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bat speed

T tfox100+ posts
Where does bat speed come from?


Does it come from hip rotation,shoulder rotation,strength,core strength,core rotation,hand torque or a combination.

My son although very young,exibits great bat speed.Where does he get it? He gets great bat speed whether he is swinging with the bat rested on his shoulders or not.So imo,it is not handle torque,although I feel it is a big part of a good contact/power swing.
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SA S. Abrams100+ posts
tfox,

What age are we talking about? Don't want to rain on the parade, but until he is swinging a -3 bat it's difficult to judge just how great is great.

Torque is important but there are basically several parts of the body that torque and all are extremely important as none by themselves accomplishes much. Your thought about combination is absolutely correct. Your son may have a better handle on the basics of the swing than others his age, resulting in a superior batspeed to his peers.

Great that you're teaching rotational to your son. Good luck.
T tfox100+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by S. Abrams:
tfox,

What age are we talking about? Don't want to rain on the parade, but until he is swinging a -3 bat it's difficult to judge just how great is great.

Torque is important but there are basically several parts of the body that torque and all are extremely important as none by themselves accomplishes much. Your thought about combination is absolutely correct. Your son may have a better handle on the basics of the swing than others his age, resulting in a superior batspeed to his peers.

Great that you're teaching rotational to your son. Good luck.


He is 9 and has been using a -9 bat from the time he was 6 and is still using one.I am not a fan of the -12 bats but he did use one when he was 5 and 6.



How much does quick hands play into it and does the quick hands come from something else.


I can say this,too much tension will destroy batspeed,and we showed this to my son with a radar.Gave him a plastic hitting stick and let him see how fast he could get the speed,he ranged from 35mph with tension(told him to swing for a homerun) all the way up to 69 mph without tension(told him to relax and just LET IT GO).This might have been the single best drill we ever did with him,that was instant and positive feedback and he has gotten quicker ever since.


I have a couple videos of him if interested but the question was more in general and not about him per say,I was just referencing him.
Last edited by tfox
T tfox100+ posts
So in your opinion,it is a naturall gift.

I would agree with that to a point but I also feel that it can be improved.

Muscle memory would be key,so when the swing starts,the body is doing it naturally.

That is the main reason for the question,what would you specifically target to improve bat speed if it isn't something done "naturally"?
Last edited by tfox
C coachbwww100+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by tfox:
So in your opinion,it is a naturall gift.

I would agree with that to a point but I also feel that it can be improved.

Muscle memory would be key,so when the swing starts,the body is doing it naturally.

That is the main reason for the question,what would you specifically target to improve bat speed if it isn't something done "naturally"?


At age 9, it's still too early to tell. Would you please post a picture of your son? I would like to see his physical build, especially his neck to head circumference ratio. This will give me an idea whether his a "natural" or just a big kid.
C coachbwww100+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by tfox:
Not really a big kid but is one of the best athletes in his age group regardless of the sport.You should see him rebound a basketball,even against tye BIG kids.That is where HIS explosiveness shows up.


He looks good. I noticed he is playing in the Little League, right? You better find him a travel team in the USSSA OR AAU etc soon. Those LL teams play in the small field and follow the Cal Ripken rule just can't match up with any of the travel teams out there. And the competition level is very low at LL. If you believe in your son's ability, you better move out of the LL soon.
Last edited by coachbwww
T tfox100+ posts
Actually he is in cal ripken and we play against travel teams and even beat a few of them. The picture was from a usssa tournament where we were the runner ups and 1 hit away from winning it.

I am going to let him enjoy playing with his friends for a little while longer before getting into that kind of arena.

His team is one of the best in the region,we actually won state and came in 2nd in the region and lost to the same team we beat for state.

