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29 replies

Being hit twice- one at bat

BB Bubble Butt100+ posts
During our last JV game, i was batting cleanup. the pitcher (who wasnt very good) threw an inside breaking ball and i smashed it over the fence, barely foul. the next pitch appears to be a breaking ball in the same spot. i got ready to swing, waiting for it to break, but it never did, it hit me in the square of the back as i was turning (i had just realized it wasnt going to break). so i toss my bat and start to trot down to first...

the homeplate umpire yells at me to come back to the plate because, in his opinion, i had made no attempt to move. my first question- is there really a rule stating that a hit batter can be called back into the box because in the umps opinion he made no attempt to move?

so on the next pitch, after our coach complained very lightly, very lightly i must stress, the pitcher beans me again, it ended up hitting me right on the base of the neck (this breaking ball broke). i waited a second for the call to go to first or stay because i was a little apprehensive due to the previous call.

i then looked back at the ump. not in an angry way, i wasnt really mad or anything- i wanted swings anyway, i was just wondering what he was gonna do with me. he sent me to first. after the game he told the varsity head coach that i had looked back at him and that if i ever did it again he would toss me from the game and write me up to be suspended...

does anyone have any thoughts on this?
The butt... it talks...
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Bulldog 19Bulldog 195,000+ posts
I'm glad when I got hit last year that the umpire wasn't that strict about having to make an attempt to move. Of course, I did know the guy and it busted my lip pretty good so either of those could have played a part in itWink

Inside curve ball that ended up not breaking. I guess part of the reason for that might have been that my jaw was in the way, or it just wasn't going to break off.

I didn't move at all until after the ball hit. And then I hit the dirt very quickly.
piaa_umppiaa_ump5,000+ posts
Being somewhat short of stature...I know of Napoleon....and he was never an umpire...and umpires who enforce this rule are not being Napoleon.....

to the rule....

NFHS Rule 7 section 3 article 4

A batter shall not:

Article 4- Permit a pitched ball to touch him.

For permitting a pitched ball to touch him, the batter will be returned to the plate and the pitch called a ball or strike accordingly....

Now that being said, I am known to award a HBP pretty liberally....
Last edited by piaa_ump
AR ASU RAM FAN100+ posts
PIAA _ I know this is a High School Baseball site, but was wondering if you could tell me what the rules are for college. Last weekend, in a college game, one of the players (Rh batter) allowed a LHP curveball to hit him in the lower leg without moving.

the umpire called it a ball. After the coach had a heated discussion with him, the 2 umpires discussed it and then sent the batter to first. The head coach was telling him there was not rule for his initial decision.
piaa_umppiaa_ump5,000+ posts
Ram Fan,
Absolutely......Coach was correct. NCAA rule is different......

NCAA rule 8-2d A batter hit by a pitch is awarded first unless the pitch is a strike.

exception: the umpires should not award first to a batter "who intentionally gets touched by moving or rolling" into the pitch.

Also: A batter legally in the box does not have to avoid a pitch that is "clearly inside the vertical lines of the batters box... the ball is dead and the batter awarded first....NCAA feels if the batter is completely in the box and gets hit by a pitch, then it is the pitchers fault and the batter should be awarded first..

Hope this helps.
Last edited by piaa_ump
BB Bubble Butt100+ posts
its really not like i was trying to get hit, just the opposite, i was trying to hit. and if the ball hit me square in the back doesnt that constitute an attempt to move, i did turn my body. i probably shouldve made that more clear. but it was as i was going forward (towards home).

and today after our game my coach said that the ump then went on to tell our coaches that they shouldnt coach us to try to get hit. now, i hope im not the only one that sees anything wrong with this statement. our coach was obviously taken-a-back, he had just called us cheaters to our face. but how in the heck, in three pitches, in high school can you hit a batter twice and still be a pitcher? perhaps it isnt a question of me trying to get hit, rather a question of the pitcher trying to hit me...
Michael S. TaylorMichael S. Taylor1,000+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by ASU RAM FAN:
PIAA _ I know this is a High School Baseball site, but was wondering if you could tell me what the rules are for college. Last weekend, in a college game, one of the players (Rh batter) allowed a LHP curveball to hit him in the lower leg without moving.

the umpire called it a ball. After the coach had a heated discussion with him, the 2 umpires discussed it and then sent the batter to first. The head coach was telling him there was not rule for his initial decision.


