baseball bat advice

I'm looking for an answer to this too. My son is 14, pretty big, hits the ball hard and really likes the Demarini Vexxum; which has a lot of flex. He's used several different Demarini Voodoos but never hit well with them.

I don't know enough about bats to give good advice. My kid likes the Vexxum, hits well with it and it's cheaper than a lot of other bats.

So, unless a convincing argument is made for some other bat, I guess my son will continue to use what he's most comfortable with.

I wish I knew more about other brands, any advice or recommendations are greatly appreciated.

I was involved with a research group (at my universityin the Biomechanics of Human Movement Dept.) and we created a Finite Element Analysis model of a rotating bat meeting a moving ball and predicted that the increase in batted-ball speed gained by accounting for flex in wood and aluminum youth baseball bats would only be in the amount of about 0.4 mph. The research study concluded that whip action did not significantly contribute to final batted-ball speed for wood and aluminum baseball bats and the "theory" behind these 'great' youth bats could simply be ignored.

Also, keep in mind that a "stiffer" bat typically will have a wider sweet spot anyways.. Assuming all other properties being equal (i.e., two bats have the same weight, the same moment-of-inertia and the same trampoline effect in the barrel), research suggests that a rigid bat and a flexible bat would produce the same batted-ball speeds for impacts at the sweet spot. However, results of study suggest that stiffer bats would have a WIDER sweet spot. If a stiffer bat is more rigid and does not vibrate as easily, so that less energy is transferred to bat vibrations, then the final ball speed would be higher for impacts away from the sweet spot, than for a flexible bat.

JMO, but my opinion is research based...

Don't drink the kool-aid, just teach your son proper mechanics....

DCH's info sounds about right from what I have read. If you are buying a top end bat (Stealth, etc.) fine. It will not cover for mechanical flaws, but the top end bats do seem to have a little more carry to them. Here's the thing. Your son needs to handle and swing a bat before you buy it. It's all about feel. If he likes the way it feels, he'll feel good about hitting with it. And that is the most important thing.

if you think about it logically, parents, if your son generates enough torque (bend) in these new youth bats that bend occurs, what makes you think it would "whip" back right before contact - it would still be in bending phase, as contact occurs over plate (away) to just a handful of inches in front of plate (inside). If your son was generating good batspeed, he would have to stop/start slowing down bat so it could "whip back."

On every study done, the "whipping back" of barrel happended AFTER contact... 100% of the time....

DCH - Your explanations that there is not a significant difference in batted ball speed make sense to me. Do you have an opinion on how whether or not there is a different "feel" at contact?

I would assume if you hit in seet spot it would all feel the same... haven't hit a ball with an alum bat in years...

Good information, thanks for the responses.

Ranger - I know the 2009 blue stealth is end weighted due to the higher MOI. The 2010 model has a lower MOI and therefore feels and swings a bit lighter. Easton is the only company I know to date that lists it's bats MOI which I think is very important, especially for the younger, weaker kids just moving up to a -3.

DCH,

Your study is either :

1) Flawed or
2) An examination of a less than quality swing

In a quality swing, the bat not only catches up with the initial base or hands propulsion, it surpasses hand speed due to angular and centripetal acceleration just previous to contact. (Second whip forward)

This is the entire reason that bats, hammers and the like have the greater weight at the far end.

Chuck that waste of time study and start over again.

Use a golf club (preferably a driver) and then apply the findings to a quality swing in baseball.

Q-
ur ignorance is greatly shown by much of what you always say...

show me your study done that shows that bat head "whips" back right before contact - and independent study...

what if player swung bat at said speed and ball way "away" more than he thought or "in" a bit closer than player thought.. how does the bat whip back at the right time... how does bat know when ball is away or in? because from launch to contact the time would be different for each of those balls....

Bat Head Progression

1)Hands propel base of bat into swing causing bat head to lag or bend backwards.

2) At extension, bat head catches up to hands in swing.

3) Right after exrtension, bat head speeds up (whips forward further) into contact.

4) After contact the bat head would then slow along with the swing followthrough returning to normal state.

Some good Mantle pics of bat head reacting in swing

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=etSfBwcNpII


http://hsbaseballweb.com/eve/f...371073172#8371073172

Golf? I agree that flexible golf club shafts during the swing and the flex and "whip action" is quite important in golf club shafts, and a golfer who can time his/her swing just right can take advantage of shaft flex to hit the ball farther.

But Q, even high school physics students know that golf shafts are much more flexible than baseball or softball bats. Did you know, Q, that you can actually take a golf driver (say a 3-wood) by the handle and shake it back and forth and actually see and feel the club shaft flex and bend while you are shaking it.

Talk about apples and oranges....

Q- Dr. Nobles did his research for Easton in early 90's... ALL, 100%, of "whip action" in the bats occured after point of impact.... sorry....

Q- you have YouTube, this is what "we" have... but we are flawed, right? I will leave out institution name... I am sure you can google somehow to figure out where this is... good luck... I am sorry, who do you do your "studies" for again?
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Mission Statement
The mission of the *** Baseball Research Center is to be a Center of Excellence for the Science and Engineering of Baseball for both experimental and analytical methods.

Currently, the Center is concentrating on baseball bat performance and durability, and the Center is the official certification center for all NCAA baseball bats and Major League Baseball bats.

