11.7

I don't know first hand what the detailed breakout is at most schools but I do hear often that MANY schools are not fully funded, thus do not have a full 11.7 to offer.  Other things to factor in - pitchers get the lions share of offers more than 25% and I would venture a guess that pretty much every D1 recruit (and parent) considers himself an "elite" player.

Interesting analysis.  Well thought out.  Two comments.

1.  You probably need separate charts for in state and out of state recruits.  The distribution will be markedly different.

2.  I doubt that more that 100 of the approx 300 D1 schools actually fund 11.7 scholarships.   

My understanding from those who seem to know on this site is that in or out of state does not matter.

Another thing to consider is then even fully funded programs (having all 11.7) don't necessarily give the max 27 players scholarships.  Some schools may only carry 15-20 players on scholarship and make-up the remainder of their rosters with preferred walk-ons and legacy players (with parents who can afford full tuition).

Many layers to the onion...

What would be the make up of the 11 players getting 50%+?

Hypothetically, of course...

8 Pitchers, 1 Center Fielder, 1 Short Stop + 1 Catcher?

CatsPop, others,

I believe that JP's analysis is probably not that far off at least as a starting point. There is probably a lot of variability year to year. You also have academic, need based, and grants that help fund players. I also agree that an elite player should be getting at least 50%, but most of these are pitchers. I don't think you will see 8 pitchers getting 50% however, maybe 4-5 in top programs. I have also heard of some programs giving all (or most) of their money to pitchers as a philosophy.  

I'm fairly certain that NCAA rules require the scholarships to be divided among 27 players....the remaining7 or 8 are walk ons

Up to 27 may be offered athletic scholarship money. The offer must be at least 25%. A program could give eleven full and two 35% if they wanted. I remember a coach coming into the ACC a few years ago saying he was giving the 11.7 to the top eighteen to twenty players.

just slightly off subject, but at least the right crew is in the thread.....

how much does a school's offer consider the parents ability/willingness to pay?  also the kid's desire to attend the school?  I guess I'm really asking how close is it to a poker game....

In our case, the coach wouldn't have known what we could afford...it never came up.  I do think my son got less baseball money because of his good grades than he may have if he hadn't been getting a nice amount of academic money.  My son called the coach and was offered on the phone.  Coach made sure to tell him how much academic money he had coming based on his grades...and figured that into the "total" percentage that he told my son he was getting....though the baseball percentage was made very clear first. 

Expect human nature to reign supreme.

Being limited in DI to 11.7 scholarships makes every dollar in the scholarship budget precious. Accordingly, coaches will do their best to assess a player's ability to cover the portion of the costs not covered by the athletic scholarship, as well as his apparent inclination to attend the college. Of course, there are additional, significant considerations; not the least of which are the coaches' assessment of their upcoming needs at various positions and their evaluation of each recruit's degree of fit with that needs assessment.

ok Buckeye and Prepster....that all makes sense.

If you file for financial aid / academic money, aren't your income, assets and liabilities exposed to the school / coach?

How does this work with respect to timing?  Since most offers are made before applications for financial aid are made (as far as I can tell), is parents financial information discussed in the verbal offer stage with the coach?

In our son's case, the coach made it clear that he had nothing to do with academic or need based aid during the offer meeting. 

I'm sure it's different at every school and depends a lot on the personality of the coach.

It's been known to come up; usually in the informal back-and-forth exchange that often precedes an offer. The subject can also come up in discussions with those who know the players' families well (i.e. travel team, Legion, and high school coaches).

I've never sought confirmation of this, but it's always been my understanding that the coaches are not allowed to view the financial information submitted to the Student Aid Office.

Sure they would....but in our case, the offer was made before he had applied to the school...and income or ability to pay was never mentioned in any of our conversations before the offer was made

The 11.7 baseball scholarships is only part of the equation that coaches are considering when looking at recruits.  While they may not have access to a recruits financial details, they do try to asses the family's ability to pay AND the recruits grades are a factor along these lines.  A coach will often look at his existing players to see if any of them can continue on without using any of the baseball scholarship pool (e.g. academic or hardship scholarships).  In the past, it has not be unusual for a coach to get together with his upcoming sophomore player to try and maintain players financial support, but through other means so that the coach is able to spread more of the baseball scholarships around.   Of course, with something like a 4 year guaranteed scholarship contract, the coach's options would be more limited.

At times, the recruit's financial circumstances don't make any difference. The coach is staring at a finite amount of money to allot, and it's either enough or not.

