Catch is out front?

I hate the "field it out front" cue.

The best cue is "field it with your chest". Glove on the ground, field it with your chest. If they allign themselves so as to do this, using the glove is very easy and the body is in great position for a bad hop. And, the reality is very few are hit off the chest. The position allows you to cleanly field the ball with the glove. Cue v Reality. Putting the focus on the hands by saying "out front" is counter productive. The last thing you want an infielder doing is concentrating on his hands.

I also like hitting ground balls to them without gloves. If they are serious infielders you'll be surprised how easy they get to the "field with the chest" position. They have little options without a glove. And, you'll be surprised how easy the ball is to field without a glove if they are "fielding it with their chest".

I work with IFs at all levels.

One thing to understand with "fielding out in front":
The arm should not be fully extended - keep it flexed.

Keeping your hands out front allows you to react to bad hops. I cannot tell you how many bad hops I have barehanded because my hands were in the correct position. Every time I broke my nose from a GB, my hands were locked backnear my legs that did not allow me to react quick enough.

Keeping your hands out front put your glove where your eyes are looking. You cannot adjust to what you cannot see. That 6-12" is vital to being a good IF.

Keeping your hands out front keeps you from locking your arms into your legs allowing freedom of motion.

Fielding the ball out front is not a mental cue. It is reality.

After you get your hands into proper position, I would encourage you to focus on your footwork. Most GBs are fielded properly by using good footwork.

Just watch the best infielders in MLB. They take the ball out front and it looks good. It isn't that natural a thing to do so you need to keep reinforcing it with your infielders. Taking the ball out front also allows the fielder to give with the ball which makes for "soft" hands.

Lamber,

"Fielding it with your chest" does not put you in proper position to throw to 1B. Good IFs will keep the ball off their left ear (or the near vacinity) prior to breaking down. As they break down into fielding position, the ball should be off the left center of their chest (gloveside). Rounding the ball in this manner allows you to get your momentum moving to 1B.

I suspect we're talking about the same fielding position. We just describe it differently.



What I don't like about "out front" is it doesn't define the body's position. Without a definition of the body's position, "out front" means something different to each fielder.

However, "fielding it with your chest" requires the body to assume the above position from which you can "field it out front".

And, a player with his body in position has a far better chance at fielding the ball than one who does not.

I dislike fielding cues that concentrate on the glove. Players thinking about where their glove goes, do not position their bodies correctly. But, players with their bodies in proper position have little problem with their gloves.

This fielder is in such good position that the ball would hit his chest if missed, and, I maintain his position is so good this ball could easily be fielded without a glove. Not that I recommend playing without a glove. But, tell a player without a glove to field it "out front" and see what you get.

Poor example I think. Find a clip where the ball is on the ground. As someone said, if you don't field it out front, you can't see it. Your vision can only track something so far. At some point, it is moving across your field of vision too fast to track as it rolls along the ground toward you. If you don't field it out in front, you will not be able to track it into the glove. Get low and get your hands out in front.

I am reading this post to learn. I guess "out front of what " is still an unknown. With the butt down the chest is out front to me .

I still don't think Jeter takes a hard shot, short hop, hot shot out front. It seems to me that when they field way out front it is a ball with a nice bounce pattern that they can exhibit style and form. If a ball bounces straight beneath your eyes it would have to make a 90 degree hop to hit your chin

On these City Rec goat ranches we teach 10 yos on ; the % of ridiculous hops is pretty high.It isn't Turner Field for sure. I have seen the teeth out and the seams on the lips and you cannot pour those guys back into a good fielding position for years to come.

Broken noses don't sound too pleasant. I guess we would all need to be on the field and have you demo the technique that fits the most criteria for style , function, and safety.

Mark

I think that vision thing is poppeycock. I've fielded many a ground ball and I've seen them into my glove. It's much different than hitting and a very big reason for that is you're square to a ground ball looking at it with both eyes. Very different from hitting when you're standing beside the ball looking predominantly from one eye which better be your dominant eye.

The next thing they'll come up with is catchers don't see the ball into their glove.

I also disagree that the example is bad because the ball isn't on the ground.

