If the MLB scouts and college coaches tell you a kid, your kid, has the goods, you have just received your parental reward in this process.
That reward is "relief" from anyone accusing you of being biased, or living in Disneyland, or just another bag of "hot air".
It also tells the player he is on the right track!!
Great Post!
my thoughts on this are more in line with Prepster's
I don't think any communication to college coaches EVER was sent that wasn't from my son, with the exception that if he was "on the road" during the summer & someone requested info, I'd note to them that I was forwarding it per son's request.
Early on I helped in composing & putting the info in an brief understandable format, with contacts for more info - from then on it's was mostly cut & paste modifications for him.
I can't remember any pro or college guys asking for MY opinion on skills -
but, when speaking to them I'd always have some creditable contact #'s ready IF asked - ie: summer coach(s), a few hs coaches, a showcase contact etc
the importance of a letter of recomendation from hs coach? with all due respect, nada
.
I don't think any communication to college coaches EVER was sent that wasn't from my son, with the exception that if he was "on the road" during the summer & someone requested info, I'd note to them that I was forwarding it per son's request.
Early on I helped in composing & putting the info in an brief understandable format, with contacts for more info - from then on it's was mostly cut & paste modifications for him.
I can't remember any pro or college guys asking for MY opinion on skills -
but, when speaking to them I'd always have some creditable contact #'s ready IF asked - ie: summer coach(s), a few hs coaches, a showcase contact etc
the importance of a letter of recomendation from hs coach? with all due respect, nada
.
WOW since when did Marketing and Selling become 4 letter words ? Used car salesman ?
You are being marketed to every day.
Some of you are lucky to be from a baseball state with college scout crawling around your HS and summer games but not everyone has that oportunity. Some of your sons just poped out of the womb as a "STUD" and can't be overlooked thats great.
For all the rest: Target the schools, Market your son and sell him to those schools that show interest.
If you rely on peoples opinions you may just kill the dream a little prematurely because the local scout says he isn't all that. You can ask 10 scouts and they will have a different opinion. If your son is applying to a school the only opinion that counts is theat coaches opinion. I disagree with the point that if you have to market and sell your ball player he just isn't that good. I don't have the time or energy to bring up lots of examples but Jeff Francis comes to mind.
I push people to use video because they tell the facts. The videos have to be against great competition and recent. If your son is not that good it will show on the video. The video is should be games and not just mechanics.
I also feel that if your son is college age and you don't know if he is any good you haven't spent enough time at the ball park or he is in the wrong league/team to progress to the "Next Level".
You are being marketed to every day.
Some of you are lucky to be from a baseball state with college scout crawling around your HS and summer games but not everyone has that oportunity. Some of your sons just poped out of the womb as a "STUD" and can't be overlooked thats great.
For all the rest: Target the schools, Market your son and sell him to those schools that show interest.
If you rely on peoples opinions you may just kill the dream a little prematurely because the local scout says he isn't all that. You can ask 10 scouts and they will have a different opinion. If your son is applying to a school the only opinion that counts is theat coaches opinion. I disagree with the point that if you have to market and sell your ball player he just isn't that good. I don't have the time or energy to bring up lots of examples but Jeff Francis comes to mind.
I push people to use video because they tell the facts. The videos have to be against great competition and recent. If your son is not that good it will show on the video. The video is should be games and not just mechanics.
I also feel that if your son is college age and you don't know if he is any good you haven't spent enough time at the ball park or he is in the wrong league/team to progress to the "Next Level".
quote:Originally posted by BobbleheadDoll:
I also feel that if your son is college age and you don't know if he is any good you haven't spent enough time at the ball park or he is in the wrong league/team to progress to the "Next Level".
Bobble,
There are many parents who work very hard all week - and never get much of a chance to see their kids play. This is particularly true in underpriviledged areas. And even if they did attend some games - many have no baseball background and would have no basis whatsoever for evaluating talent.
That is one of reasons why many of us here offer advice and opinions - so we can help parents who dont have the background - or the means - to help their kid.
I think it is one of the hallmarks of the site Bob H created - and MN-MOM nurtures.
Bobble - I think you raise some good points. I think tactics do have to be more agressive if you are from a non-baseball hotbed such as Northeast Ohio or Canada.
When I used the "used car" analogy ealier in the thread, I was referring to claims that were not based in fact but hyperbole. The little girl's mother was comparing a 9 year old to an All-Amercan which seems ludicrous to me.
