coach said something weird today

Sounds pretty normal to me, I've heard that from several coaches at the high school level and even from coaches at the 12 yr old level. May not seem fair but you're no longer playing rec league. Kind of a rude welcome to the real world but hey, whaya gonna do? Some guys can handle being on the team without getting to play, some can't. At least he's being honest about his intentions and now it's up to the players to figure out where they stand.

It's probably also a way to have the kids weed themselves out without 'being cut'. He might have some bubble kids and may want to see who gives up and who has the drive to stay on in the face of adversity.


Give a man a box and he has a box for a day
But teach a man to box . . .

The coach is just trying to be honest. I give him credit here.

However, that does not mean you should accept this as fact that you will never play. If you truly want to be a part of the team take any role possible, but keep the mindset that you truly belong and can be a large part of the team.

Continue to work and improve. You are one injury, one suspention, one kid moving, etc to really getting a shot. In my experience kids drop like flies in HS. You are young so there should be ample opportunities ahead if you want to stay with it.

Not only not a strange thing to say, but a great idea to say it. Lots of kids enter HS with little more than a Little League background. They're used to getting as much playing time as the next guy, even if they don't have equal ability. Heck, I've even seen posts on HSBB Web where parents are complaining, applying this Little League attitude to HS baseball. The reality can be a rude awakening. Best to get them used to the idea right away -- you have to compete, to improve, and be the best here to play.

Most coaches will tell you that all good teams need role players. Kids who appreciate being on the team and being a part of it all are valued. A kid who's going to spend the season stewing on the bench over how he feels slighted over lack of playing time is not much good to anybody.

Our HS coach gives his players the same shpiel. I think it's just being honest, as Simon Cowell would say. Maybe some of these guys would rather go find another outlet if they know they won't be ngetting much time. Some guys, though, are happy just to say they made the team....

quote:

some of you may get on the team but never play

And likewise, wouldn't it be "fair" for a player to let his coach know that he won't be showing up to play whenever he finds something better to do?

The coach is a jerk. He shouldn't accept a kid on the team who has zero chance of playing for a lousy few innings. And no, HS baseball is in no way "The Real World."

quote:

today after practice/tryouts coach says some of you may get on the team but never play i don't want you complaining about that, if you can't put up with that go home now.

I always admired those who wanted to play. If it got down to one player I could understand saying person to person "Son, here's the situation, it's possible you could get very little if any playing time. Do you think you can live with that and still help the team"?

Not sure I understand the situation or the age level. Did he say that to the whole team, several players or one player? If he said it to the whole group, wonder what he'd do if they all went home?

Besides, at younger levels and if it's at all possible a caring coach will find at least a little playing time for everyone during the entire season.

quote:

Some guys, though, are happy just to say they made the team....

For a week perhaps. And what about the $500-$3,000 the whole family kicks in (counting spring trips)?

quote:

I think it's just being honest, as Simon Cowell would say.

How many guards are standing between Simon and the often brawny kids he ridicules?

Pitching 101,
As they say ----- this should be understood on the front end by every player on the team but sometimes the players don’t understand (and parents never do) so it creates a problem later on in the season. If we’re talking high school age baseball (or older) I don’t have a problem with what the coach said. If the players are younger than high school age I think it should be handled on a one-on-one basis with the parents involved especially if there is a fee involved. Pitching101, you should have been looking around at the other players to see who the coach was talking to because you KNOW he wasn’t talking to you --- right?
Fungo.

If my son tried out for a team that does not promise any playing time, and there are teams like that out there at 12, I would rather the coach be up front about it and tell the team what his intentions are and then privately tell the players in question that they might never get off the bench. If I knew my son might not play, we would look for something else to do or another team to play for. I have heard of situations where the coach told players that they probably wouldn't get to play but were welcome to stay and be a part of the team if they wanted, and they chose to stay. I've also seen where coaches begged a kid to play and told him how much they needed him, and then hardly got him into the game! I love baseball but if my son is going to be stuck on the bench and it looks like he's got little chance of getting much playing time I want to know, because then him and I can decide if we'd rather go fishing, camping, golfing or whatever.

pitching 101

I am assuming you are the HS player of the two ID users- with that in mind I see no problem in what he says even if he is saying it to all the team--- I see no chance, as some one noted, of the entire team turning and walking out because kids who tryout want to be there and mostly all think they deserve to start--perhaps this is just a gentle prodding of all players to work their tails off and earn their starting positions--it is also possible that he spoke in private with some of the lesser talented players about what their roles, though minimal, will be

another thought--- players who are not starters need to be on the team for pracrice sessions and their own improvment--many basketball teams have addiitonal players involved for practice only but they are honored on senior night just like the players--

