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Here is a twist.  ball in glove, pitcher bent over glove resting on knee as he takes the signs.  after signs, pitcher reaches into glove, removes the ball and then rejoins ball and glove at traditional set position as he moved feet closet together.  I have seen some argue that the removal of the ball is a balk as it simulates the start of the pitch.  Others argue that the pitch is not started as he can not pitch from the position being bent over and taking the signs, there is no intent to deceive the runner.  I take the position that as long as it is consistently done on every pitch from the stretch, then no balk.   Thoughts?

Originally Posted by NewUmpire:

Here is a twist.  ball in glove, pitcher bent over glove resting on knee as he takes the signs.  after signs, pitcher reaches into glove, removes the ball and then rejoins ball and glove at traditional set position as he moved feet closet together.  I have seen some argue that the removal of the ball is a balk as it simulates the start of the pitch.  Others argue that the pitch is not started as he can not pitch from the position being bent over and taking the signs, there is no intent to deceive the runner.  I take the position that as long as it is consistently done on every pitch from the stretch, then no balk.   Thoughts?


I've always had a problem with the "does it every pitch" philosophy. My question would be, what do you do on the very first pitch if it is technically a balk? Obviously the first itme it is done, you don't yet know if the pitcher does it on every pitch. Regardless, I've never seen why that would matter - it's either a balk by a rule, or it isn't.

Originally Posted by NewUmpire:

 I take the position that as long as it is consistently done on every pitch from the stretch, then no balk.   Thoughts?

My thought is that you should take a different position.

 

Doing something illegal "every time" doesn't make it legal.

 

And, varying the routine (as long as all steps are legal) doesn't make the move illegal, either (to address another myth coaches and some umpires mention)

Originally Posted by JWC1022:

Rule 6-2-4-e does not address removal of the ball from the glove while engaged with the rubber. I understand he can not remove his hand from his glove without the ball.  However, with the ball in his glove can he remove the ball from his glove while engaged with the rubber prior to coming to a set position?

Yes, the rule does address removing the ball from the glove while engaged with the rubber.

 

Notice how you had to change the word before "hand" from "a" to "his" in order to make the distinction between the ball being in the hand and being in the glove?  

 

Read the description of the set position in 6-1-3. About halfway through that paragraph is a sentence that reads, "He shall come to a complete and discernible stop (a change of direction is not considered an acceptable stop" with the ball in both hands in front of the body and his glove at or below his chin."

 

From that phrasing, we can discern that the ball in the glove is also in the glove hand.

The prohibition against removing "a hand" from the ball is another way of saying the pitcher can't break his hands.

 

Another way to look at it is that, if a pitcher assumes the set position with the ball in his glove, his reach with his bare hand into the glove is his stretch--and he's only allowed one stretch.  Once he makes that stretch, he has to keep his hands together until he initiates a subsequent legal action: stepping off, making a pitch, throwing to a base, or making a feint to second or third.

Last edited by Swampboy

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