If your son has just pitched in a tournament and struck out several players on Baseball America's top 100 list, it seems to me that that is a FACT worth sharing with prospective coaches.
On the other hand, if you say my son is the next Bob Feller, the boy better be ready to pitch in the major leagues at 17 years old or you are just dealing in fabricated hype.
When I used the "used car" analogy ealier in the thread, I was referring to claims that were not based in fact but hyperbole. The little girl's mother was comparing a 9 year old to an All-Amercan which seems ludicrous to me.
If your son has just pitched in a tournament and struck out several players on Baseball America's top 100 list, it seems to me that that is a FACT worth sharing with prospective coaches.
On the other hand, if you say my son is the next Bob Feller, the boy better be ready to pitch in the major leagues at 17 years old or you are just dealing in fabricated hype.
From Bee,
Totally agree, I have two sons who were fortunate enough to get D1 scholarships
IN SPITE of their HS coach. The coaches who post on this site are excepted
.
Parents, Do NOT leave the ballplaying future of your sons up to anyone else.
quote:the importance of a letter of recomendation from hs coach? with all due respect, nada
Totally agree, I have two sons who were fortunate enough to get D1 scholarships
IN SPITE of their HS coach. The coaches who post on this site are excepted
.Parents, Do NOT leave the ballplaying future of your sons up to anyone else.
Moc1, Bee> - I completely agree with the comments re/ HS coach.
However, there are a few whose word is golden (at least in our area). If you've got one of those, you are in fact in pretty good shape. Our HS coach was a newbie...but he had played D1 ball and took the time to make a few calls to local schools (on his own)...spent a few hours on the phone with them. I'll never know the impact of those calls, but I do believe they were taken seriously...not the final word by any means...but the fact that he did what he did and took the time he did was seen in a positive way.
However, there are a few whose word is golden (at least in our area). If you've got one of those, you are in fact in pretty good shape. Our HS coach was a newbie...but he had played D1 ball and took the time to make a few calls to local schools (on his own)...spent a few hours on the phone with them. I'll never know the impact of those calls, but I do believe they were taken seriously...not the final word by any means...but the fact that he did what he did and took the time he did was seen in a positive way.
ITS I understand but anyone who has a son or daughter playing a sport that they love has to get involved. Baseball is one of the least expensive sports to play and the games are in the evennings and weekends. My biggest concern is the advise that says you are not any good if you have to market yourself. Money unfortunately is a big part of exposure but you don't have to blow your wad. We didn't spend more than $150.00 on showcases in the last 3 years . The reality is that the team you play on is a huge factor in the competition you face. A video of playing against weak teams may not help but you also won't get noticed.
Cleveland the marketing has to be honest and that is what the video does. It shows that you can play against top level teams and players. My son wanted more than the teams that were coming to our area. Our marketing produced several opportunities that he would never have had a shot at. The hardest part was getting coaches to look at the video.I sold hard to get them to look. Once they looked at it they called and in some cases were willing to make offers sight unseen and in others he had an invitation to go for an evaluation.
I find some of the advice is negative ans assumes parents are blinded by the glow. I have seen people like that but there are lots of knowledgeable parents and you have to get involved.
Cleveland the marketing has to be honest and that is what the video does. It shows that you can play against top level teams and players. My son wanted more than the teams that were coming to our area. Our marketing produced several opportunities that he would never have had a shot at. The hardest part was getting coaches to look at the video.I sold hard to get them to look. Once they looked at it they called and in some cases were willing to make offers sight unseen and in others he had an invitation to go for an evaluation.
I find some of the advice is negative ans assumes parents are blinded by the glow. I have seen people like that but there are lots of knowledgeable parents and you have to get involved.
Bobble,
I agree with most of what you are saying - but keep in mind - some kids dont have parents - or come from one parent families who have little - if any - resources.
I certainly wish that wasnt the case. And I hope those kids - and their parents - learn from this site.
I agree with most of what you are saying - but keep in mind - some kids dont have parents - or come from one parent families who have little - if any - resources.
I certainly wish that wasnt the case. And I hope those kids - and their parents - learn from this site.
Yes I have seen many people who are in that circumstance. It is unfortunate but some of the teams waived their fees to make it possible. It is still tough to get in a position of getting to the next level.
