CABA (Woodstock) / USSSA (Crystal Lake)

It is my understanding that the Japanese, along with possibly other National and International programs, had threatened to withdraw from further participation in Crystal Lake due to the inordinate amount of Illinois teams represented (24 of 45 teams in '07 at the 15U level). From a tourism standpoint, who could blame the MCYSA Board for seeking a change in sanctioning bodies. Apparently, USSSA has brought a better, and more appealing, deal to Crystal Lake in order to benefit all involved. For MCYSA's position on the matter, visit http://www.mcysasports.org. Makes sense to me.

Don't kid yourself.

Some way, some how it is about money.

It sure is about money. When half your field is local, there are fewer people staying in motels and eating at restaurants.

The whole thing was meant to be a boom for the local economy in the Crystal Lake area.

I am guessing it is more about $$$ than anything else. I understand that the great number of IL teams probably cut down on the economic benefit somewhat. Although, having participated, the restaurants are jammed and finding a hotel room is impossible.

It is unfortunate, because Crystal Lake did such a great job with the tourney. Hopefully Woodtsock will do just as well handling it. Personally, as our CABA experience was excellent, we'll stick with them over USSSA until it proves otherwise.

Not sure how the Japan team can complain. If my memory serves me correctly, I don't remember them reaching the Championship lately. Does it really matter who is kicking your a**?

Actually, after reading the MYCSA release, it is more obvious that it is about $$$ than anything else--which, considering the nature of the event, and the community support for it, I guess I can understand.

It is unfortunate though that they couldn't try to work with their "partner" of 15 years to try and work out a more "national" format.

Hopefully, both events will work out well. It will be interesting to see 2 huge events being held in similar proximity at the same time.

There is an interesting "memo" going around from Fran Pell to a lot of the area coaches, makes for some good reading.....

See I agree with K13... even though our team was "local" we still drove over an hour to games and hung around Crystal Lake between games on most days. So we ate, we shopped, several families even stayed over several nights in hotels when the first game was at 8AM the next morning. So maybe there's more to it than the tourism aspect?

Baseball14 - are you gonna share?

Being formerly involved with travel youth baseball and the parties involved in this dispute- I must say this disagreement does not surprise me..
The rivalry between the 2 organizations in Illinois kind of ruins it for the kids---and the adults who give up their valuable time to make sure the kids enjoy themselves..
This is a local rift---filters all the way down to the boards who oversaw the event, the person who set up the events---and eventually it was DUE TO $$$$$ and too many Illinois teams..
The email circulating is OLD NEWS..........THAT interesting information was circulated around 5 years ago..... Sometimes the battle between the two organizations leads me to believe that a NON SANCTIONED organization like i provided for the older kids should be set up for the younger generation too...... the majority of the younger kids do not play for national titles anyway....
Don't blame the Japan teams.....the real problem lies right here in Northern Illinois--Each organization is good--- which local director serves you best?
The event is only good if the organization who is hosting it is good? The organization; a local one has done a great job in the past----so one should look at the LOCAL ORGANIZATIONS, local facilities which have been used in the past ; PRIOR TO CHANGING ENVIRONMENTS DUE TO LOYALTY OF A NATIONAL ORGANIZATION---why would you be loyal to a national organization ? All they do is COLLECT MONEY!

quote:

Originally posted by Baseball14:
There is an interesting "memo" going around from Fran Pell to a lot of the area coaches, makes for some good reading.....

BB14, you've got a PM.

quote:

Originally posted by mythreesons:


Baseball14 - are you gonna share?

I would rather not post such sensitive material on a public board, those interested in it can PM with a email address to forward it to.

quote:

Originally posted by itsrosy:

quote:

Originally posted by Baseball14:
There is an interesting "memo" going around from Fran Pell to a lot of the area coaches, makes for some good reading.....

BB14, you've got a PM.

Back at ya!

I understand the point regarding remaining loyal to a local organizing group verse a national organization. On the other hand, let's not pretend it is not about $$$ on both sides. My dealings in the past with the CABA national organization have been excellent, and last year, it was the national organization that was VERY helpful to me.

