Another "approach the coach" topic

I asked my son's prospective HS coach how he handled hitting from a coaching perspective, and how he felt about kids using private batting coaches.  He said he understands that many kids use private coaches and he's fine with that, or if the player would like help he's happy to provide it.  He added, "but, if the player wants to play he better hit".

I think the more specific you get with this discussion the more you are telegraphing something that he may find as meddling.  By the way, I asked my question in a group "information session" so that this would be viewed purely as information gathering, which it was.

A parent of a new kid to the program approaching the coach will probably come off as meddling and telling the coach how to do his job. Just wear a hat with a red flag and a t shirt with PITA on the front.

I believe you risk doing more harm than good. The coach might think he doesn't need your son because of you. The best solution is your son come out of the box hitting. Then the coach will leave him alone.

My son's hitting improved so drastically from soph (.340) to junior year (.524 w power) his coach asked me about it. It turns out the coach detests his hitting instructor as a human being. But because my son was hitting there was no attempt to change anything.

Wow, it's been a while since I've read a post where so many peripheral questions come to mind as I'm reading.  Let me start with a few safe ones...

Do you have an existing relationship with the coach?

Does your son know any of his current players where he could possibly ask them what hitting mechanics are taught?

Also... you say "The results of his new approach are phenomenal... But, he was taught things that would make today's internet hitting gurus cringe."

You do know you can't just throw this out there without expanding on it, right?

I don't think there is a way you could bring the topic up to the coach that will not make you look like "that parent".  Agree with RJM, you risk a lot more harm than good.

I know I wouldn't mind if anyone came up to me to ask about philosophy or what we teach.  Because at the end of the day if the kid is stroking the ball the extent of my coaching will be "great job" and "atta boy" and "keep it up".  No point in messing with what works.  If I see a guy who has "different" mechanics he's going to get a chance to go with them.  If they prove they can't hit then I'm going to start trying to fix what they do.  If they fix it and hit they play or if they don't fix it or won't change then they probably won't play.  Pretty simple - they produce they play.  I don't care if you pay $10 million for a private coach - if it works I'm not doing anything but if it's not working then I'm going to try.  At that point it's up to them to listen or not.

I think if you do approach the coach I think you need to be very careful in how you say / ask questions or you will come across as that parent.  

(He and I do a lot of offseason work and sometimes I can explain it better/different than the coach can)

While you mean this statement completely innocent and without any ill intent towards the coach it could come across as very arrogant.  What he could hear is "his kid won't listen to me because the only person who has ever taught him is daddy".

Just treat lightly here.

Interested in the answer to this as well.  

But to the OP question, a simple answer: Say nothing as an incoming parent... and precious little thereafter.

I never discussed the hitting coach or hitting philosophies with the head coach.  Why? Because he doesn't tell me what to do in my house and I don't tell him what to do on the field.  

Use the approach quoted above.  It works.

This is the route more coaches should take, if a kid has a instructor or is hitting fine it gives me more time to work with the rest of the guys.

Golfman:

Don't do it. Chances are very, very small that anything good will come of it. Best of luck.

 That's almost exactly what my son's HS hitting coach did once he observed his swing and hitting.  Basically, he commented he wasn't going to mess with it.

As the old saying goes, "if ain't broke, don't fix it."

Agree with everyone else.  I wouldn't say anything and if you choose to do so, be very careful.  The coach never told me how to do my job and I never told him how to do his.

Let me just say he uses the "L" word. 

Thanks for all the responses so far.  A lot of good points to what would seemingly be an "innocent" discussion. 

For what it is worth, I am not "that parent."  I know my kids strengths and weaknesses.  But I don't believe every coach he has had has been good -- Wish I knew then, what I know now.  I have never approached his coaches about anything.  Even when asked, I am hesitant to give an opinion.  He is going to succeed/fail on his own.  And I don't teach my kid anymore.  I reinforce what he his learning - which is why I like to understand the coach's approach. 

As I have watch the HS players hit, I see many similarities with my kid's new approach.  Admittedly, its with a half blind naked eye.  But that is what interests me - are they really that similar.   

From what I can gather to date, the HS coach has an excellent background. 2nd year.  Sounds like he is really building a program.  They play in a very strong division.  So their "record" is average.  But last year they surprised some people and took down the No. 1 seed in their bracket (should have never happened on paper).  That made be pick my head up and go "hmmm."  He might actually be the best coach in the area -- time will tell.   

Why risk the doghouse?