Bobblehead
It is not that tough if they do the research and do the proper homework and talk with the right people
It is not that tough if they do the research and do the proper homework and talk with the right people
Marketing, selling, spinning - all are overkill terms in trying to maximize a player's opportunity to make it to the next level.
I see the path as a simple one. Play on a travel team that goes to events that have a history of attracting colleges and universities. Go to an ID camp with the goal of achieving a positive rating by an objective third party scouting service like a Perfect Game or a Team One, which ever you choose.
Send a letter to a college coach at a school you wish to attend. Send several letters to several schools. Invariably, whether you send a complex marketing packet or a simple note to a coach, you will get a player profile questionaire back to fill in and return. With this will be a request for your spring/summer/fall schedule. Then the coach or the program's recruiter will have you on a list. A player can "market" themself as the next ARod with a video produced by Spielberg, but at some point the player has to perform well enough to contribute to a program at the next level. Coaches will want to see with their own eyes what they will be getting.
You have to get where the colleges are looking for players for the exposure necessary if you want to make it to the "next level". D-1, D-2, D-3 - it's the same. Play on a competitive travel team, communicate with coaches, get to some PG events and work your tail off to improve every day. Then you are making headway toward the next level.
I see the path as a simple one. Play on a travel team that goes to events that have a history of attracting colleges and universities. Go to an ID camp with the goal of achieving a positive rating by an objective third party scouting service like a Perfect Game or a Team One, which ever you choose.
Send a letter to a college coach at a school you wish to attend. Send several letters to several schools. Invariably, whether you send a complex marketing packet or a simple note to a coach, you will get a player profile questionaire back to fill in and return. With this will be a request for your spring/summer/fall schedule. Then the coach or the program's recruiter will have you on a list. A player can "market" themself as the next ARod with a video produced by Spielberg, but at some point the player has to perform well enough to contribute to a program at the next level. Coaches will want to see with their own eyes what they will be getting.
You have to get where the colleges are looking for players for the exposure necessary if you want to make it to the "next level". D-1, D-2, D-3 - it's the same. Play on a competitive travel team, communicate with coaches, get to some PG events and work your tail off to improve every day. Then you are making headway toward the next level.
baseballdad
the road is not simple as you state
the road is not simple as you state
TR, what would you add?
pgstaff says ( grades and ability are what counts..without those two there is nothing market or sell)
true but some kids have more of one than the other,i truly believe if you want to play bball in college than there is a college someplace for you. it's truie you need to be seen or sold .but thats the hard part for some people. knowledge, money ,time can all be a factor in does a kid even go to college.i'm sure everyone knows a good player that didn't go to school for one of these reasons. i have talked to quite a few colleges during my sons recruitment. often i mentioned another players name.i think that anytime you can help a kid you need to help a kid.
tr above you say ,all you need to do reaserch proper homework and talk to the right people. you say its not that tough to do.for alot of people it can be the hardest thing they have ever done. then when bball dad points out the obvious way for most on this sight you say it isn't that simple.you are right on both counts but you paint with broad strokes. your replys to the above post's should let everyone see how hard it can be to get a straight answer at times.it's not easy to market or sell any thing if you don't know who your selling or marketing to. i think that most everyone here did not understand the process. i think we all owe it to your community's to share these things and this website with parents of underclassmen when ever you get the chance.even at the risk of butting in.
one mans opinion
true but some kids have more of one than the other,i truly believe if you want to play bball in college than there is a college someplace for you. it's truie you need to be seen or sold .but thats the hard part for some people. knowledge, money ,time can all be a factor in does a kid even go to college.i'm sure everyone knows a good player that didn't go to school for one of these reasons. i have talked to quite a few colleges during my sons recruitment. often i mentioned another players name.i think that anytime you can help a kid you need to help a kid.
tr above you say ,all you need to do reaserch proper homework and talk to the right people. you say its not that tough to do.for alot of people it can be the hardest thing they have ever done. then when bball dad points out the obvious way for most on this sight you say it isn't that simple.you are right on both counts but you paint with broad strokes. your replys to the above post's should let everyone see how hard it can be to get a straight answer at times.it's not easy to market or sell any thing if you don't know who your selling or marketing to. i think that most everyone here did not understand the process. i think we all owe it to your community's to share these things and this website with parents of underclassmen when ever you get the chance.even at the risk of butting in.
one mans opinion
20dad,
At the risk of countradicting myself... If we are talking about baseball scholarship money... The single most important thing is ability.