So, until proven otherwise, my "loyalties"--should I have any at all--will remain with those people who helped me out greatly in the past. But, I can certainly understand the opposite point of view.

I guess what I fear most is that the "rivalry" between the two organizations and the close proximity of the two tournaments is going to turn the whole thing into a mess for everyone. That would truly be sad.

As regards the IL ("local") thing, it seems as it should be a non-issue to me. For one, IL/IN/OH seem to be major "hotbeds" for 15U ball. And, as far as I can tell from the results the last couple of years, the IL teams have definitely held their own--at least at the 15U level.

The CABA World Series has been a tradition in Crystal Lake for many years. I don't see how USSSA will be able to come close to the number of out of state and international teams that CABA brings to the table every year. Only time will tell. I think CABA will continue to be the "marketable event" in the Woodstock area. Enrico is the heart and sole of the CABA World Series. The CABA people in charge have a solid reputation. Can that be said for the Illinois people running USSSA?

I am Jack Sebesta, President of MCYSA. We are the not-for-profit that has been running the tournaments in Crystal Lake for the last 14 years. There were a couple of reasons that the change was made to USSSA.

First, over the past few years we had seen a trend of more and more Illinois teams. The event was becoming more of an Illinois state tournament with some out of state (OOS) teams. In 2007 25 of 45 teams were from Illinois, only 12 states were represented and the only international team was Japan. This is not a slam on the Illinois teams that played or on caba. There are many outstanding teams in Illinois and I have nothing negative to say about caba. We just felt that the change needed to happen to move the tournament forward. One effect of what was happening was that we were not putting "heads in beds". That is a financial consideration, we receive funding to run the event through hotel tax $'s and from commissions. Those two areas were directly impacted by the lower number of OOS teams.

A second reason related to the number of Illinois teams is that our host teams were not getting to play nearly as many OOS teams. They were playing teams that they can play on any given weekend. The experience of playing against the OOS and international teams was being impacted. One of our primary considerations in making the change was the feedback from our host teams and our desire to give them the best experience possible. The host teams are the ones who are doing all of the grunt work: parking, admissions, fields, homestay, registration, etc.

This was a 3 year process in making this change. We have e-mails dating back to August 2004 where we first spoke of what we saw as a potential issue. In the fall of this past year I contacted USSSA. We had discussions with them over the next few months. The decision to switch was not made until the USSSA national meetings in November. When MCYSA first started talking with USSSA we were looking to make the change in 2009. After meeting with them in November we decided unanimousely as a board to make the change.

It was not an easy decision. It was one that we looked at for 3 years. As I said to someone the other day. MCYSA (Crystal Lake) and caba were married for 15 years and in counciling for the last 3 years.

We are excited about our partnership with USSSA. The USSSA national office changed the dates of the 15U Elite WS to accomidate our Open Summer National Championships. Teams are able to participate in both. We wish caba well and we look forward to seeing all of you in CL this July and August.

When my son played, the whole tournament seemed over hyped. The fields had fake movable mounds, and were not the right size for the players. We played Puerto Rico and Japan. That was interesting, but it didn't measure up to a tournament like Cooperstown Dream park. As a 16 year old my son played for an 18U team. He consistently played at DI, DII and minor league parks.

In short, the Crystal Lake tournament was bigger tournament than most, but the facilities didn't measure up to the type of "major" tournament it is hyped to be. JMHO.

JACK----VERY WELL WRITTEN and hats off for getting on here to show your first class attitude!!! Your tourney will be a success due to your "grunt workers" within your organization....

I agree. Very classy to come on and explain your position--and explain it well. I can certainly buy the first arguement (the financial one) and it is nice to find someone who is upfront about the fact that that is a consideration. The second arguement is much harder to swallow. Good competition is good competition. We have traveled all over the midwest and into the southeast and found the competition at CABA (regardless of the number of IL teams) to be excellent. I really don't care where the teams are from, as long as they are good--most coaches I talk to feel the same.