Call me crazy but I like the rec ball,all star way of doing things,maybe the level of competition isn't as high all the time but I feel there is more enjoyment for the kids,PLUS he is playing with all the same kids that will be on the highschool team together some day,(if they stick with it)
P Pronk10+ posts
It's been my experience that in fact the old 200 foot LL home runs are not easy pop flies in Pony. When the fence goes from 200 to 300 that implies a ton of ground to cover. What I generally see is a lot of the kids that were hitting homers are now hitting doubles.

There are a few exceptions notably the pubescent 12 who is 5'-9" and just muscled some balls over, those kids don't do as well in Pony. But where I live the kids who hit 10+ homers in LL are killing it in travel ball/Pony too.
B bbdoug10+ posts
I do get tired of people pumping the virtues of travel ball over LL and Ripken. I coached LL for six years and saw a lot of kids who were serious studs then and now go through the program without ever playing travel. My son played travel last year for the first time as a 13yo on a very good travel team. I know a number of other kids who could have, but didn't for one reason or another (mostly expense and travel). Most of the kids on his travel team came out of local LL and Ripken leagues and had never played travel before.

Incidentally, my son won't be playing travel again any time soon. There are better opportunities locally that don't cost as much and we won't spend our summer travelling from one tournament to another.

I found that onset of puberty had an awful lot to do with who were LL studs, but late bloomers were able to hold their own if they had good coaching. Very few of the kids who go on to be studs at older ages had much difficulty transitioning to the big field or playing against serious competition. Let the kids have fun. Those who are destined to do so will play at higher levels. HS is when they have to start taking it all a bit more seriously.
Last edited by bbdoug
BOFBOF10,000+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by coachbwww:

He looks good. I noticed he is playing in the Little League, right? You better find him a travel team in the USSSA OR AAU etc soon. Those LL teams play in the small field and follow the Cal Ripken rule just can't match up with any of the travel teams out there. And the competition level is very low at LL. If you believe in your son's ability, you better move out of the LL soon.


Get a life, I see posts like this too many clueless people. He is 9! Have him play rec ball have some fun, learn to love and enjoy the game, play with his local friends. When he is 13 and getting ready for HS then consider other alternatives.
SA S. Abrams100+ posts
bbdoug,

Used to give a speech to parents up to 13U Travel....gist of it was that there was nothing that was going to happen on the field this year that had any bearing whatsoever in your son playing HS baseball. No success or failure they experience on the field this summer is going to help or hurt your son in making the HS team. Nothing...Nada. So sit back and just enjoy the opportunity of watching your son play baseball and don't get too wrapped up in things. The HS coach doesn't care what happens with our kids this year; he hasn't asked me for a list of prospects in case you are wondering.

Until all our little darlings have gone through puberty, alot this won't matter. Puberty and growth spurts are going to the great equalizers in a couple years. After puberty, baseball is going to be the least of our worries.

Ohh, we'll coach and you guys cheer...it works better that way. (Actually this was the important part).
J jja10+ posts
It also depends on your local high school. Here in Southern California the competition is really fierce just to make the freshman team. 42 kids tried out last year, cut to 17. A lot of very good players got cut. If you have that type of competition, your child needs more games than little league typically provides. I'm not a big proponent of travel ball per se (I don't think the coaching in general is that much better than little league, I think there is an over-emphasis on winning over skill development, etc.) but what is really good is the number of games played.

That's where the kids of today miss out compared to when many of us were young. Sure, we had little league, but kids got together on the weekend and played their own games independent of the adults. I played every Saturday from 9:00 often until it got dark with my friends. Gobs and gobs and gobs of games. These days kids don't get that. They only play games in little league. And the 20 games or so per season they get isn't enough to learn the game properly especially with so many kids on the team.

The key is to find a way to play a lot of games. That's how the kids learn. The more games they have under their belt by the time they get to high school, the better off they'll be. Travel ball is one way to get there, but if you can be clever and find other ways (pickup games every Sunday afternoon, whatever) that's fine as well.
Last edited by jja
B bbdoug10+ posts
I don't deny that reps are important, they are. But, they can get a lot of reps if the coaches know what they're doing and run their practices efficiently. That, it seems to me, is where LL or other town ball leagues sometimes fall down. The coaching is very uneven.

