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Some observations from just another youth baseball tournament…


I do occasional contract work as site supervisor for one of the large youth tournament organizations. I thought I’d share some stories from this weekend that tie into the normal HSBBW dialog.


This particular tournament - teams across ages 9-18 at several facilities around the area. I had a 3-field facility with 11U’s.


Baseball players and baseball people are generally very good people. It’s those rare few that make for good discussion topics.
This particular event pulls teams locally and from three different directions/regions. Every year, each day, particularly half way thru Sunday, there is a group of parents that are getting a bit hammered out beyond the OF fences. That group is always from the same direction/region. Really? You have an 11 y.o. son playing in a baseball tourney and this is the parental support and example you choose to put forth? You can’t at least wait until the evening at the hotel? Guess which teams/games end up with vocal controversy toward the end of Sunday? The teams get banned. Other teams from the same region end up showing up. Same results. No, these are not the same players/parents… I’m talking about a consistent 12 year history.


Players continue to show up more and more polished. 11u bodies are still largely undeveloped so it was particularly interesting watching this group execute solid fundamentals but their physical bodies not always allowing what their trained brains are telling them.


There were really good swings up and down the lineups. Despite solid pitching, there weren’t many overmatched hitters.  As this trend continues, I suspect it becomes more and more difficult to stand out as a position player and the premium for top arms with both velo and stuff continues to grow.


A team will not make it to the end of Sunday in the champ bracket without pitching depth. What I find interesting here is that this applies to all levels of baseball – but slightly less so for MLB, where if you can make it to the playoffs, you can get by with two hot hands on the mound because of the format and number of days that the playoffs get stretched out.


Parent of the Weekend - I had one parent who I bent over backwards to accommodate with special requests early on (allowing a banner that he knew darn well shouldn’t be there, making exception with parking a large RV, etc.). This guy was clearly an educated, well off individual, diplomatic, engaging, handled himself well and knew how to go about gaining the favorable treatment. Must be a good dad, I thought. Later Sunday, as I made my rounds, I passed this same guy sitting in the outfield watching a game. Totally different demeanor… “Jesus $%&$, don’t you guys have a mower? Look at that infield grass.” I continued on and found a spot on the fence to watch this game for a while. Turns out his kid is pitching. Getting lit up… lots of hits and some not-so-great support behind him. He was going off. Yelling louder and louder at the whole field… “It’s not your fault son, someone needs to start giving you some help behind you!” He literally got up and stormed around in circles, throwing his hat down several times, kicking his chair. “Don’t worry, son, at some point, this jerk will start calling strikes.” That poor kid, I thought.


Overall, the coaching was great. You cannot have enough teams at these early ages without heavy parent involvement. Some of those dad coaches were players, knew what they were doing and provided a good blend of coaching and guidance. Some of the support dads were clearly not players and were unknowingly giving out misguided advice. But they were there, supporting and helping. All of these kids playing were doing just fine navigating the good advice from the misguided. If you are one of those dads, good for you. But, maybe , let your kid warm up with one of the players instead of you. And give more attention to the other players than your son. Don’t feel like you have the liberty of yelling at your kid because he is yours and don’t give him more extensive verbal cues than others. Treat him like you do every other player on the team. Your kid will benefit from it. You get plenty of time with him outside of the team setting. If you are a parent that is just a spectator, don’t worry about the dad coaches. Your kid will be fine.


One coach gave me the speech about his speech… when he puts his team together, he instructs all players and parents that he doesn’t care about winning – that if that’s what they are focused on, they should find another team. Well, a large part of me agrees with the principle behind this, particularly at this age. But, the reality is, if you don’t strike a balance and make sure you have players that will help you compete and win your share at these events, you will get your butt handed to you regularly and it will not be a fun playing experience OR learning experience for the boys.


You can spot players who are gamers in about five seconds. They come in ALL shapes and sizes at this age. LOVE watching them.