Grades are only important to a college recruiter AFTER he has determined the neccessary ability is there.
No amount of marketing, selling, or anything else, matters if the player does not possess the talent required.
If the talent is there... it can help to know the right people (good contacts)
At the risk of countradicting myself... If we are talking about baseball scholarship money... The single most important thing is ability.
Grades are only important to a college recruiter AFTER he has determined the neccessary ability is there.
No amount of marketing, selling, or anything else, matters if the player does not possess the talent required.
If the talent is there... it can help to know the right people (good contacts)
PG, in most cases you are absolutely correct. However, there are situations where ability and academics are more narrowly considered in importance. I know of several very eye-catching, talented kids who certainly had the ability to play at schools like Wake, UVa and UNC but could not even be considered because of their academic standing. In these cases, no amount of marketing, selling, or anything else matters if the player do not possess the academic history required.
Absolutely true!
However those who do have the academic excellence required for Wake, Virginia, North Carolina, Notre Dame, Stanford, Harvard, etc, etc... Must first have the abilty those schools are looking for or they will not be recruited by the baseball program!
No amount of anything will matter without the neccessary talent! That includes great academic record.
Granted there are those who will not be recruited at those and other schools because of academic standards, but they will still be able to play at other top programs because of their ability.
Your examples do take both, but grades don't count until talent is recognized. Otherwise these colleges would just recruit the best students.
However those who do have the academic excellence required for Wake, Virginia, North Carolina, Notre Dame, Stanford, Harvard, etc, etc... Must first have the abilty those schools are looking for or they will not be recruited by the baseball program!
No amount of anything will matter without the neccessary talent! That includes great academic record.
Granted there are those who will not be recruited at those and other schools because of academic standards, but they will still be able to play at other top programs because of their ability.
Your examples do take both, but grades don't count until talent is recognized. Otherwise these colleges would just recruit the best students.
And so I agree... 
Not only is this a great topic, it is timely as well. As a parent of an 07 player the recruiting process is in full swing. Here is my take on it so far...
Parents have little more than a support role in the process. Coaches and scouts, from what I have seen, do not put much weight in the parent’s evaluation of the players skill level. The recruiter, if interested in the player, wants to meet the parents, get a feel for the family unit and then it is up to the player. Stats, past honors and accolades don’t seem to matter a great deal, nor should they. The scouts want to see a player play!
Showcase events are probably a good thing for players that do not play in a good Summer/Fall program. The entire HS season, while important, does not draw as many college scouts as one good Summer tournament. I think, from a parent’s perspective, you want your son to be seen as often as possible by as many scouts as possible. A higher level travel/scout team will play as many as 70 Summer games and another 30 or so in the Fall. Plenty of these games will be played in front of college coaches, many times at college facilities.
The recruiting process is not an exact science. For someone to grade a player out as a D1 or D3 level prospect as a 15 or 16 year old player is maybe a stretch. When you get the letters, your son will respond. Make sure he (and you) understands the difference between the form letter and a letter of interest. Most importantly, but this is just my opinion, HAVE FUN! Play baseball like it is supposed to be played. Don’t go out on the field feeling like you have to impress someone. Just play.
Parents have little more than a support role in the process. Coaches and scouts, from what I have seen, do not put much weight in the parent’s evaluation of the players skill level. The recruiter, if interested in the player, wants to meet the parents, get a feel for the family unit and then it is up to the player. Stats, past honors and accolades don’t seem to matter a great deal, nor should they. The scouts want to see a player play!
Showcase events are probably a good thing for players that do not play in a good Summer/Fall program. The entire HS season, while important, does not draw as many college scouts as one good Summer tournament. I think, from a parent’s perspective, you want your son to be seen as often as possible by as many scouts as possible. A higher level travel/scout team will play as many as 70 Summer games and another 30 or so in the Fall. Plenty of these games will be played in front of college coaches, many times at college facilities.
The recruiting process is not an exact science. For someone to grade a player out as a D1 or D3 level prospect as a 15 or 16 year old player is maybe a stretch. When you get the letters, your son will respond. Make sure he (and you) understands the difference between the form letter and a letter of interest. Most importantly, but this is just my opinion, HAVE FUN! Play baseball like it is supposed to be played. Don’t go out on the field feeling like you have to impress someone. Just play.
highlander
I think people misconstrue a players rating (evaluation) and I believe that PG has pointed this out before as well---it is based on the potential to play at a certain level based on what is seen during that weekend or week of activity.