I thought the 11.7 had to be distributed among 27 players. Understand now, that's the max. Thanks.

Follow-up: Current verbal offer from major D1 out-of-state "State U" is being stated in dollar figures, not percentages -- and specifically broken out between baseball and academic money - to the penny. No discussion about needs-based dollars at all, but frankly, that's a non-issue anyway, given FASFA thresholds.

From reading through old threads, a couple things I've concluded. Again, friends ... keep me in check:

1. It's time for me to talk with the coach, now that specific dollars are being discussed with my son. I haven't yet.

2. I need to know if the dollar offer would change if tuition and other costs go up before the 2016-17 season. TPM made the point in a thread awhile back that a percentage offer is best for this reason. My guess is the answer will be no.

In many cases, the dollar amount provided in subsequent years will have more to do with the player's performance level and resulting contribution to the team than it will factors like changes in the school's costs.

thanks. i'm actually referring to costs rising before he attends.

Percentage, always go for the percentage due to rising costs.  On of the pitfalls of early committal keep in mind that if tuition rises the money given to him will not. There might be a significant jump in a year or two from now. Make sure that you get clarification.  

I think that you did a good job above, but I am very leary any coach gives out 100%. That may go to the top recruits that cant qualify for academic money.

Not to repeat whats been said but projected starting pitchers will always get the lions share of the 11.7. Top ss and catchers next. If you can play multiple positions and hit you might get more.  My son was an out of state recruit from a state where he got money for his grades so he was given nice money to leave the state.   But that was before the new guidelines for scholarships.

Ask if the school fully funds. Lots of programs do not.  And they do not have to award all 27 scholarships but if they do it has to be 25%. Correct me if I am wrong on this.

Inour out of state situation.Coach didn't and still doesn't know $ info on our end.Offer also does not include any grades$ or whatever he may qualify for. 

TPM thats correct.An  NCAA rule

Interesting that TPM cautions against early commitments. I agree, and wonder what y'all view as "early."

The summer after JP's freshman year he turned down an in-state verbal offer (interestingly, that big D1 appears to have more verbals today than they can realistically honor, but maybe they're all 25%. JP's wasn't.)

But now he's a junior. D1's are filling their rosters with verbals -- so he's anxious. Several of you have said "Never commit out of fear." That's great advice. But he badly wants to attend an out of state school with a top-notch baseball program, and getting in front of them, to the point where they might make an offer, is time-consuming and expensive.

So I guess my question is: For players that get lots of interest from all over, when is the best time to commit?

I don't mean to hijack a great thread subject, but to steer a little off course............so, NCAA baseball allows 11.7 for some 27-35 guys, right?  Yet NCAA basketball allows 13 for a roster of 15?????????????????

Can anyone explain this??

Picture 15-18 home basketball games selling out 15,000 seats at $25-40 per seat. It's why basketball has the scholarships it does.

There are some interesting dynamics at play in these scenarios. Using your numbers, if the coach offers the OOS kid 50%, that cuts deeper into his 11.7 limit, but the Bursar's office picks up an extra $5000 ($20K OOS vs $15K IS). It cost the school the same to educate either student athlete. To complicate the equation, does the OOS student athlete count against the state school's OOS cap percentage, and is that ever a factor?

Thx for the dollars and cents (sense?) explanations for the only 11.7 scholarships for baseball.

Regarding the idea of some players getting a full 100%:  I've heard one ACC coach say repeatedly that none of his players get 100% (he says).  He also says that he believes it important for every player to have some "skin in the game."  Meaning, if you are paying out of pocket some balance of tuition that you will appreciate the experience more.  That's what he said.

I could be wrong, but I believe I have heard this here before.  There are basically 2 things at play here.  The number of scholarships available and a coach's budget.  Let's say in-state cost of attendance is $20,000 per year and out of state attendance is $40,000 per year.  If a coach has a budget of $2,340,000, he could give scholarships to 11.7 in-state students.  Conversely, if he had a budget of $4,680,000, he could give scholarships to 11.7 out of state students.  In reality, a coach will have a budget somewhere in the middle and he needs to find a mix of in-state and out of state players that match his budget.  Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

That's all it is.. an "idea." There are virtually no full athletic scholarships in baseball.

Combinations of merit money and athletic dollars, yes. Full athletic, no.

It's simply too high a figure to award and have enough money remaining in the pool to attract recruits and reward deserving veterans.

Or that D1 football has 88 scholarships, and some of the recipients rarely gt on the field for a play.