Oh yeah, the topic title…
With each event, I come away with some small quirky thing that sticks with me. Remember, 11u this time. There were four occasions when I saw different dads tying their kids shoes for them. I’m talking the 11u players, not younger siblings. Once, it was a coach with his runner at 3rd base. Once it was a dad with the kid sitting on the back hatch of an SUV before a game. Never was it a scenario where there was time urgency. COME ON, DADS! Think about it. The kid can tie his own d@MM shoes. What little things are you doing for your kids that might be a sign that you are coddling them along too much? BTW, NONE of these kids getting their shoes tied were gamers.

Last edited by cabbagedad
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This is a great post.  It is a crazy wild west world out there in Travel Ball land.   I have seen similar things myself.

Two things you said really stood out to me:

"There were really good swings up and down the lineups. Despite solid pitching, there weren’t many overmatched hitters.  As this trend continues, I suspect it becomes more and more difficult to stand out as a position player and the premium for top arms with both velo and stuff continues to grow."

I think that is very true, and even is reflected at the MLB level.  Very very few hitters traded at the deadline this year.   Every team is stocked with great young hitters.   Every team needs more pitching.

"“It’s not your fault son, someone needs to start giving you some help behind you!” He literally got up and stormed around in circles, throwing his hat down several times, kicking his chair. “Don’t worry, son, at some point, this jerk will start calling strikes.” That poor kid, I thought.

I see that a lot, at every age level, especially high school Varsity in some ways.   It is always someone else's fault.   It is always "not fair" when a kid sits the bench.  Despite the advances in athleticism and hitting/throwing mechanics, far too often the younger generation is entitled.   Very very difficult to develop a work ethic and the mental toughness to last in the game of Baseball when everything isn't your fault.

The Travel Ball world is really kind of insane.  The emphasis on measureables at the high school/Showcase level is understandable but bizarre.   You go to a tryout or a Showcase and stand around for 3 hours, during which in that time you run a sixty, get 5 ground balls and throw across the infield, take 3 to 5 swings off a tee, maybe get 5 BP swings and somehow you are then judged as to how good of a Baseball player you are.   And then it is a roll of the dice as to whether your Travel Team will play you much, or figure out the best position for your development, or be competitive in the "right" tournaments etc.  To navigate your way through such a strange system to try to reach your goals really requires some dedication that is best not burdened by entitlement.

3and2Fastball posted:

This is a great post.  It is a crazy wild west world out there in Travel Ball land.   I have seen similar things myself.

Two things you said really stood out to me:

"There were really good swings up and down the lineups. Despite solid pitching, there weren’t many overmatched hitters.  As this trend continues, I suspect it becomes more and more difficult to stand out as a position player and the premium for top arms with both velo and stuff continues to grow."

I think that is very true, and even is reflected at the MLB level.  Very very few hitters traded at the deadline this year.   Every team is stocked with great young hitters.   Every team needs more pitching.

"“It’s not your fault son, someone needs to start giving you some help behind you!” He literally got up and stormed around in circles, throwing his hat down several times, kicking his chair. “Don’t worry, son, at some point, this jerk will start calling strikes.” That poor kid, I thought.

I see that a lot, at every age level, especially high school Varsity in some ways.   It is always someone else's fault.   It is always "not fair" when a kid sits the bench.  Despite the advances in athleticism and hitting/throwing mechanics, far too often the younger generation is entitled.   Very very difficult to develop a work ethic and the mental toughness to last in the game of Baseball when everything isn't your fault.

The Travel Ball world is really kind of insane.  The emphasis on measureables at the high school/Showcase level is understandable but bizarre.   You go to a tryout or a Showcase and stand around for 3 hours, during which in that time you run a sixty, get 5 ground balls and throw across the infield, take 3 to 5 swings off a tee, maybe get 5 BP swings and somehow you are then judged as to how good of a Baseball player you are.   And then it is a roll of the dice as to whether your Travel Team will play you much, or figure out the best position for your development, or be competitive in the "right" tournaments etc.  To navigate your way through such a strange system to try to reach your goals really requires some dedication that is best not burdened by entitlement.

