2010 Player Who is Starting to Worry

Is there one coach you've worked with (either hs or summer) that could help you by writing e-mails and making calls?

I have a kid make out a list of the schools he wants me to contact; sometimes we have to edit the list because he has a school on there that is not realistic for his ability... then I have had good luck with talking to those folks...

Well the truth is I'm not really close with my HS coach and I don't think he's really going to make an effort to contact coaches for me. And my summer league coach doesn't have a whole lot of contacts.

big time D1 closer --- not a hard throwing righty?

The two don't match up on the surface. What would make you a top closer for a big time D1?

I didn't say a big time D1, they said a solid or decent D1. I'm not sure where they got that from either, I'm in the 83-86 range and I'm crafty with a tight change-up and hard breaking slider and I'm always in the strike zone.

quote:

I feel stronger on the mound though but I'm not a hard throwing righty that's going to get serious consideration. My question is, is this common? Can anyone out there give me some of their personal experiences like this and how it worked out for them, and what more can I be doing at this point?

I think you are going about this backwards. Start at the opposite end of the spectrum and perhaps a D1 will come along that also likes you. Waiting for the phone to ring could cost you a college baseball career.

D1's are looking for high 80's or low 90's right handers. Start eating six meals a day with protein shakes in between. That is something you can work on right away. Continue to build your arm strength via a solid long tossing regime. When you showcase, let the ball rip.

Take a map and contact/call every juco coach within a 100 mile radius. See if you can get them to attend one of your games and/or if you can visit them and tryout.

Do the same thing with all the D3 schools in your area. Virginia has some of the best D3's in the country.

While you are working on your strength, continue to showcase. Perhaps in your quest to find a program, a D1 will notice and make an offer. Rather than waiting for someone to recruit you, take the bull by the horns and recruit them. Each coach you come in contact with, ask them if they know of any other programs out there looking if they don't at first give you a favorable response. All these coaches talk and word of mouth can lead to opportunites. Refuse to give up. Think positive and it will happen for you.

Thanks Cleveland Dad, I don't want everyone to get the wrong impression, I'd love to play D1 baseball but it's not what is set in my mind. I was just giving that as an example of how some coaches feel about my skills. But like you said CD, I've been putting on good baseball muscle and my arm strength has improved a ton.

yeah man. I've been anxious as well. I finally got a call today. Like CD said you have to stay active in the recruiting process and don't just sit around waiting for a call.

I read a story on Legion ball in the Times-Dispatch yesterday, and there was a Legion coach -- a guy I knew well back in the day -- defending Legion against showcasing and travel ball, by saying "if you are talented they will find you."

Bunk!

If you're talented, get where you can show that talent off, so you don't get overlooked. And if indeed your talent is so great that you're attracting scouts like flies, make sure everyone knows about you so that you can expand your options and negotiate a stronger deal.

Riot, I have to agree that my first thought when I read your notes was, wow that's a skinny kid. That can be a good thing. If you're throwing that MPH at that weight, you could very well get into the 88-92 range with some core muscle weight added to your frame. So, get crackin' on a diet and exercise program to develop that.

If you're not aiming for high D-1, but are interested in mid-major or D-3 programs, don't panic. There are many mid-majors who wait for the smoke to clear after the November early signing period to really go after players. D-3's are known to make their evaluations often during a player's senior season. While I am often a defender of players getting themselves out there early, for where you are aiming, you are not at all too late.

But that's no reason to continue waiting around. Find yourself a fall showcase team and be active in identifying schools of interest and asking them to come see you play. If possible, get on a team going to Jupiter at the end of October -- you will not believe how many doors that can open. Even if all they let you do is throw 3 innings one time in the tourney it'll be worth the trip.

I see plenty of guys with stuff like what you describe pitching at mid-major D-1's, and a whole host of D-3's will love to have you. Just make sure they know you exist!

Thank you Midlo. I am pretty skinny but at the start of summer I was 130 :P haha

I've looked at my talent compared to some other players who I know are going to D-1 ACC programs and have decided that's probably not going to be the best fit for me. I would love to play at a mid-major and I think I have the ability if I can sell it to someone, which I'll definitely get started on. I'm also going to work on that fall showcase team like you said. Thank you

The talent level you describe yourself at is more likely to get offer(s) in the late signing period. Keep working hard at improving your velocity and your pitching.

What about a good D2 school? You have West Virginia State right next door. Head coach has been there 32 years. I was just on their website and it looks like a solid program.

PickOff, I'll check them out, I wasn't aware of a whole lot of D2's around my area. It's actually the level I'm best suited for.

Here is a link to the D2 Baseball site that lists all schools & conferences. http://www.siue.edu/ATHLETIC/d2/bb.html

There are some really good tough conferences in D2 especially in the South. Keep working on that conditioning and long toss!