This fielder is in great position to field the ball regardless of whether it gives him a Sunday hop, is on the ground, or gives him a bad hop. That is the benefit of fielding the ball "with your chest". Again, "with your chest" is a play on words. I'm not saying you let the ball hit your chest. I'm saying you position yourself in such a manner as if that is what you're going to do. Then, the use of your hands is much easier.

BTW, I'm still waiting on the answer to swingbusters question. Out front of what?

Good solid grounder mechanics include the proper approach, knees being bent, tail low to the ground, glove in front of the knees (as opposed to between the knees & under the tail), gator grip, soft hands, etc. This gives the fielder the best chance of gloving the ball, rather than taking in the chest or teeth.

Getting low is critical. While at first, the fielder may think this increases the risk of getting hit in the face, the opposite is actually true. Getting lower allows the fielder to judge the hop much better, thus increasing the chances of reading and fielding the ball. Also, getting lower allows the glove to be flipped up in front of the face quicker (e.g., the glove has less distance to travel), should a bad hop occur. This means less chance of getting hit in the face. And the really wicked high hops will go over the fielder's head if he is down low.

Why should the glove be in front of the body (e.g., in front of the knees) rather than under the body?
- First, the eyes can easily track the ball all the way to the mitt. {It is harder to track the ball to the mitt when the glove is under the body. Especially on a hard grounder.}
- Second, making initial contact out front allows the hands to "give", taking the glove/ball on a curved path up & in to the chest. {If the hands start back under the body, they can't give as they have no room to move back.}
- Third, you have easier lateral movement of the hands. {If the hands are back under the body, the knees will more inhibit the movement.}
- Fourth, with the hands in front you can flip the glove easily on the bad hop.

IMHO, the term "catch the grounder with your chest" is not a good cue. It is vague and could give someone the wrong impression. But if it works for Lamber's players, that is fine. Different players catch on to different cues in different manners. Whatever works.

There is only one way to ensure not getting hit by a bad hop. And that is to glove the ball. The fielder must take control in order to give himself the best chance of making the play - rather than catching the ball with his teeth.

Taking control means being aggressive, both physically and mentally.

The player should always try to take at least one step forward when the grounder will be fielded in front of him - even on the hardest of grounders. This will make it easier to get low and to lay the glove in front of the knees. Sitting back & taking a grounder makes it easier to be back on one's heels, and easier to put the glove under the body.

Texan

"I suspect were talking about the same fielding position, we're just describing it differently."

I've never seen a player that positions his body correctly have trouble fielding ground balls.

I've seen many a player who doesn't get into the right position (which I call field with the chest) screw up ground ball after ground ball.

All the benefits you list of "fielding out front" are impossible if he first doesn't assume the "field with the chest" position.

I'm sure you've seen those who don't get their butt down. Those that bend at the waist instead of the knees. These guys are trying to field the ball out front. But they can't.

Position yourself with the chest and you'll be an allstar fielder.

"- First, the eyes can easily track the ball all the way to the mitt. {It is harder to track the ball to the mitt when the glove is under the body. Especially on a hard grounder.}"

Exactly. Very good post. I agree with almost all of it and will let it stand as my answer to Lamber.

In the clip the hands are well out front and then they give nicely to react to a high hop. If the ball had stayed down the ball would have been fielded further out front. Lamber is just describing it differently as he said.

Not to be difficult but at some ball speeds and angles there is no reacting to the bad( high) hop. There are human limits to reaction time. Just as some little guys cannot get out of the way of a pitched ball, many cannot protect themselves from the bad hop from certain positions.
My mother could catch that ball on the footage provided. Give the fungo bat to a good coach and he will show you some different levels of difficulty. I've had a coach put my son at third as 9th grader and hit fungo has hard as he could time after time. I didn't like that too much. I wanted to take the bat and put him there.

For many young players, some balls must be blocked up and IMO it is a coaches job to consider the need to teach safety, how to know when to protect yourself, and encourage it. This is still a game for these kids.

An AAU coach told me one time that he had his SS and others catch the really hard one hops in line with the glove hand shoulder. This got the head out of the line of fire and allowed them to open their shoulder if the really bad hop came.

I guess I am not in favor of little kids staying directly in front of a short hop that is dangerously fast with the head leading. A local guy got in front of the pitching circle in a coach pitch girls game this week and a 10yo girl broke his eye socket in 4 places with a softball.