Giving your son an excuse-umps, teammates, sun, wet field, has a cold, whatever-gives your son an excuse to not compete.

cabbagedad posted:


Oh yeah, the topic title…
With each event, I come away with some small quirky thing that sticks with me. Remember, 11u this time. There were four occasions when I saw different dads tying their kids shoes for them. I’m talking the 11u players, not younger siblings. Once, it was a coach with his runner at 3rd base. Once it was a dad with the kid sitting on the back hatch of an SUV before a game. Never was it a scenario where there was time urgency. COME ON, DADS! Think about it. The kid can tie his own d@MM shoes. What little things are you doing for your kids that might be a sign that you are coddling them along too much? BTW, NONE of these kids getting their shoes tied were gamers.

16U Travel/Showcase - WWBA - One of NTGson's former teammates made move to another organization for the usual reasons - we saw them in the parking lot at a remote field - this kid is stretching with dad while mom is not just tying shoes, but actually removing slides, putting shoes on his feet and then tying them.

Kid went on to a very successful D1 mid-major from high school but didn't last through his freshman season. Mom wasn't there to take care of him.

Think I could write a book about this subject.  I realize that the majority of everyone that posts here is a parent.  Some parents have it figured out, while others just don't get it.

When talking to college coaches or MLB scouts the same topics are almost always brought up. Player, Parents, Grades. I can tell you that some parents have cost their sons some great opportunities.  Funny thing is, those same parents don't even realize it.

You have the parents no one wants to be around.  You have the parents that try to market or sell.  You have the parents that try to become overly friendly.  You have the parents that bombard you with questions you don't want to answer.  You have parents that are full of excuses.  You have the parents that baby their son.  You have parents that complain about anything and everything... That one is is a big warning sign!

So what is the best approach dealing with coaches and scouts?  Ignore them completely unless they want to talk to you.  Be supportive, but don't make it so obvious who your son is. Understand that these people may or may not be interested in your son.  Only if they are interested is when they pay attention to the parents unless the parent has already made a fool out of themselves.  I love it when I can't tell who a good players parent is until I ask.

When you have to ask, are your parents here?  That is what you're looking for.  That is the parent that gets it.  I've seen people at games and asked them if they have a son playing.  Then they respond with something like yes he is the catcher, nothing more... I love it!  Others see a recruiter or scout and it interrupts what he is doing, as they hand him a folder full of information about their son.  That followed by a long description of all his accomplishments and  goals.  The folder full of Little League accomplishments, how great a kid he is, all the things he does to help the elderly, his projected size, he has an uncle that played pro baseball, and a bunch of other stuff that doesn't much matter.  Please understand that these things often become internal jokes as coaches talk to each other.  Seldom do they get this when it involves the best players.  It's always best when they ask for information.  A college coach might be very polite because he is representing his college.  But don't kid yourself into thinking he is enjoying the fact that you are keeping him from doing what he is there for.  It might involve your son and it might not.  They know what they want when they see it.

Best way to contact recruiters is before an event.  That should be done by the player, not the parents.  A simple.. I'm interested in your college and I am playing in this tournament for such and such team.

There is the player and the parent... Scouts and college coaches determine their interest in the player.  Their are some parents that can change that interest, depending on how talented the player is.  There are some parents that can even eliminate that interest. More than once I have asked if a college coach is on a certain player... I will hear different answers like... No grades.   And more than once I have heard... He is very good, but No, I wouldn't want that dad to be anywhere around our program.  People that bitch about every little thing and are never satisfied, tend to always bitch about things and are never satisfied.  They can be extra high maintenance and create problems for a baseball coach.  Why take that risk unless you believed the player would be your best player.

I suppose some people won't get all of this or even believe it.  That's OK TIFWIW, Its not like anything is going to change people.

 

Last edited by PGStaff

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