2 or 3 outs? | High School Baseball Web

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HS rules. R1 on second, R2 on first, no outs. Batter hits fly ball to SS. Infield fly declared by both umpires. Batter runs and stops on first base. SS drops ball and it rolls to in front of the mound. R1 runs almost to third but stops. R2 touches and rounds second base and stops. R1 then retreats and passes R2 back to second base. R2 then retouches second base and retreats toward first. Umpire calles R1 out on passing the runner. Ball is picked up by catcher and thrown to first baseman where R2 is tagged. Umpire calls R2 out. Triple play. Would it not be a delayed dead ball after the R1 passes R2 and play end with 2 outs?

9/8/136:47 AM

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Michael S. Taylor1,000+ posts

It is not a dead ball at all so it is three outs.

9/8/139:15 AM

NewUmpire5,000+ posts

No delayed dead ball.. but in my opinion R1 can not be called out for passing the runner... he is the lead runner. When R1 retreated to 2nd and R2 was still between 2nd and 3rd, at that point R2 would be out for passing the runner. So R2 when retouching and retreating to first, can not be put out twice. This would only be if the ball was allowed to drop untouched by the SS. If the ball was intentionally dropped by the SS, then immediate dead ball, runners return to bases. But that is a judgement call... had to be there to call an intentional drop.

9/9/136:21 AM

noumpere1,000+ posts

Originally Posted by NewUmpire:

No delayed dead ball.. but in my opinion R1 can not be called out for passing the runner... he is the lead runner. When R1 retreated to 2nd and R2 was still between 2nd and 3rd, at that point R2 would be out for passing the runner. So R2 when retouching and retreating to first, can not be put out twice. This would only be if the ball was allowed to drop untouched by the SS. If the ball was intentionally dropped by the SS, then immediate dead ball, runners return to bases. But that is a judgement call... had to be there to call an intentional drop.

1 for 2 for newumpire.

You are correct that the trailing runner is out when a passing occurs, so R2 is out in this case. (And I hate the HS way of numbering the runners -- that might have contributed to the confusion here.) And that R2 cannot be out again when tagged.

You are incorrect that the ball would be dead if it was intentionally touched-and-dropped. Since the infield fly was in effect, that takes presedance and the ball remains live. see rule 5.1.1J exception

9/9/138:58 AM

Michael S. Taylor1,000+ posts

Originally Posted by noumpere:

Originally Posted by NewUmpire:

No delayed dead ball.. but in my opinion R1 can not be called out for passing the runner... he is the lead runner. When R1 retreated to 2nd and R2 was still between 2nd and 3rd, at that point R2 would be out for passing the runner. So R2 when retouching and retreating to first, can not be put out twice. This would only be if the ball was allowed to drop untouched by the SS. If the ball was intentionally dropped by the SS, then immediate dead ball, runners return to bases. But that is a judgement call... had to be there to call an intentional drop.

1 for 2 for newumpire.

You are correct that the trailing runner is out when a passing occurs, so R2 is out in this case. (And I hate the HS way of numbering the runners -- that might have contributed to the confusion here.) And that R2 cannot be out again when tagged.

You are incorrect that the ball would be dead if it was intentionally touched-and-dropped. Since the infield fly was in effect, that takes presedance and the ball remains live. see rule 5.1.1J exception

Good catch on the same runner out twice, I braincramped. However, noumpire is correct, with an IFF the intentional drop stays live.

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