Best use of Summer after senior year?

Given that the thread on Travel Ball has veered off topic a little bit toward issue about  summer play for  rising college frosh/graduating seniors, I thought it might be useful to revive this thread, which I started last summer

Sluggerdad, thanks for resurrecting the thread.  Seems our sons paths are similar. Working out, hitting, and throwing in his spare time.  Part time job for spending money.  And playing in a local wood bat league a few games a week.  Seems to be a good balance for him after the last 4-5 years.  

I saw the discussion shift on the other thread and was going to reply there but this looks like a better spot.  We were very happy to get off the tournament/showcase trail and settle into more of a normal life for this summer.  2016 signed with a college wood bat league that ran from the week his HS season ended through the end of July.  Looks like 32 games followed by playoffs for top 8 teams.  We're more than halfway through the season and the talent has been mixed.  It's college age to adult - there is one team that's NYC Police that was all adults.  Our team started as one of the lower teams with a lot of 2016 grads just joining but they've improved with experience and are now just one game below .500.  They play one or two games during the week and then double header on one weekend day with a couple extra make up games mixed in.  

He's a PO and was new to the league so it took some time for the coach to get to know him and now he goes for his one start per week and he works that out with the coach via text.  They play on the nicer local fields and it's a little more relaxed than tournament baseball.  Since this is the first summer he hasn't been on the road he's working and putting money away for school.  

Will he be ready for fall baseball when he gets on campus?  Not sure.  This was the best option he had for baseball by the time we got around to thinking about the summer.  He's pitching against a mix of D3, D2 and a few D1 players (and some former D3, 2, 1 players) and he's throwing a ton of strikes.  I was just looking to keep him in shape and throwing this summer until he get's on his new pitching coach's program this fall.  

I'll thank you as well for resurrecting this.  I have noticed that there are some rising freshmen on some of the collegiate summer league teams.   A pitcher for my son's travel team went to play in the coastal plains league as a HS graduate/rising freshman.  Not sure how common this is, but seems like an interesting option if it's available. 

Anyone that has experience with this scenario? 

HS seniors who desire to "compete" on a level playing field should prepare with the highest level of baseball possible. If you do not have a team, organize a team of graduating seniors who are "really" serious about advancing, rent a bus, call older teams to organize games withing 4 hours of your local city. This is "barnstorming" and learning.

Your goal is to improve your reflex action. No metal bats allowed.

Bob

Generally, the more established the summer league, the less likely you will see rising freshman.  There are exceptions and there are plenty of less formal or less established teams that will welcome those players.  Some college coaches will help place them but to a much lesser extent than with players already established in their programs.  Often, it is up to the player to find a spot.

My son took what amounted to a "little break" after his senior year.  He still played travel...but on a team that only played 5 weekends...and most were Friday-Sunday instead of Weds-Sun like we were used to the previous couple summers.  He hadn't had a real "summer" in 6 or 7 years....so we kind of went with his thinking that he just wanted to slow down a little bit.  As it turns out, it was probably a mistake.  I don't think he was really in great "baseball shape" when he got to school in September....and didn't have a great fall, which according to the coach essentially dropped him from the role the coach expected him to earn when he brought him into the program.  Winter workouts and spring practice helped....he did get in a good amount of innings on the mound this past season...the most of any freshman, but wasn't nearly as effective as he (or I'm sure the coaches) had hoped.   He went straight from his college season to his summer team....and things have done a complete turnaround.  His velocity is up....control has completely come back...and then some.   His walk-strikeout ratio in college was not good, and didn't start out great in the summer....walked 6 of the first 18 guys he faced in first 2 appearances.  Had a sit down with the PC who noticed a very, very minor thing.  Son changed it....and proceeded to go 51 straight batters without a walk...and only 3 of the last 94 guys. 

I guess the point is, knowing what I know now, I'd have your son(s) do whatever they were doing before they committed....and be ready to go when they get to school.  The fall is essentially the "tryout" for the position they'll be in the spring.  The lineup for spring was essentially set by the end of October.  Here in the north, there is very, very little outdoor time in the spring before the season starts....this year, my sons team was on the field 2 times before they headed to TN for opening weekend.  I really think if my son had been more "serious" last summer, his college results would have been better.  As they say....live and learn

pabaseballdad posted:

I'll thank you as well for resurrecting this.  I have noticed that there are some rising freshmen on some of the collegiate summer league teams.   A pitcher for my son's travel team went to play in the coastal plains league as a HS graduate/rising freshman.  Not sure how common this is, but seems like an interesting option if it's available. 

Anyone that has experience with this scenario? 

Yes, there are more leagues that take rising freshman than I thought.  They may not be the best leagues with the best competition, but it's still collegiate wood bat. 