Midlo--If a kid is a possible Div I, probably Div II, kind of player, would he be okay to simply wait until later in the process to concern himself with Div III teams? In other words, say he wants to go to Liberty or Mars Hill. He is pretty sure he can "walk on" at about any Div III around (say, Lynchburg). Why worry at all about Div III programs until at least the middle of his senior season. After all, all he really needs to do is work hard, play hard, and walk on at a Div III school if a I or II does not pick him up. Right? It just seems to me that if a kid is a standout HS varsity player, against good competition, he can play at nearly any Div III school. I don't get the Div III "recruiting" since there is no money there, and alot of good players who give up ball after HS could play at most Div III schools.

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Originally posted by isaacvanwart:
Midlo--If a kid is a possible Div I, probably Div II, kind of player, would he be okay to simply wait until later in the process to concern himself with Div III teams? In other words, say he wants to go to Liberty or Mars Hill. He is pretty sure he can "walk on" at about any Div III around (say, Lynchburg). Why worry at all about Div III programs until at least the middle of his senior season. After all, all he really needs to do is work hard, play hard, and walk on at a Div III school if a I or II does not pick him up. Right? It just seems to me that if a kid is a standout HS varsity player, against good competition, he can play at nearly any Div III school. I don't get the Div III "recruiting" since there is no money there, and alot of good players who give up ball after HS could play at most Div III schools.

Not sure you understand the D3 recruiting process all that well. Most that I am aware of recruit just like any other college. They also will fight like hell to get their kids academic money especially their star recruits. The process to get the money can take some time so to get that started early is a good thing. To assume you can just throw your hat in the ring with some of these programs would be a mistake. The competitive ones who take baseball seriously are always on the lookout for serious talent.

Regarding this young man, he has not heard from anyone yet. Nothing wrong with exploring non-D1 opportunities at this point to find if there might not be a fit at some other level. He does not need to commit at this early stage and most D3 coaches would understand that. On the other hand, if he waits until the last minute, he might not find the right academic/baseball fit he is looking for. I agree however that D3 committments generally happen later in the process. The winning programs are out there recruting heavy right now however.

Riot - one other thing I would encourage you to do is attend a D1, D2, and D3 practice this fall. See if you can tell by observing the players on the field what level you might fit. It may help guide your recruiting strategy and it is certainly more information than guessing what level may be the best for you. See if you can find at least one program that is a fit for you (i.e., the coach loves you and you love the team/school). When you have found something, you can build from there.

There are number of items that can lead to your not getting any attention from college coaches:

01-- first off you may have not gone about the initial items in the proper manner
Have you contacted coaches?
Have you made them aware of where you were
playing so they could come and see you ?
Are you playing on a strong high profile summer
team?

02-- Perhaps your talent is not what you think it is
Are you being true to yourself in your
evaluation of yourself?

Step back and re-evaluate

quote:

Originally posted by isaacvanwart:
Midlo--If a kid is a possible Div I, probably Div II, kind of player, would he be okay to simply wait until later in the process to concern himself with Div III teams? In other words, say he wants to go to Liberty or Mars Hill. He is pretty sure he can "walk on" at about any Div III around (say, Lynchburg). Why worry at all about Div III programs until at least the middle of his senior season. After all, all he really needs to do is work hard, play hard, and walk on at a Div III school if a I or II does not pick him up. Right? It just seems to me that if a kid is a standout HS varsity player, against good competition, he can play at nearly any Div III school. I don't get the Div III "recruiting" since there is no money there, and alot of good players who give up ball after HS could play at most Div III schools.

DIII schools are just like other colleges when it comes to the admissions cycle - applications will be due in the fall. If anything, due to the smaller size of the DIIIs, they may be even more restrictive when it comes to application deadlines.

If the OP were to wait until his senior year season to think about the DIIIs, he would find that many of them are not accepting applications. He would also find that academic and need based financial aid - the only aid he can get at a DIII - are also not available.

On the other hand, if he has a coach or two at that level recruiting him, they can help with the admissions process as well as with the FA office. They can't legally get him more money - but they can make sure that he gets all that he is entitled to.

My advice to the OP is not to close any doors - and not to assume that a DI or DII program is the only place for him. There are many fine DIII programs around the country that may be the best fit for him both athletically and academically. And don't forget - there are DIII programs that have better baseball than the lesser DII and DI programs - it is not as cut and dry as DI is better than DII is better than DIII.

TR,
If his velocity and pitchability are as stated I'd put him at potential D1, definite D2, strong D3 with the proviso that given his stature he may be quite projectable. He's probably better off working hard and seeing where he can get to between now and the late signing period. He could also consider the JUCO route to give himself time to develop further. Of course, in the meantime he should be developing all the contacts he can at each level as you and others have stated.