I think people misconstrue a players rating (evaluation) and I believe that PG has pointed this out before as well---it is based on the potential to play at a certain level based on what is seen during that weekend or week of activity.
As a parent of an 08 player and three sport athlete it is more difficult to choose which of these events to attend because of other sports. We were schedule to attend the National Underclass showcase but had to bow out because of injury.
There does not seem to be any events in the June/July timeframe in the Northeast Area. The PG event in August is scheduled during Football season. Does anyone know of some good events in the June/July for a player from NH.
I have only been here about a month but already have received a lot of info on recruiting for both baseball and football from this site.
thanks
There does not seem to be any events in the June/July timeframe in the Northeast Area. The PG event in August is scheduled during Football season. Does anyone know of some good events in the June/July for a player from NH.
I have only been here about a month but already have received a lot of info on recruiting for both baseball and football from this site.
thanks
It doesn't matter what terminology you use, the functions of what you are doing fall in the categories under marketing and selling. Every human being on this planet does marketing and selling of their ideas in some form or fashion...this is covered in Marketing 101 at any good college.
If it makes you feel uncomfortable to use those terms then don't.
Some people like to say they are fascillitating...then the question is what steps are you using to facillitate and you will find they are covered under marketing and selling.
Let's be clear, I don't consider my son a product, but baseball does, if it didn't they wouldn't be paying for players.
Someone here keeps saying (TR) it's a business...well the last time I checked business deals in products or services which are their are products, and college BB and the MLB deals in BB players.
Romantic notions of maintaining purety in a cold hearted business like baseball may keep some from pulling the covers back, but it doesn't obviate the facts of what baseball has become...a sprint to see who will end up with the highest draft choice, and who will get the money commendsurate with that value.
Money drives everything about the game now...i don't like it, but I'm not naive enough to ignore it.
At the local level with your own son, the relationship is that of a support function...agreed. But the young men who play this game and want to progress to the next level understand that it is a competitive environment that requires both talent and hard work. But they also understand that's not going to win them anything against the additional requirements for the proper and correct exposure...if that were not so there would be no need for PG, GWS, TBBF, Trombly, Norcal, USABB, etc. and don't tell me those organizations aren't marketing, selling their products...(players).
If a player doesn't get the right marketing and selling done on his behalf, in addition to him having the goods, his chances of being discovered go down considerably.
I really don't care about the definitions of all of this, and quite frankly, it makes no sense to me why it is an issue since we all know what's going on here is covered under all the terms that have been used so far.
If it makes you feel uncomfortable to use those terms then don't.
Some people like to say they are fascillitating...then the question is what steps are you using to facillitate and you will find they are covered under marketing and selling.
Let's be clear, I don't consider my son a product, but baseball does, if it didn't they wouldn't be paying for players.
Someone here keeps saying (TR) it's a business...well the last time I checked business deals in products or services which are their are products, and college BB and the MLB deals in BB players.
Romantic notions of maintaining purety in a cold hearted business like baseball may keep some from pulling the covers back, but it doesn't obviate the facts of what baseball has become...a sprint to see who will end up with the highest draft choice, and who will get the money commendsurate with that value.
Money drives everything about the game now...i don't like it, but I'm not naive enough to ignore it.
At the local level with your own son, the relationship is that of a support function...agreed. But the young men who play this game and want to progress to the next level understand that it is a competitive environment that requires both talent and hard work. But they also understand that's not going to win them anything against the additional requirements for the proper and correct exposure...if that were not so there would be no need for PG, GWS, TBBF, Trombly, Norcal, USABB, etc. and don't tell me those organizations aren't marketing, selling their products...(players).
If a player doesn't get the right marketing and selling done on his behalf, in addition to him having the goods, his chances of being discovered go down considerably.
I really don't care about the definitions of all of this, and quite frankly, it makes no sense to me why it is an issue since we all know what's going on here is covered under all the terms that have been used so far.
Ramrod,
It may be the parent doing it - or the player - or both - but in any case - I agree with you. IMO - Nice post.
