for a game winning situation? Does he know what he is supposed to do? If he can't physically do it, why is he playing in that position? If he knows, but won't then again why is he out there?
Playing some Devil's advocate.


Because he may not be good enough for the situation, but he's the best I got?
Coach BobCoach Bob500+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by coach2709:
Good stuff here but I am a yeller and screamer. But I also yell and scream on pretty much everything.....in practice. Also, I've stopped yelling and screaming as much as I used to. When I started coaching I was young and VERY dumb. I took over a team that was terrible with terrible attitudes towards winning - they wanted to win but didn't know how. I felt my biggest thing to do was to change that and mistakes were not tolerated. To nobody's surprise I created a tense atmosphere as the guys - who were young too being mostly sophomores - were scared to mess up. That being said we ended up with a great season but I don't know if it's because of the raised expectations, constant demand that they perform or what. But looking back on that season even with the success I didn't like the atmosphere I created.

I'm a totally different coach now although I still yell but instead of just start out yelling for mental mistakes I have levels the guys go through to reach that. They know each level because I tell them what to look for. First level on a mental mistake I just give them a "come on, let's go", second level is a hand on a hip / lean on the fungo bat stare that is pretty obvious that I'm not happy with where they are, third level is I'll stop the drill and talk to them that where they are is not acceptable and they need to fix it and then fourth if they haven't caught on by then I will rip them as a group and as individuals.

Now when we do good stuff there are no levels - I yell and scream right now about how good they did. I realized that if you're going to rip then you better praise and it's better if it's equal or lean towards praise. Quick funny story - one day in practice we were in a zone with our defensive drill and my guys were making plays left and right. Each play resulted in me giving them "atta boys" and it evolved into a "WHOOOO". Next thing you know the rest of the team was doing the "WHOOO - atta boy". Beside our field was a little league field and there was a team practicing. Next thing you know these little leauge kids were doing the "WHOOO - atta boy" when they made plays on their field. It sorta became a competition between the two fields on making plays. I kept doing the drill an extra 10 - 15 minutes just because it was awesome what we were doing with the little league team.

I strongly believe that praise is what allows players / teams the ability to move mountains but holding them to a high accountability is what gives them the motivation to do it. I have found that the end result where I yell and scream (good and bad) is what holds them accountable.

Whenever I do rip a player or team it will be in practice and I will always follow it up before we leave with a reassurance meeting. I talk to them and let them know I still care about them, have faith in them and let them know I have high standards and they need to meet them. It helps to bring us back to balance. During a game I will only rip those that will respond to that technique. If it's one of those guys who won't respond then I talk to them one on one.

Another thing is let your guys know if they are having a bad day to let you know. They may be having trouble at home, with girlfriend, in a class or whatever but if they let me know ahead of time I'm not going to rip them. If that kid gets in a drill and is doing terrible I just get them out and let them gather their thoughts while we continue on. Then once they have a chance to gather themself they hop back in. This teaches them to avoid high school drama. Bad things happen but the world doesn't stop just because you feel bad. You are still responsible for your own effort and attitude.

As for physical mistakes we got a saying "you don't get better by going to the back of the line". In other words when you mess up in a drill get back up there and do it again. If you go back of the line then you missed a chance to get better. We got a bucket of 3 or 4 dozen balls so we can pick that one up later. Get back up, do it again and fix what's wrong.

I've used Coach May's method of sitting a player but I think it's a very last ditch effort to create change. I think this kid is the best possible choice for that position. If he's in there it gives us our best chance to win as a team. But if he's not getting the job done for whatever reason then that means I made a mistake. Now it's time to make a change and go with someone else. I tell my guys all the time "If me yelling at you is the worst thing to ever happen to you then you have lived a great life". I would rather yell at someone to create change than to sit someone and possibly lower our chances to win. But it's a tough thing to do but it can be done.

Regardless of what you do or how you do it - it will only be successful if your kids truly believe that you trust them, have faith in them and care about them.


Was looking for some positive words on HSBBW to get over the hump on a player discipline issue and found this thread.

Thanks Coach2709 for the year and a half old wisdom that is still highly valuable!!!
coach2709coach270910,000+ posts
Coach Bob I'm really glad this post was able to help you out some. I wish I could take full credit for the things I do but I have been around some great baseball people and stole their stuff like crazy. Between playing for, coaching with and going to clinics I've been exposed to some very knowledgeable people cause if it was up to me to get the job done it might be ugly. Plus, I've been very, very fortunate to have some great people play for me.

Best of luck to you and I hope your season ends with a lot of wins.
Low FinishLow Finish500+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by coach2709:
Coach Bob I'm really glad this post was able to help you out some. I wish I could take full credit for the things I do but I have been around some great baseball people and stole their stuff like crazy. Between playing for, coaching with and going to clinics I've been exposed to some very knowledgeable people cause if it was up to me to get the job done it might be ugly. Plus, I've been very, very fortunate to have some great people play for me.

Best of luck to you and I hope your season ends with a lot of wins.


I will honestly say (in terms of coaching material) you post some of the best stuff on this site.
coach2709coach270910,000+ posts
Thank you very much and I really appreciate it. To be honest I'm liking a lot of stuff you post in the hitting forum. I usually stay away from that forum because it typically turns in a "using the bathroom" contest to where you don't get anything positive from it. But from what I've read you don't take that approach and have some good stuff.

Add Reply

Post

Membership Required

We're sorry. You must be signed in to continue. Sign In or Register
×
Are you sure you want to remove from your Block List?
×
Loading...
×
When you block a person, they can no longer invite you to a private message or post to your profile wall. Replies and comments they make will be collapsed/hidden by default. Finally, you'll never receive email notifications about content they create or likes they designate for your content.
Note: if you proceed, you will no longer be following .
×
Advanced Search
Advanced Search
Link copied to your clipboard.
×