You make the call...

in seco d situation i would say ball is dead once it hits the batter and play stop meaning he is out

My $.02:
Neither. In both circumstances, it's an immediate dead ball.
In both cases, the call is "Dead ball" (runners return to original bases). If the ump judges that the batter offered, then a strike is added to the count.

That's my take. Others may have better.

FWIW, what was the result of the protest of #1?

What many do not realize is that you can have a strike without a swing even though the pitched ball hits the batter. If the pitch crosses the strike zone and hits the batter, it is still a strike, whether he swings or not. You see it a lot when batters are ducking the pitch or have their hands in the strike zone.

El is correct - and I've seen this one too frequently lately, with batters leaning in so far that body parts and/or uniforms are already in the strike zone, getting hbp, and trotting up to 1st instead of hearing "strike". Poor umpiring.

gotyta bringgnup ythe old..."hand is part of th bat argument" - was alwaysntold iff someone argued that to hand then the bat tyhen tell tem to let go and see if the bat falls to the ground

In #2, I am not sure why he would be considered out. That puzzles me.

quote:

Originally posted by redbird5:
In #2, I am not sure why he would be considered out. That puzzles me.

Redbird, He is out because of a weird little rule not usually seen. MLB rule 6.05(f). "A batter is out when - . . . (f) He attempts to hit a third strike and the ball touches him."

So my vote is the umpire made the correct call.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by NOVABBall13:First one was when a batter swung at a pitch and "hit" the ball with his wrist. He immediately dropped to the ground and grabbed his wrist. The ball was a slow roller to the pitcher, who fielded it and threw it to first. Umpire called the batter out at first. There were runners on base who advanced on the hit. Was the call correct?/QUOTE]

El Gato's statement re the batter being hit in the strike zone is a true statement but may not be addressing the siuation posited. Not enough facts are given. How many strikes were on the batter when he swung at the pitched ball? If there were 2, then the call was correct. If there were less than 2, then the call was not correct. I believe the rule to be applied is in MLB 6.08(b). "The batter becomes a runner and is entitled to first base . . . when . . . (b)He is touched by a pitched ball which he is notattempting to hit . . ." Here the batter WAS attempting to hit the pitch. So then the next question is what happens when he is attempting to hit the pitch. The APPROVED RULING following the rule states: "When the batter is touched by a pitched ball which does not entitle him to first base, the ball is dead and no runner may advance." So, if it was not the third strike, it should have been a strike and a dead ball.

From what I know and what the umps standing around behind the backstop came up with (real umps, not the Dad umps hahaha) was that call number one was incorrect. Ball was a dead ball, batter was out on strikes since there were two strikes to begin with, and the runners go back to their original bases.

The second call the ump got it right. He called the batter out on strikes and a deadball. The Dad umps on the other team were pretty mad since they thought that he could run to first with two outs on a passed ball and they were doing a lot of yelling. LOL

Just thought that those were some interesting plays...

So Novaball, sounds like I gave the same answers as the real umps standing behind the backstop (except I had to address both 2 strike situation and the less than 2 strike situation, info you did not include in your statement of facts.) Are you giving out a prize?

quote:

Originally posted by NOVABBall13:
He called the batter out on strikes and a deadball. The Dad umps on the other team were pretty mad since they thought that he could run to first with two outs on a passed ball and they were doing a lot of yelling. LOL

Not to be too much of an OOF, but #2 should've been "dead ball", then "Strike" (in this case, S3, you're out).

NFHS 7-2/Art. 1 "A strike is charged to the batter when: /b "a pitch is struck at and missed (even if the pitch touches the batter".

[/QUOTE]

Not to be too much of an OOF, but #2 should've been "dead ball", then "Strike" (in this case, S3, you're out).
[/QUOTE]

Actually I think that he got it right because he swung and missed at the ball as it was breaking down, it then stuck the dirt and bounced off his knee. So he had technically struck out already at that point.

WB Reporter - No prize. You just get to attend your next game with the knowledge that you probably know more than most of the Dad Umps who are standing behind the backstop questioning each and every doggone pitch... LOL (Probably you already knew that. hahaha)

And for the record, does it bother anyone else that some Dads feel the need to stand behind the backstop and tell the umpire that they have "missed every call" or that "you're calling that a strike on our guys"?

My other axe I would grind are the parents who make an excuse each and every time their kid makes a mistake. Dang... They make mistakes people! That's why they are amateurs...

And please, for crying out loud, stop coaching your kid when he is at the plate. If he does not know not to step in the bucket by the time he is at the varsity level then he is surely not going to learn it by you yelling it at him while he is trying to bat... No matter how badly you want him to get the game winning hit...

There... Rant over. LOL

quote:

Originally posted by NOVABBall13:

Not to be too much of an OOF, but #2 should've been "dead ball", then "Strike" (in this case, S3, you're out).
[/QUOTE]

Actually I think that he got it right because he swung and missed at the ball as it was breaking down, it then stuck the dirt and bounced off his knee. So he had technically struck out already at that point.[/QUOTE]

Yes, he had struck at the ball, but the correct mechanic is to kill the play. If not, you've runners going, defensive players not sure what's happening, etc. It's best to just "shut it down" ASAP. /OOF mode off...

As far as behind the fence - Seems to me that many newer facilities were/are built to avoid this w/press boxes or other structures right behind HP.

Jess1

They are, but our Dad Umps have decided that the one foot between the backstop and the press box is plenty of room for them to stand and chirp. Myself, I am just amazed that the umps don't walk back and ask them to move.

quote:

Originally posted by NOVABBall13:
Jess1

They are, but our Dad Umps have decided that the one foot between the backstop and the press box is plenty of room for them to stand and chirp. Myself, I am just amazed that the umps don't walk back and ask them to move.

Wow. FWIW, the umpire should be doing just that (IIRC, 2/12.3???). Truly bizzare, and it's a shame some folks won't let the game play out...