Alternative catcher stances

My son has been experimenting with these - he says that some unorthodox stances give the umpire a better view of the strike zone. 

Some are doing it to take stress off of knees also.  It allows them to spend less time with their knees bent.

Yeah, I kind of figured that was probably it.  I was wondering if the teaching is evolving to include this as acceptable catching techniques.

I used to worry about the same thing. Its definitely acceptable if they're fundamentally sound and good receivers

My son uses it often. But as you said less then 2 strikes and no one on. He likes it because he can get very low, I like it because it takes stress off the knees.

If you can still throw with velocity and accuracy to the bag it's fine...lots of good catching instructors are teaching it.

is also easy to block the ball right at you if you are down on one knee already...that is being taught a lot now

There is an amazing ABCA podcast with Jerry Weinstein from April 2019.  Episode 127 Breaking it down behind the plate that talks about stances, receiving, etc. 

It is getting more widespread but there was a guy or two who did it already in the 70s. Forgot the name though, I think it was a spanish name.

@Dominik85 posted:

It is getting more widespread but there was a guy or two who did it already in the 70s. Forgot the name though, I think it was a spanish name.

Tony Pena

How old is your son’s catching coach? My son was originally taught by an old school guy who had one way of doing things and frowns upon this. We got lucky and were introduced to some other guys over the past couple years who are younger and experiment more with different techniques who do teach it. It has nothing to do with being lazy. However, I would argue that if you can take 30-40% of pitches from one knee you will prolong your ability to play without pain. My son is super athletic and flexible so that part isn’t a huge concern  

A couple things I’ve read that stand out are that it can blur the low end of the zone, gives the C more range of motion without that knee getting in the way, and adds stability and balance to receiving. I’ve never heard anyone say it is to get down quicker for blocking. As far as missing high strikes, how often are you trying to steal a pitch at the top of the zone compared to the bottom of the zone? 

I can tell by a couple responses your minds are made up and there will be no changing it. That’s fine. Do what works for you. The C needs to be comfortable and bought in to whichever approach he is taking. My son’s HS “catching” coach told him not to do it after working on it all fall and winter. The head coach told him to go back to whatever he wants after 3 innings of the first game. 

For those of you wanting more info, check out Jerry Weinstein, Xan Barksdale, Next Level Catching, The Catching Guy, The Mound Visit, etc. If you read and listen with an open mind there is a lot you can learn from these guys. 

Question: what model is the catchers mitt? How was it "broken in"? If it "Broken in" like a 1b mitt then the catcher will receive one handed.

When he plays catch with a "round" mitt [Wilson, Rawlings] he will center behind the ball and shift his weight. This develops muscle memory for the game when he "blocks"

Bob

Kennie;

thank you for the kind words.

Mizuno is a 2 handed mitt. My remarks were the results of a conversation with the Orioles catching coach.

Bob

My son was taught to do the one knee thing this year with nobody on and fewer than 2 strikes by his catching coach.  His head coach got on him for doing it, not believing that he was told to do that.  He had to get his catching coach to talk to him to resolve it.  It seems to help with framing the low pitches, and allowing the umpire to see better. 

What is your take on Contreras "framing"? He is moving his glove like a foot  plus and does it on every pitch. 

Is that the state of the art or just bad?

https://twitter.com/PitchingNi...476544803045377?s=19

Positive glove movement. While there is a lot of movement, it’s actually only a couple inches once he receives the ball. It was actually a strike right on the line, but he increases the chances it is called a strike instead of a ball. This is pretty much right there with the one knee setup. Most of the guys are doing it. And in a coup,e years they all will be. The days of sticking Most pitcher is pretty much gone. My son loves all the little wrist and glove movements he’s taught to trick the eye and create an extra inch or two of the zone. 

That "working up" from below the zone to steal low strikes is a significant piece of the strategy and advantages with one knee.

I personally hate it.  My kid does it...probably to piss off his old man too. 

I had a discussion recently with my son's long time catching coach.  His view is that there are things MLB players do, and reasons for doing them, that don't apply to lower levels.  His view on the one-knee stance at the HS level is that it is ridiculous because HS umpires are not good enough to make a different call on the low pitch anyway.  Plus, the cost/benefit ratio of receiving vs blocking is wildly different at the MLB level vs HS level.  Likewise for moving the glove 12" or more... there are times when this helps and times when it doesn't, and the HS kid doesn't know the difference and tends to look out of control and sloppy.  

I’ve seen my share of kids that don’t know how to control it and looks sloppy. You really need to work on receiving heavy balls if you want to try to move 85+ in a different direction once it first makes impact with the glove. At least that works for my son. From what I’ve seen though, the kids that struggle with receiving like this probably struggle receiving in general. 

Another thing I’ve noticed and this thread somewhat confirms, HS kids and down are not using it in blocking or throwing situations. 

Id like to hear what pitchers have to say? Does it help with their confidence and how they pitch if they feel the catcher at the HS level has better control receiving compared to the kid moving pitches away from the zone? Does the one knee bother them at all?

I’m not a fan.

We were watching a MLB game today and the C framed a ball on the outside corner to the middle of the plate  (box showed easily  a strike)  and it was as called a ball.   Should have stuck it.The announcers talked about it for a while.

 I hate what the catchers are doing these days.  

@TerribleBPthrower posted:

I’ve seen my share of kids that don’t know how to control it and looks sloppy. You really need to work on receiving heavy balls if you want to try to move 85+ in a different direction once it first makes impact with the glove. At least that works for my son. From what I’ve seen though, the kids that struggle with receiving like this probably struggle receiving in general. 

Another thing I’ve noticed and this thread somewhat confirms, HS kids and down are not using it in blocking or throwing situations. 

Id like to hear what pitchers have to say? Does it help with their confidence and how they pitch if they feel the catcher at the HS level has better control receiving compared to the kid moving pitches away from the zone? Does the one knee bother them at all?

At the HS level and below, isn't every situation a blocking situation?  I mean, what better way to practice in a live game situation then to block every ball, no matter what the score or situation.  My son's HS pitching staff threw 1 in 4 balls in the dirt, so he had 30-40 block opportunities every game.  He got plenty of practice, became quite good at it, and I was able to get lots of live video of his work which helped in recruiting.

Regarding your comment on pitcher's confidence... I can tell you that regardless of the count or situation, balls clanking against the backstop are very unsettling to the coaches, other players and fans.  It's not a good look.

@Smitty28 posted:

At the HS level and below, isn't every situation a blocking situation?  I mean, what better way to practice in a live game situation then to block every ball, no matter what the score or situation.  My son's HS pitching staff threw 1 in 4 balls in the dirt, so he had 30-40 block opportunities every game.  He got plenty of practice, became quite good at it, and I was able to get lots of live video of his work which helped in recruiting.

Regarding your comment on pitcher's confidence... I can tell you that regardless of the count or situation, balls clanking against the backstop are very unsettling to the coaches, other players and fans.  It's not a good look.

If you are blocking 30-40 balls in a game I’d say you need a new pitching coach. In 8 varsity games this year we had 5 balls hit the backstop. 2 hit about 20 feet up, 1 the pitcher threw a curve instead of a fastball, and 2 the second string catcher was playing and just straight missed a couple balls. 

Just because they are on a knee doesn’t mean they can’t still block. It’s not like they are saying oh screw it, im just gonna let that one go. The only pitch I can see being a problem is a yanked curve or slider because you can’t get the power to drive out to get it. 

Don’t get me wrong, I’ve watched kids this summer let a ton of balls hit the backstop and make a complete mess of the game, but those kids would struggle no matter what stance they were using.