Hey, I say that as long as there are 9 total freshmen coming out, then go for it. 

I wouldn't.  Which is why I asked.  But I have to say that it is pretty sad these days if having an adult discussion with a coach regarding hitting mechanics could put someone in the doghouse. 

Golfman,  you say that you want to discuss hitting mechanics because you think maybe you can interpret what the coach teaches better than he can and reinforce that with your son?  Why would you need to do that?  Does the kid really need it?  Do you?   Every family is different, I know, but growing up is a process of separation as the child unlatches from his parents and makes his own way in the world, and many of not most will tell you that when it comes to sports, the beginning of high school is a good dividing line, a good time to back off, let the kid play, let the coach coach, and let the parents root from the stands.   Unless you've got expertise that is clearly above that of the coach, maybe freshman year  is a good time to back off and let the kid enjoy his career.

There's a big difference between having a baseball conversation and having a conversation about hitting mechanics and your son. Over four years I had several baseball general conversations with the JV coach. 

That's a good point. I've known my kid's HS coach for years, and talk about baseball with him frequently.  Before my kid was in his program, I would have no problem at all asking him, for example, hey my kid's hand path looks funky to me - how does his swing look to you?   I could ask him that now too, if I chose to.  But why would I need to?  My kid can ask the question himself.

I am not suggesting I can do anything better than the coach.  However, in reality I'll spend a lot more time with my kid than a coach ever will.  Some days I'm just the chauffer.  Other's I'm tossing or pitching.  The kid won't be able to attend winter workouts due to other sports (they don't let you go to other sport workouts in season).  He'll likely have some activity with his summer team.  But there will be many instances it will be just me and him, alone in a tunnel.   I'd like to be on the same page.   

And that was my original question.  What version of hitting mechanics do they teach?  Nothing about my kid at all. 

I say do it.  You really, really want to, so just go for it.  

Come up with some clever way to run into him after one of his Summer league games, and get it off your chest.  Then, while you've got his attention, subtly pull the conversation toward what you REALLY want to talk about: Your. Son. And how he's so looking forward to playing for him, and how awesome his hitting is now that you finally found the right hitting coach but that you *just want to make sure* that he knows that you just want to support his coaching style because you're not one of those parents who coaches garbage spouted by the internet hitting guru's so he doesn't have to worry.  And MAKE SURE that he hears a few important stats from the recent phenomenal season Your Son is having because the strike-outs are way down, contact is way up, with enough power to make things happen...

and then come back out here and tell us how it all went.

Discussing the coach's hitting beliefs is not general baseball conversation. That's personal. And he will know exactly where you're trying to go with it.

Let me try saying it a different way.  Over the past few years my son has become, through his hitting instructor, myself, his attention to detail, and observing other swings informed enough about a baseball swing to be able to think for himself.  So when he's given advice he can usually determine whether there is a likelihood of it helping or hurting his swing.  Educate your son and let HIM handle things on his own. It's all part of growing up.

But first and foremost, during tryouts and the majority of the season so far, he did well enough that there was no need to alter what he was already doing well.

I really don't understand the good that come out of this conversation.  If you are an expert and know all of the various hitting mechanics arguments then teach your son what you think is best.  From there, the reality is that the coach is often the scapegoat for when a kid does not hit.  IOWs, blame it on the coach and not on the kid's inability to hit.  Teach your son so thoroughly that no one can "mess him up."  Many of us have faced the same situation.  I certainly did since what I taught was not "main stream" and my child's coach was not privy to that information.  (Information contained on a private site.)  The goal then was to have her prepared for any situation and we made sure that she could outhit any and all comers.  In that way, the coach left her alone.  Most coaches are not going to have your son change for change sake.  Most coaches use different cues but they mostly mean the same things.  Explain to your son that this or that means this or that and then he will be ready to handle various philosophies.  JMHO!

+1 for CoachB25.  He said it better then I did.  His post is what has to be done in a nutshell.

Wow.  You're assuming a lot of fact not in evidence.  But of course any parent who takes an interest in their kids game has to be "that parent."  Got it.  

I'm not trying to go anywhere with it.  Everything doesn't have to have an ulterier motive.  Just a simple question, do you teach in A, B or somewhere in between?  

But I get it.  Don't talk Religion, Politics or hitting mechanics.  

I note you referred to yourself as part of the puzzle.  You must be one of "those parents."  

That is all I am trying to do.  Help him sort thru "conflicting" advice.  My message to him is that as he move along his "career" he'll pick up hints, tips and pieces of advice.  He'll use some, toss some, and eventually create his own comfort level with what works for him.  