When he gets on campus he needs to be ready for 6AM weight sessions where he'll hit the weights hard, then condition in the afternoon.  He'll be sore and tired.  He should ask his coach when the lifting sessions are, and if they are in the morning he should start lifting then during the summer.  That way he'll stand out from the other frosh as being ready.  First impressions go a long way.

I also suggest watching this video.  This was my son's room mate in college and he is now a top 10 prospect in the Rangers organization.  Here he talks about getting ready for college, what he did and what he wishes he had done.  The guy doing the interview can be a little much but the 20 minutes or so watching this will teach you both a whole lot.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iAz51vzFHP0

All the seniors from his high school played Legion together as one last harrah. They went to states. The limited schedule (compared to travel) allowed them to spend the summer focused on working out and getting stronger for college fall ball. All but one senior played somewhere at the next level.

Son's coach did not give a specific regimen, but gave two suggestions: Come September in Shape, and most importantly Healthy

I think it varies by program.  My son pitched nearly 75 innings in the spring HS season so HC and PC at future school wanted him to shut down.  Therefore he turned down a spot on a very competitive team that tries to make it to Connie Mack WS every year.  Would have been a lot of games and a ton of money for me so not really regretting it at this point.

I think they had at least one if not multiple freshman show up "worn out" last fall and they never really contributed last year at all.

Course this school also doesn't send a lot of their arms out for summer ball either, preferring that they spend summer training over playing to I am sure in their minds save wear and tear on arms.

It's interesting about the working out.  We have always been in support of 2016 lifting and thought that it was responsible for him getting his velo up (up for him which means D3 level).  His pitching coach for the HS is also a trainer and owns a gym and 2016 took to olympic weightlifting and qualified for USAW youth nationals which he competed in last summer.  I'm not sure if the lifting was holding him back rather than helping with velo.  

He lifted some in the off-season but not like the year prior and had his best and first injury free HS season ever.  He signed on to this wood bat college league for the summer and then started working out again - had his only loss one night after working out and then starting a game with what looked like dead legs.  Hasn't worked out much since then and has just looked better and better with each start.  He seems leaner and looser and looks to be throwing harder than ever.   

He does have a workout program that he's supposed to be doing for the fall but he says it's not very intense.  I think he may have been just lifting too much weight.  

It sounds like many responses are geared towards "balance" which I wholeheartedly support.  Working to make spending money, volunteering, refining baseball skills, strength and conditioning, playing some games, filling out all the forms for college including course selection, etc.

Regarding strength and conditioning, my RHP went to the Texas Baseball Ranch, and that throwing/pitching specific training was very valuable as opposed to "weight training".  Ditto for my middle infielder...he's doing MIF specific strength and conditioning at a training center that is optimized for college and pro athletes.

I see a lot of local kids exclusively playing a lot of Summer games only.  That was not our approach.

Where do I as a hitter learn what the pitcher will throw me on a 2-0 count unless I faced him previously?

get stronger or quicker, mentally or physically? play the game on the field!

Bob

Son will be graduating spring of 2017.  His older sister planning a trip to Costa Rica after graduation then onto I hope getting ready for college ball in a collegiate league.  

2ndMarDiv posted:

Son will be graduating spring of 2017.  His older sister planning a trip to Costa Rica after graduation then onto I hope getting ready for college ball in a collegiate league.  

Rising freshman dont get ready for fall in a collegiate league. You get ready by spending time in the gym, taking a class, etc.

They have no clue whats ahead of them, and neither do most folks here that havent experienced a child who will play a sport in college.

Amen to that!

Seth Beer spent last summer playing for the Evoshield Canes.  This spring he was one of the top players in college baseball. He spent last summer hitting against many of the best HS arms in the country.

Summer is and has always been... Baseball season.  I can understand why some might not play, but to me it is like a football player taking off the fall.

There is an off season, but it ain't in the summer.  Why wouldn't someone entering college play against the best possible competition to get ready.  Isn't there a reason to improve your game.  To me, there is no training that can replace actually playing the game.  There is plenty of time to train during the off season.

All that said, I do believe there are pitchers that would be wise to take that final summer off.  Especially if they racked up a lot of innings in the spring. For most everyone else, it is the middle of the baseball season!  People are playing and trying to get better.  Someone you will be competing against is getting in game at bats against the best pitchers in the country.  What training is there that can replace that?

Sorry, but to me the first summer anyone takes off for any reason other than injury, should be when you are done playing baseball.  It seems like lots of people play just to get recruited and then forgot why and how they got recruited.  The player got to that point by playing.  Then to play a short HS season and take the summer off before the next level?  Why not continue the path that got you to this point and keep getting better?

Everyone is welcome to their opinion, but IMO, when the entire country is in the middle of baseball season, baseball players should be playing baseball.

Trying to think ahead to next summer- I have a 2017 son that will be heading south, and have been keeping tabs on other players heading to D1 programs from our area.  It appears that many of these schools are having the kids come in early- they've told my son to be prepared to show up first week of July.  So that's what he'll do.  But in this scenario, they aren't playing baseball- they are taking a couple of summer school courses, and hitting the gym, correct?     He'll play up until the time he leaves for school, but it's going to make for a pretty short summer season.