You talk about the late signing period as viable, but you sure wouldn't have long after the early signing date has passed to figure out what you're doing do you? Many high academic schools require applications on January 1st, sometimes sooner. So is it more likely that you commit shortly after the early signing period, you just can't do the paperwork until April?

There are a lot of good opportunities at the D-3 level. There is also a lot of misleading stuff that goes on. It's not at all unusual for a kid to get the big come-on in the spring, be "recruited", only to find when he arrives that he's on a tryout field with 80-100 "recruited" guys vying for a roster spot.

If you're going to look at D-3's, check out the program's reputation for this sort of thing. Then, don't wait until the last minute, go ahead and talk to them. You may find the overall package of a particular school -- when you consider academics, too -- is a better fit for you in the end. In VA, for example you can attend a place like Mary Washington and play baseball at a lower cost than if you went to many D-1's with 25% scholarship! (Your parents might even appreciate that!)

The thing is, with D-3 you sign no NLI, so if you "commit" verbally, you are still free to change your mind at any time. You wouldn't be the first kid to "commit" to a D-3 and then sign with a D-1 in April or even over the summer.

And now you know why so many D-3's feel they HAVE TO over recruit. They often get burned in this process.

I was asking, more than declaring, which is why I addressed Midlo, directly--he tends to have the inside scoop on all things college baseball. I cannot disagree with anything written, but I also cannot see that Div III is a hard make. A kid who is a top three or four player on a competitive HS team will be able to play Div III at many, if not most, Div III schools. He may not become a starter, or a regular player, but he can make the team. Let's say you are the starting LF for West Springfield. You hit #6 in the order and bat, say, .350, with an OBP of .400 and a slugging percentage of .420. You have a 7.05 sixty and your OF velocity is 84 mph. You were a regular guy your Junior year and a full timer your Senior year. You don't pitch. You can play on many Div III teams. You don't have Div I or even II speed, arm strength, or hitting skills, but you can play Div III. Do you need to be recruited? I don't think so. I may have it all wrong. Maybe Div III recruiting really is like Div I and II recruiting, but it does not seem that way to me.

Midlo--let's take UMW in particular. The rumor mill among players, parents, and even coaches is that UMW will "recruit" dozens of players, allow 80 at "tryouts," keep 35 or 40, and play about half of those. I have no idea if that is correct, but that seems to me, whether true at UMW or not, to be the case at many Div III schools. In short, Div III schools are almost like high school--open tryouts with a few select kids in mind and a few others lucky enough to get a coach's attention at the tryouts. Again, I may have it all wrong.

quote:

but I also cannot see that Div III is a hard make. A kid who is a top three or four player on a competitive HS team will be able to play Div III at many, if not most, Div III schools. He may not become a starter, or a regular player, but he can make the team. Let's say you are the starting LF for West Springfield. You hit #6 in the order and bat, say, .350, with an OBP of .400 and a slugging percentage of .420. You have a 7.05 sixty and your OF velocity is 84 mph. You were a regular guy your Junior year and a full timer your Senior year. You don't pitch. You can play on many Div III teams. You don't have Div I or even II speed, arm strength, or hitting skills, but you can play Div III. Do you need to be recruited? I don't think so.

roy - do you have a multiple personality disorder? I mean, on some days you are issac and some days you are roy?

Seriously, the player you are describing could be a D1, D2, or D3 player. It depends what the coach sees with his own eyes and that is why it is important to be recruited.

Look, there are programs out there that will recruit site unseen. They never win and yes some of them do set up a cattle call in the fall. The D3's I am encouraging this young man to look into are the competitive ones. The ones who make regional playoffs just about every year. Those programs recruit just like any other competitive D1 program out there.

For the player who started this thread, I am advising him to cast a wider net. D1, D2, D3, NAIA, and juco. Based on what he has reported, he may in fact be a D1 player. If he puts all his eggs in that basket however, he may wind up on the outside looking in.

Well, I have to disagree. I think comparing DIII baseball to advanced high school ball would be a huge mistake for a prospective player.

College baseball is tough at any level, be it DI or JUCO.

If it was easy, everyone would do it.

You still need to have the ability to play at the next level, the coach wants you, it is a good fit both on the field and in the classroom, and do you have those "intangibles" that we so often hear about, coachability, knowledge of the game, attitude, etc.

I think it would be a huge mistake for a player to think that getting onto a DIII team would be like HS tryouts. Just take a look at Cortland State.

Just my opinion.