The Center also has complete baseball testing services including, ASTM and MLB COR testing, pill drop testing, and baseball dissection.
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Q- I see you on here dropping your knowledge to everyone... are you certified by either NCAA or MLB... do you do any work for them, do they listen to anything you have to say? If so, send me your info and we'll meet up at next meeting...

Most studies here are done at 4,000 frames per sec

You were faster than I was in posting my Mantle examples.

It seems your study was flawed at its inception because it was trying to prove that baseball bats lacked great flexibility.

You Tube or any video shows the distortion in the bat

As in any study, Garbage In = Garbage Out

yeah Q... NCAA and MLB should are idiots for doing this kind os stuff with "us"... what do they know about baseball....

This is a great new, end weighted stiff handled, bat.

I bought one, my 14u hit one last night over the 375 sign.

Lot of engineering behind this bat ought to take a look, several on the team use it now...

http://www.justbats.com/product.view.aspx?p=9520


The unprecedented strength of the revolutionary NanoTek Alloy allows us to build a bat with the thinnest wall in the game. The strength of the NanoTek Alloy has helped create a Launch Pad sweet spot. The NanoTek Alloy stores more energy at contact and delivers superior performance, improved feel and twice the effective hitting area of the competition. Unlike composites that gradually rise to a short-lived maximum potential,

quote:

Originally posted by Diablo con Huevos:
yeah Q... NCAA and MLB should are idiots for doing this kind os stuff with "us"... what do they know about baseball....

Apparently not very much.

Academia brought us the pronouncements that curve balls do not actually curve and batted baseballs do not travel more than 500 feet.

Adair and others may be very learned men but they should not involve themselves in anything other than the theoretical.

Leave actual physical activity and mechanical experimentation to those better suited to the task.

"Stand behind a tree 60 feet away, and I'll whomp you with an optical illusion!"

In 1949 Ralph B. Lightfoot, an aeronautical engineer at Sikorsky Aircraft, used wind tunnel tests to prove that a curve ball actually curves and is not an optical illusion

Baseball bats whip after contact when the hands roll over, unless you want the hands to start rolling before contact. Golf clubs whip because they have an angled head the you turn back (unroll) and you roll the wrist during contact. If you dont, you get a slice. Its funny how gullable people are. Every year there is something new.

quote:

Academia brought us the pronouncements that curve balls do not actually curve and batted baseballs do not travel more than 500 feet.

Q- yeah, I don't really remember that, but I know it started in about 1877... and then was debunked, again, in the 40's... thank goodness that now, in 2009, we have better technologuy than we did in the 1870's and 1940's... ummm Magnus effect... we all get that now Q..

Fortunetly, through TODAYS technology, we were able to analyze over 15,000 Major League swings at 4,000 frames per second... everyone of them, 100%, the woodbat didn't "whip" back until after contact and the length of time to the "whipping back" in youth bats was even longer....

The whole reason a bat bends is inertia... the only reason it would "whip back" in line with barrel, is because of deceleration of hands..... just like the only reason you would get jolted to dash of car is by slamming on brakes....

so feel free to teach your hitters to try and time that "whip back" while trying to hit a baseball. Should make for a fun summer...

I think that "whip" and bat blurr is created by wrists.

At your next meeting of "Meddling Mental Midgets", at 4,000 frames per second develop a concensus concerning your findings.

Using Inertia as the cause of the bat head trailing the lighter faster base being propelled in a circular motion, please have your group determine the benefits of making contact with the target at a less than 90 degree angle in the arc of travel of the bat head to the target (ball).

Further, explain the elastic tendencies of the materials used in the bat.

Further still, you may want to point out that bats of certain materials lack elastic strength and thus will shatter due to the forces placed on the elastic deficient areas of the bat.

In your acceleration example, you make plain that objects not accelerating will be dragged behind the accelerating body or will be left behind. The method you are proposing has the bat making contact while the bat is still facing backwards because it has yet to catch up with the original accelerating body, the base of the bat.

In the strong front side or stong front foot, your method would have a better chance at reaching a 90 degree contact point generating a larger amount of force into contact. But this is not what you are promoting.

Have a meeting, make a film of the swing you endorse and then sit and laugh at yourselves for trying to make contact with a bat that is bent backwards.

LAball,

if your wrists are rolling, your swing is bad. Your wrists have the capability to move an object held in the hands in over a 180 degree arc with no roll.

quote:

Sikorsky Aircraft

Quincy

quote:

the elastic

Quote by Quincy

quote:

elastic tendencies

Not to jump in on the argument but adults can obviously get some bat whip.Not sure if a youth can create that much torque or not and really could care less.

But,when I saw this pic while surfing,I thought about this thread and thought I would share.

Thats pretty amazing stuff there! Who is at bat here?

most likely Kendry Morales

This photo shows a ball after contact. the ball is traveling away from the bat. The bend you see is a result of the swing and the contact with the ball.

It is also a wood bat which have completely different dynamics compared to metal/composite bats.

The bat is bent because the weight of the bat head has yet to catch up with the speed of the hands ( and possibly hip turn)

The best part of this swing will happen after contact, so the greatest force generated is wasted.

Relative to COP and sweet spot dynamics.