It may be the parent doing it - or the player - or both - but in any case - I agree with you. IMO - Nice post.
quote:Originally posted by itsinthegame:
Ramrod,
It may be the parent doing it - or the player - or both - but in any case - I agree with you. IMO - Nice post.
***********************************************
Happy New Year...
Sometimes in the past when interacting with you I get the feeling I'm in a parallel world with David Lightman...
Seattle high schooler David Lightman (Matthew Broderick) has only a few hours to undo what he thought was a sneak preview of an upcoming computer game but what instead got him tinkering with the U.S. Air Force's WOPR (War Operation Planned Response) computer system in such a way as to trigger a countdown to World War III. The FBI thinks he's a Soviet spy, while classmate Jennifer Mack (Ally Sheedy) is wondering if this isn't all really about a rejiggered biology grade.
I'm still trying to decide if every post will get a metaphoric response from WOPR would you like to play a game...?
Then it seems like I've selected "Theormal Nuclear War".
Hey WOPR ...how about a good game of "tick-tack-toe?"
Shall we play?
RR,
Like I said - I thought your post was a good one.
(I dont know anything about Thermo Nuclear War, the Mr. Lightman character or the movie. Sheedy aint bad though IMO)
Like I said - I thought your post was a good one.
(I dont know anything about Thermo Nuclear War, the Mr. Lightman character or the movie. Sheedy aint bad though IMO)
Just kidding around with you...
Have a good day.
peace
Have a good day.
peace
Ramrod
Good points. You’ve made me think. Still, I can’t help but wonder if more and more parents feel the need to “take control of things” because it appears that everyone else is doing it and if they don’t, their son will be left behind.
Parents need to be involved in the selection process, but also need to understand that there is a line between positive and negative impact. That “line” is hard to define, but it definitely exists and is frequently crossed by parents with the best intentions.
Good points. You’ve made me think. Still, I can’t help but wonder if more and more parents feel the need to “take control of things” because it appears that everyone else is doing it and if they don’t, their son will be left behind.
Parents need to be involved in the selection process, but also need to understand that there is a line between positive and negative impact. That “line” is hard to define, but it definitely exists and is frequently crossed by parents with the best intentions.
RR dead on.
Liberty I think you are on the right track.
This is an important process and I would never leave it soley to my son. In all honesty my son and I picked the schools to market to. It was me who talked e-mailed and sent DVD to. My son was busy working and playing ball,basket ball weight training and enjoying time with his friends.
If your son has not got the goods no marketing will help in 99% of the cases. Most people are talking about over selling, puffery and being blinded by the light emminating from their sons. No decent coach will listen to that.
Marketing includes all the things you do to creat interest in your ball player. When the interest is shown you start selling and lets not get selling confused with BS and over zealous parent. Most coaches want to see the goods which is part of selling . You and your son have a role in that by his performance and both of you answering the coaches concern and questions.
You and the coach are looking for the same thing. He wants a great ball player and you want to give him one. When he is convinced you close the deal by negotiating the price.
I did push a little hard in one case "indian Hills Cam Walker" and he just told me I didn't have to say another word. He didn't slam the phone down and say another dad looking through rose coloured glasses. He called me back after looking at the DVD and made an offer. That was the only time I pushed a little hard. It was hard to get a very great and busy coach to stop and look at the DVD.
Liberty I think you are on the right track.
This is an important process and I would never leave it soley to my son. In all honesty my son and I picked the schools to market to. It was me who talked e-mailed and sent DVD to. My son was busy working and playing ball,basket ball weight training and enjoying time with his friends.
If your son has not got the goods no marketing will help in 99% of the cases. Most people are talking about over selling, puffery and being blinded by the light emminating from their sons. No decent coach will listen to that.
Marketing includes all the things you do to creat interest in your ball player. When the interest is shown you start selling and lets not get selling confused with BS and over zealous parent. Most coaches want to see the goods which is part of selling . You and your son have a role in that by his performance and both of you answering the coaches concern and questions.
You and the coach are looking for the same thing. He wants a great ball player and you want to give him one. When he is convinced you close the deal by negotiating the price.
I did push a little hard in one case "indian Hills Cam Walker" and he just told me I didn't have to say another word. He didn't slam the phone down and say another dad looking through rose coloured glasses. He called me back after looking at the DVD and made an offer. That was the only time I pushed a little hard. It was hard to get a very great and busy coach to stop and look at the DVD.