Swingbuster, please re-read my post carefully.

The ONLY way to ensure not getting hit by a grounder is to glove it. Well, okay, sitting in the stands is another.

Therefore, you must give yourself the best chance of gloving the grounder. I won't repeat what was stated in my earlier post. What was written was not just academic. It also reflects experience in having played MIF.

Catching a grounder off to the side does not put the head out of the line of fire. You cannot predict which direction a bad hop will take. Bad hops don't just go off unpredictably in a vertical plane - they also go off unpredictably in the horizontal plane.

And you don't open the shoulder if you are a real baseball player. You block the hop with your chest if possible.

If you teach kids to have their head up & back "out of the way" (an illusion), then you are teaching them an unsafe way to field grounders. Because you are diminishing their chances to glove it. And you are also teaching them a method that will hurt their play, and people's evaluation of their play.

In the past five years, my son has never been hit in the face by a bad hop. He has gloved some bad hops that were headed for his head. Because he was low & the glove didn't have to go far he was able to flip the glove. He has had some wicked bad hops go over his head. And these would have hit his head had he not been low (leading with the head, as you call it). {Had one of these last night, actually.}

The last kid who played for me that took one in the face was playing it your way. He wasn't down low & he was trying to field it off to his glove side. It took a high bad hop into his teeth. He couldn't flip the glove up that far in a quick enough manner. Had he been doing what I had taught him, it would have gone over his head or he might have gloved it.

Teach them the right way, and teach them the right way now.

Swingbuster,

Teaching an IF to open his shoulder is crazy. An IF prides himself in making those tough plays. Taking the ball off the chest is part of being an IF. If an IF worries about bad hops either he should: a) move his feet better to get better hops or b) move to the OF

Texan,

You mention getting low, which I agree with. I like the IF's back to be close to parallel to the ground keeping the butt down and knee caps (and toes) pointed at the ball.

Two things that people do not focus on enough, IMO, is glove angle and footwork. I see too many flat gloves (in relation to the ground). These IFs cannot handle hard GBs or any sort of in between hop. Most IFs I see have poor footwork which cost them 2-3 steps per hitter. They see MLB IFs (with 60+ arms) fielding and assume they can do the same.

Redbird5, you make very good points on glove angle and footwork.

The latter would take many words to try & describe in a post. Much easier to demonstrate & talk through on the field. I see too many players sit back & try field the ball on their heels.

Head up also exposes the throat. That may be the most dangerous place to be hit by a ball.

I know this has been discussed on here before, but it has been quite some time and since we are talking about "catching out front", maybe we should revisit this topic.

It is in reference to the "give" when fielding. I have seen fielders be in great position to field, only to "give" too much and turn a shorthop into almost a tweener or put themselves into a poor position to throw(butt comes up a little and hands too close to body). I know this description is probably the "extreme", but how much is just right?

There are some that believe there should be little or no "give" when actually catching the ball and some that promote fielding "through it"(slight movement forward). I realize that not all balls can be fielded with just one method, but what are everyone's thoughts on a general approach to this?

Baseball Coach, your kids must do well since you field outstanding teams year in and year out. I listen to a presentation by the Murray State Coach on this topic. To make a long presentation with demonstrations and all brief, He recommended a flat glove, a "slightly off center" approach to the ball to enable the butt to be in the proper position to allow the feet to "fly" as he put it into a throwing position, and then use the glove as a type of front end of a bulldozer. He stressed never give. He said that as the front of the glove lowers like the bulldozer, move slightly into the ball. He wasn't a big fan of attacking through the ball because of where it puts the head. He did, however, believe that you have to be moving forward because it is part and parcal of an aggressive attitude you wish to instill in your fielders. We taught that this year.

Can I add one other thing to this discussion? Phrases are teaching keys that then have to be demonstrated. "Catch the ball out in front" can be interpreted differently to different people. For some it might me that at no time is it acceptable to catch a ball between your feet. I can think of so many different ways it can be used. I believe that any phrase once used then has to be demonstrated. Only then does that phrase have meaning within a program. Example - We use a phrase when hitting that goes, "Let the ball get to you." This phrase can be taken so many different ways. However, with a demonstration and then practice it has the specific meaning to our players of what we want. JMHO!