I will agree with bballdad that one of the most disappointing aspects of the tournament was not the quality of the competition, but rather the quality of the playing fields and facilities. Hopefully that will be addressed in the future--by both USSSA in Crystal Lake and CABA in Woodstock.

Woodly, K13 & others,

Thank you for the kind words. K13, just want to clarify. Again, not saying that the Illinois teams aren't very good - just saying that the OOS teams and internationals add something special to the whole atmosphere of the event. If we get to 60 teams in the 15's there will be up to 14 Illinois teams in it. USSSA is running qualifiers for the event. Win, you get in. There are 5 host teams for the 15's so that would leave up to 9 potential spots for other Illinois teams.

Jack

With usssa having to compete with Caba the same weekend, and now having to do damage control after that email was released about the criminal record of the usssa Illinois state director, they're fighting an uphill battle. Hopefully the town and good people of Crystal Lake are not the ones that suffer from this feud. Only time will tell.

quote:

Originally posted by Baseball14:
There is an interesting "memo" going around from Fran Pell to a lot of the area coaches, makes for some good reading.....

"Good reading"?...hardly. Classless, in my opinion. I have no personal affiliation with either CABA or USSSA but found Pell's smear tactic to be a real denigration of his organization. It's about time that adults act like adults and let the kids just play ball...wherever they choose to play.

Jack - thanks for your honesty. I don't think anyone could find any fault in your reasoning.

quote:

Originally posted by Bravescoach:

quote:

Originally posted by Baseball14:
There is an interesting "memo" going around from Fran Pell to a lot of the area coaches, makes for some good reading.....

"Good reading"?...hardly. Classless, in my opinion. I have no personal affiliation with either CABA or USSSA but found Pell's smear tactic to be a real denigration of his organization. It's about time that adults act like adults and let the kids just play ball...wherever they choose to play.

Probably not a good choice of wording used on my part, I would have to agree!

Living in the Mchenry County area for the past 15 years, we have always looked forward to the "World Series" being held in our backyard every year. We always tried to get over to catch a feature game or two, it was also fun to read in the local paper how our local boys were doing against the out of state competition.

Having had two sons play (8) years apart in this tournament, it definitely looks like the out of state participation has declined. Hopefully with this latest it does not become even more watered down. The question should be how do we get more out of state teams to accept a berth in the Series?.......

quote:

Originally posted by Bravescoach:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Baseball14:
There is an interesting "memo" going around from Fran Pell to a lot of the area coaches, makes for some good reading.....

"Good reading"?...hardly. Classless, in my opinion. I have no personal affiliation with either CABA or USSSA but found Pell's smear tactic to be a real denigration of his organization. It's about time that adults act like adults and let the kids just play ball...wherever they choose to play.
[QUOTE]

****'N A! *...*...*...*' N Aaaaaaaaaa.

LOL. What fun would it be for adults if they didn't over-organize it, find a way to make $$$ on it, scream and yell and fight, smear some good people's names, and stomp all over it and strip all the joy from it for kids?

Anyone just wanna go play a game of line-ball in the street or lob-league at the park?

We better hurry before the adults get there and start charging admission!

K13,
Lately it seems as though your posts are taking on the elitist tone, of "I'm the one who gets it here, is anyone with me?"

I can't see any reason for the above post other than to try and build yourself up by ripping at others.

JMHO

CPLZ,

Certainly not my intention. And, having been involved in travel ball for a number of years, I definitely know how many dedicated people are sincerely interested in trying to make summer baseball experiences wonderful.

I do find a good deal of what I see going on unappatizing though--nasty emails, fights between coaches, all the bickering and name-calling that goes on on these boards, academy instructors slamming each other, and much much more.

I don't think it is elitist to harken back to a time when you could just go out with a group of friends and play some ball--sans all the adult intervention.

My post above was meant to do nothing else than to poke a little gentle fun at the whole thing and maybe put it all in a little perspective for ALL of us--INCLUDING myself.

If it offended you, I am sorry, but I stand by the sentiment I tried to express.

JMHO

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