Many do not understand the Divsion III recruiting process---it is not unlike D-II and D-I but withour the LOI

Yes many Division III schools have 75/80 kids tryout but many are "selected" recruits with a lot of baseball talent--- we have many of our players go Division III and they play from their frosh year on with great rewards both on the field and in the classroom

Here in the Northeast many of the D-III programs can more than compete with the D-I and D-II programs ie-- Trinity, Wheaton, Eastern Ct State, Cortland State, Ithaca etc

Don't look down your nose at D-III programs---you might miss the boat

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Here in the Northeast many of the D-III programs can more than compete with the D-I and D-II programs ie-- Trinity, Wheaton, Eastern Ct State, Cortland State, Ithaca etc

Don't look down your nose at D-III programs---you might miss the boat

That is what I have been trying to say in every post in this thread. Those D3's you mention are some of the premier programs in the nation - academically and athletically. Here in Ohio I would like to mention Marietta and Wooster. Heidelberg is another program on the rise and has been making noise in the playoffs the last several years.

A couple of observations:

1) In my opinion, playing college ball at the DIII level is a long way above playing high school ball in terms of the skill required to make the team. Take a look at the roster of any quality DIII team and read the team bios. You will find players who were exceptional in high school rather than simply a starter.

2) Cattle call tryouts are not unique to the DIIIs. Many programs I am familiar with have large fall tryouts at the DII level (Sonoma State typically has more than 150 kids out for the team each fall) and CA JUCOs often have more than 100 kids trying out as well.

quote:

Originally posted by 08Dad:
A couple of observations:

1) In my opinion, playing college ball at the DIII level is a long way above playing high school ball in terms of the skill required to make the team. Take a look at the roster of any quality DIII team and read the team bios. You will find players who were exceptional in high school rather than simply a starter.

2) Cattle call tryouts are not unique to the DIIIs. Many programs I am familiar with have large fall tryouts at the DII level (Sonoma State typically has more than 150 kids out for the team each fall) and CA JUCOs often have more than 100 kids trying out as well.

Yeah, i am going to go into my senior year and havn't had anyone contact mee. And i have been trying just for d3 schools. So looks like i wont be playing college ball.

Way too early to give up... the small schools don't have to recruit near as early as the big guys do. There still may be schools that will give you a look. Get on the websites and look at schedules and rosters of schools you'd like to attend... then work with your parents and coach(es) to see what you can do.
Don't expect them to come and knock on your door... once you are there, you are there just the same as a guy they may have recruited for a couple of years.

There's still plenty of time; my oldest son didn't sign with his DII school until spring of his senior year and we have a player on our current team that didn't start marketing himself until during his senior season (sent out some dvds) who will be playing on a local DIII in the fall. Good luck, all!

Well first off I have some good news. A friend of mine is on a travel team and they needed an extra player so he called me up and invited me to come play in a 40 team tournament with their prestigous travel club so that will go a long way with getting me more exposure.

I've also been getting in touch via email with coaches at the D1, D2, D3, and NAIA level so in the past few days there have been many positives.

Riot, good move contacting coaches. Keep in mind many of the so-called experts in baseball are in common with used car salesman, they tell you what you want to hear. Been there done that. The fact you haven't heard from any schools could be for two reasons.

1. They don't know you are out there.

2. Your size, etc is holding you back, most programs like the big guys.

Keep trying and let us know how it goes. Best wishes.

If you are heading into your Senior year and have not been contacted by D1 you most likely are not going D1. D1's are talking with kids as juniors and they will sign them in the early period in Nov. Look to small colleges at this point D2,D3, NAIA, JC...nothing wrong with them at all. Baseball is baseball.

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If you are heading into your Senior year and have not been contacted by D1 you most likely are not going D1. D1's are talking with kids as juniors and they will sign them in the early period in Nov. Look to small colleges at this point D2,D3, NAIA, JC...nothing wrong with them at all. Baseball is baseball.

The mid-major D1's are not done recruiting yet. Sure, they've nabbed their top prospects, but many programs are still trying to fill in the gaps. Players who are "B" and "C" choices may start getting calls later this month and into September and October.

Finally got a call from Eastern Mennonite University which plays in the ODAC. They invited me for a visit and I'm scheduled to take a tour and meet everyone on the 14th so I'm excited. It's atleast a start

Just make sure you want the whole EMU experience. This is not like just going to any college where they'll let you play baseball. At certain schools, the culture is so very unique that you need to make sure you are OK with that culture. For different reasons, this would apply to the service academies, VMI, Liberty, etc. It's not like choosing between Randolph Macon and Hampden-Sydney.

Yeah I understand. I've looked into Liberty also and I know some of their strict policies. My granddad is actually a preacher so the whole Christian school doesn't scare me off too much as I've been involved in it my whole life. But I'm definitely giving it plenty of thought.

There's nothing wrong with a jc if you want to keep and/or think you can play at a higher level then you are currently being offered. There were over 600 CA JC players on d1, d2, etc rosters last year. http://www.spincostats.com/Com...ll/Professional.html

many of the top ca d2 schools are made up of mostly jc players.