From what I hear they'll get all the baseball they need in fall ball!

I say balance, not take the Summer off. 

Most players aren't the best players in the country. Many like my two boys need to work and make money for school. One of my guys needs to take a summer class.  We go to church on Sunday's.  My guys are training too. And are playing games against very good competition, they're just not doing that exclusively. 

Didn't realize the Canes had an 18u team.

pabaseballdad posted:

Trying to think ahead to next summer- I have a 2017 son that will be heading south, and have been keeping tabs on other players heading to D1 programs from our area.  It appears that many of these schools are having the kids come in early- they've told my son to be prepared to show up first week of July.  So that's what he'll do.  But in this scenario, they aren't playing baseball- they are taking a couple of summer school courses, and hitting the gym, correct?     He'll play up until the time he leaves for school, but it's going to make for a pretty short summer season.

From what I hear they'll get all the baseball they need in fall ball!

 

 

Yup, this is pretty common these days.

FWIW, pitchers need time off.  Especially if tjey put in a lot of innings.

But one of the more important reasons is that injuries happen. No one wants to spend the fall looming from the outside in.

JMO, but we cant keep using phenoms as examples. The majority of players will never see even a milb.  This is about using time wisely before college begins.

Come in 1st week of July, take two classes, make A's in the classes to counter-act possible lower grades in the Fall/Spring, work out, help at baseball camps, meet your fellow freshman teammates, acclimate yourself to campus/campus life, don't make a fool of yourself toward coaches/your freshman and non-freshman teammates!!!! (some/many of your non-freshman teammates may not be on campus until August though)

TPM posted:

pabaseballdad posted:

Trying to think ahead to next summer- I have a 2017 son that will be heading south, and have been keeping tabs on other players heading to D1 programs from our area.  It appears that many of these schools are having the kids come in early- they've told my son to be prepared to show up first week of July.  So that's what he'll do.  But in this scenario, they aren't playing baseball- they are taking a couple of summer school courses, and hitting the gym, correct?     He'll play up until the time he leaves for school, but it's going to make for a pretty short summer season.

From what I hear they'll get all the baseball they need in fall ball!

 

 

Yup, this is pretty common these days.

FWIW, pitchers need time off.  Especially if tjey put in a lot of innings.

But one of the more important reasons is that injuries happen. No one wants to spend the fall looming from the outside in.

Didnt Seth Beer enter college during spring semester?

As the father of an incoming pitcher going to a top 30 program I felt like the worst thing he could do is show up either hurt or tired. Missing or having a poor fall due to fatigue seems to be a killer for incoming kids. 

Also feel like if anything my son has played too much baseball from 12-18 vs needing to play more. Also nothing he would face would be even close to facing his own team's hitters this fall. 

JMO

 Beer entered spring 2016.  

Canes do not have an 18U team.  My son played on that Canes National team last year with Seth Beer.  It worked out for Seth that he was able to graduate High School early in December and enroll in College for the Spring Semester and play for Clemson.  He would have been a High School Senior this past Spring.  When he played for the Canes last Summer he did not know 100% at the time he was going to graduate early and enroll at Clemson.  As for my son who is going to East Carolina after High School was over he just wanted to relax for a week or 2 and then played in 7 American Legion games.  He enrolled for 2nd Semester Summer Session (June 22-July 29) is taking 2 courses, living in the dorm on campus and working out with the Strength coach.  As a matter of fact all 14 incoming guys are there in Summer School.  9 HS guys and 5 JUCOS along with some others that did not go play summer ball.  Needless to say they are knocking out 6 credits learning what study hall is like (2 hours per day M-F) and 6 am weight room.  This will make for an easier transition in the fall.  They have unlimited access to the baseball facilities  as well and work together (no coaches).  They just hit off the tee and front toss.  He has gained 9 pounds in 3 weeks.  The first day 2 guys threw up.  They get after it.  It will get even tougher in the fall.  Still playing is great but getting faster and stronger along with managing your time is way more important that taking a few more cuts in a game. 

My son enrolled the summer after he graduated and took two classes and worked out alot, per the strength coaches routine. They also conditioned and competed in those as team. Fortunately the school he is at, paid for that and it allows them to know where he is, most of the time, get ahead with two classes...A's preferably and get them into their program. I think short of that option, if you can play against the best at your level then do it. You better figure out a way to work out as well, because the game changes when you start the fall.

TPM posted:

 Beer entered spring 2016.  

I knew Beer entered early,  how common is this.  I know in football it's becoming commonplace to bring a freshman in early, participate in spring ball, and often redshirt,  but how often does this happen in baseball, other than Beer I've never heard of it?  Anyone on the board have a player that graduated early and entered?