In our small town, six LL teams are feeding one JV team (no middle school or freshman team). The kids typically have a year (8th grade) when they play 13-15 Babe Ruth only. Some of the 8th graders are good enough to play JV.

Last year our V team had 4 seniors who had ever played outside the local leagues and HS, 3 played Legion and 1 played on a "showcase" travel team the summer before their senior year. No one else on the team had ever played outside local ball. The team took 2nd in a very competitive section and came one out away from taking it all. One of the kids who played Legion wound up being the regional player of the year.

This little recitation is just to show that travel isn't that big a deal. You don't need it to play very competitive ball. The single most imporant determinant is whether the local community has enough interest to promote baseball and encourage quality coaching in the town leagues. As far as I can see, there is always enough raw talent, if it can be nurtured along to HS where a good coach can develop it into a competitive team.
T tfox100+ posts
My son played 60 games last year as an 8 year old off a machine,this year is live pitch.There were basically 3 season,spring,all star and fall ball.I really like this way of doing things.


And to watch how some of the travels teams acted in an 8 year old league was absolutley disgusting,heck,It would be a disgrace for college fans to act the way some of the parents and coaches acted.

No way am I getting into that with my son,especially at such a young age.


When we won state,we built a friendship with the team we beat and when we faced them again at regionals,we were like old friends.They actually cheered with us when we played to see who met them in the championship game.When it was over,we got team pictures with BOTH teams in them. Wink


I don't know if I would call my son a "stud" but he is very talented and the sky is the limit as long as he keeps wanting to reach for it.
B bbdoug10+ posts
60 games as an 8yo? No offense, but that sounds whacky. Also, you have at least four years to wait before you will have any idea whether he will be a stud at the HS level.

It's good you can maintain friendly relations with other 8yo teams and their parents. Allowing the kids to have fun at that age without adult melt downs is the best you can hope for.
T tfox100+ posts
We had that many because we were winning several games at every tournament we went to and we only played all star for 4-5 weeks I believe.



The last 10 or 12 games were fall ball instructional league,no umps.ALL FUN based.When he got finished,he was still excited about playing.Fall ball was new because it was a pitching league and he had been on a machine all season,that was exciting.

There probably won't be that many games next year,but we will see.

I am not claiming him to be a stud now or when/if he will play at the high school level.

I just started this thread about bat speed and why does one have it and another not,I just used him as an example because he has it,atleast for now he does.
W wogdoggy500+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by jja:
It also depends on your local high school. Here in Southern California the competition is really fierce just to make the freshman team. 42 kids tried out last year, cut to 17. A lot of very good players got cut. If you have that type of competition, your child needs more games than little league typically provides. I'm not a big proponent of travel ball per se (I don't think the coaching in general is that much better than little league, I think there is an over-emphasis on winning over skill development, etc.) but what is really good is the number of games played.

That's where the kids of today miss out compared to when many of us were young. Sure, we had little league, but kids got together on the weekend and played their own games independent of the adults. I played every Saturday from 9:00 often until it got dark with my friends. Gobs and gobs and gobs of games. These days kids don't get that. They only play games in little league. And the 20 games or so per season they get isn't enough to learn the game properly especially with so many kids on the team.

The key is to find a way to play a lot of games. That's how the kids learn. The more games they have under their belt by the time they get to high school, the better off they'll be. Travel ball is one way to get there, but if you can be clever and find other ways (pickup games every Sunday afternoon, whatever) that's fine as well.



great points jja the games give them a jump on experience but when puberty hits can be a big factor for many incoming freshman,,once the a nd b teams get set freshman year it becomes very difficult to make the one sophomore team the next year no matter how much you grew over the summer,,,my sons freshman year had 120 kids tryout for two teams

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