In the NCAA question PIAA is right. The problem is it used to be that way for years, then several years ago they changed it to the OBR form, kept it a year or two then changed it back to it's present form. It confused many a coach that doesn't stay current on the rules. Unfortunayely there are more than a couple umpires in the same boat.
Last edited by Michael S. Taylor
U UTBaseball10+ posts
PIAA,

I have a question in regard to article 4. Before I ask, I know that you said you award bases pretty liberally, but here it is:

As it appears that BB has also been taught to stay in and hit the ball; we teach our players that curve balls from a RHP that start over the plate are probably going to be an outside pitch at the plate and that a curve that starts shoulder height and inside on you will probably break over the plate for a strike. Therefore, we teach them to stay in and not be fooled by the curve and hit it. Sometimes a curve won't curve and you wind up getting hit and appear to not be trying to get out of the way. You were just trying to stay in and hit the ball. This is the pitchers fault for throwing a bat pitch not the batters fault. When you are talking about fractions of a second and a batter wants to hit, you might take a few in the back every now and then. I can't see why BB was not awarded 1st base. My players will get hit a few times during the season because they are hitters and want every chance to hit the ball.

UTB
piaa_umppiaa_ump5,000+ posts
UT,
You have tapped into the exact area why I am known to pretty much liberally award a HBP. The players I have kept at the plate for failure to avoid are the ones who move or dip into a pitch to draw the HBP.

We teach players to stay in there... especially on curve balls until the ball breaks, and if the ball does not break there is usually precious little time to avoid the pitch.....I have seen players jellylegged by curves and downright frozen on fast balls....that even a flinch is enough for me to rule an attempt was made to avoid contact....

To Bulldog...no player in my mind gets hit in the face on purpose.....if a ball hits that area, I can be pretty sure of an attempt to get out of the way.......I would never hold a batter back after taking a head shot....

we know who the ones are that need to stay....the dipping elbow, the full turned back into the strike zone...or the knee extended to catch a pitch....
Last edited by piaa_ump
F FormerObserver1,000+ posts
quote:
we know who the ones are that need to stay....the dipping elbow, the full turned back into the strike zone...or the knee extended to catch a pitch....


My young son had a discussion about this with one of your comrads, just last spring.

He didn't have the last word, but he was right about his description of your comrads abilities.

Very nice thread.
Last edited by FormerObserver
Bulldog 19Bulldog 195,000+ posts
PIAA, I'll agree with that statement-- nobody tries getting hit in the face. Smile It HURTS! I've had it happen twice now.

As far as I'm concerned, a curve ball would be pretty hard for me to keep a batter at the plate because it can be hard to move on one. The only way I could see it is if they were to move toward the plate thinking it would go behind them. Then it might even be a strike!


We had an opposing batter today our pitching coach commented that he appeared to kick toward the plate with his back foot trying to get hit on the ball in the dirt. That'd be one to keep him on.
F fvb10100+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by piaa_ump:
we know who the ones are that need to stay....the dipping elbow, the full turned back into the strike zone...or the knee extended to catch a pitch....


My favorite is the kid who wears one of those big plastic elbow protectors and then sticks it out into a pitch and wants to argue with me when I tell him to stay in the box!
A archangel10+ posts
Bubble, you were there, I wasnt, but here's my take. You didnt like the call to come back on the 1st HBP- and the ump saw that. On the 2nd HBP, you looked at the ump the same way. If that actually happened, I prob would have warned you. Many HS players like to act like pros, and it wont fly.

Gloveman?--I dont get the Napolean opinion--I would have talked to his coach between innings, not after the game was over--warnings of ejections after the game are meaningless...
08Dad08Dad1,000+ posts
Regarding getting hit on a curveball - this dates way back to when I was playing (ok they had just come out with aluminum bats)...

I threw a curve ball at the hitter - he did a bow from the waist, trying to avoid the pitch... it snapped off and hit him in the helmet for a call strike three... His head was right over home plate- and with the bow - just about thigh high... I still laugh thinking about it...

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