Golfman, what if the coach doesn't keep up with all of these trends/fads etc. that are making their way onto internet sites?  What if the coach teaches what they know from experience and can't label it Mankin, Epstein, Lau, Hudgens, Englishbey, Tewks, ...?  Some coaches teach what they leaned growing up.  Some teach what they learned in college.  I know one coach who only coaches those principles he learned in college, could care less about all of these experts, has his own cues and does exceedingly well.  It isn't as simple as asking a coach what philosophy they teach.  Per myself, I have used Epstein, Lau, Hudgens and Englishbey.  So, if I shared with you what I thought, I couldn't make my ideas fit any one mold. 

However, you want to have this conversation and so, why not just do it.  Write the pros and cons down, evaluate them and then take action.   

The good is that we'll know that the coach is a type X hitter.  Not a type Y.  Then the type X mechanics can be emphasized when working alone.  

But, I definitely hear what most are saying.  The perception is bad.  Got it loud and clear.  Just think it is sad that it has to be that way.     

I agree.  Most swings are "all of the above."  But I could tell quickly what you emphasize and what you're core swing beliefs are.  

I, like you, have helped reinforce what he is taught.  I have also worked on my son's mental game for years, which has helped him begin the season as a starter and to remain there.  

No matter what I think about "my son's" coach and his decisions on the field (and I have some) I keep those thoughts to myself.  I don't even speak with other parents about those thoughts.  Remember that statement.  It is his baseball "career", as you called it.  Personally, my thought process is, he's just a freshman on a HS baseball team playing a game that he loves.  I'm more concerned about his grades then his baseball.  His education is what will carry him through life.

Teach your son well and let him make his own decisions.  He'll fail at times, but it's the same way in baseball too, isn't it?

Golfman, hello. IMHO I think this is a non issue. Believe me, if he hits it wont matter if he is standing on his head. As for the hitting gurus, I could never figure them out. As Yogi said 90% of it is half mental! Enjoy his High School years when he gets there, it goes by fast. 

I think everything Coach B25 has said is what you need to do.  I realize I'm different than most coaches because I talk to parents about anything.  I would rather talk with the kids to help them take the next step in becoming and mature individual but some parents can't see that (not talking about you).  But not all coaches are like me and will take anything remotely seen as questioning them / way do things as challenging.

Coach2709 talked to parents and I didn't talk to parents.  There is no right or wrong.  I've stated my reasons before for not wanting to talk to parents after my parent meeting each year where parents could speak up and ask whatever they wanted.  One primary reason is that it can hurt your child in ways that you don't think of at the moment.  As I've stated before, and I apologize for repeating myself, I had a very good friend who's two sons came through my program.  When the first one was a freshman, I told this dad that he and I would not have another conversation until his youngest son graduated or for the next 5 years.  He was offended and so I explained to him that both of his sons were really talented and both had a chance of playing on the varsity.  Say I kept both of them and the dad and I continued to talk.  Both boys would never be given credit for what they achieved but rather people would say that they were promoted because the dad and I were friends.  I remember the first boy's first HS at bat.  He hit a homerun.  The dad listened all the negativity in the stands about me putting a freshman in and then bam the homerun.  He walked past me after the game and muttered as he walked by, "I understand now."  What a great dad and family.  They trusted me and both boys had great HS and college careers.  One played professionally.   

Honestly, Golfman, high school coaches don't have the time to give a lot of individual instruction to guys who don't need it. If a kid is hitting, they spend what little time that have with the kid who isn't producing. If you came to me and asked what "school" of hitting I belonged to, I'd probably just smile and give you some blow off answer. Now, if you can somehow build a relationship of sorts with the guy and then get into a hitting in general conversation, you may not be able to shut him up. As a coach, if I think I'm educating YOU, I'll tell you everything I think about hitting. Stroke the ego.

I would echo what others are saying....don't try to talk to him yet.  Let your son start with the program and get a feel for what the coach is thinking.  He'll know pretty quick if the coach is going to try to "change" him.  If it looks like that's the case, then maybe a talk with the coach would make sense....but only if your son discusses the situation with the coach first.  I'm guessing if your son hits like you say he does that the HS coach won't bother him.  Coaches have plenty of incoming freshmen who need all kinds of help.  Most coaches don't go out of their way to "look for problems"...they wait until the problem shows up, then deal with it.  If your son hits....he'll be fine....if not, deal with it then....