I , for one, would much rather know where I stand on the teams depth chart and what my role will be-- it is all too easy to say bye bye and try out for another team-- the result may be the same their and as a Coach I would ask myself this " If the kid cant make that team what makes him think he is able to make mine. Does we think we are not as talented as the team he cannot make?

assuming hs ...
not all coaches are good coaches,
not all coaches have good people skills,
some coaches may not have ANY people skills,

I'd understand if that speech was 1 on 1 with selected Sr's, but don't see much accomplished otherwise. no motivation, nothing positive, and basicly causing HIS players confusion wondering what the h*** he is talking about


MY personal favorite speech; FIRST HS meeting after team selection ... coach says,

"gentlmen, congrats on making the team"
"MY STARTING LINE UP is on the chalkboard"

"notice 3 VERY IMPORTANT THINGS"

"it is written with chalk"
"in one hand I have a box of chalk"
"in the other hand I have an eraser"

"let's get to work"

One thing you have to remember, allot of schools don't get the turnouts some other schools get so you have to have enough players on the bench for the " in case of ". You don't want to have to forfeit a game because you might be short. Plus you never know , one of these bench players might get in a impress.

Pitching,

The coach is an idiot, discouraging his own players BEFORE the season starts. I've seen plenty of kids that are good in a batting cage or pitching indoors. Same kids can't do a thing when the games begin.

You always need pitching.

Aren't we being a little hard on the coach? If you were the coach, would you put a player in if you knew there was absolutely no chance of him making a play or getting a hit? Or would you put a pitcher in if he's going to average 5-10 runs given up per inning? I do agree that some players look like world burners indoors and can't seem to take it outdoors. I'm not a head coach but I'm sure they don't have the easiest job, I know I wouldn't want to deal with all the parental issues I've seen around here.

good point bystander,
but I'll ask why would he keep a player who could NOT hit, field, nor pitch?

what kinda show is he runnin there?

Everybody wants their kid to play and everybody wants their kid's team to win. We all know that not every player brings the same level of talent and/or drive and/or commitment and/or emotional maturity and/or tough-mindedness to the game. At the high school level, the coach has a responsibility to field the strongest team he possibly can, but its usually also his responsibility to look down the road at developing talent on which to build future teams. Its my understanding that no player on a high school team or even in a decent travel program has a guarantee of playing time. What they do have is the opportunity to train and develop and continue to improve to the point where they will get their shot on the field.

In telling guys up front they may make the team but never play, the coach is giving the ones who really want to be on the field regardless of their talent level the opportunity to quit. He's also presenting the opportunity to train and develop and get better to those players who are ready to accept that challenge.

As parents, is it our responsibility to make sure our sons are on the field all the time or is it our responsibility to help them become the best ballplayers they can be?

For example: We have very close friends who's son is a good baseball player. He has always been a local standout - always started for any team he's played, always been an all-star. Last year, as a 15, he made the cut for one of New England's premier AAU programs, and his folks were really excited about it. We were proud of him, too, because he earned the right to play for that team. Problem was every kid on that team was a really good ballplayer - not just our friend's son. Someone was better than he at 1st base, so he didn't get the start in that position and was moved to the outfield. His folks had a nutty and made it clear they didn't want him in the outfield - they wanted him at 1st or no place. Coach made him the DH. Kid's parents now have him playing only local ball where he is once again on the field at all times. So is that going to help him be a better ballplayer? Come on parents, is it really necessary for your kid to be on the field or is it more important that he train to get better?

Feel free to attack. My son spent years on the bench while developing his game. Now, while he's one of the best players in his high school, he's more excited about his summer team because the level of talent is excellent and can only push him to get better.

mom it makes sense to me, The only way to get better is through playing time.....

So has anyone ever seen a HS player who never got into a single game? I haven't.

I could only imagine that situation occurring if every game were close. Possible, but very unlikely.

with my sons HS the 9th grade team is by itself, the JV team only shaggs fly ball for Varsity bp. Varsity team starters get majority of bp and fielding practice. I personally think that travel coaches and elite teams will probably get kids more work to improve during summers than HS coaches....I know that is the case with our program if you didnt have it when you came they are not gonna teach it... I would like to see that differently but I dont see it changing.

This happened to one of our son's this year. I was somewhat upset but also not surprised. Our son had not put as much into his game this year. He is a Senior and has had a major case of Senioritis all year. It affected his Fall sport and grades also. I felt that or at least hoped that the Coach did it to motivate him and not really mean that he will never get a chance to be on the field. As it turns out I was correct. that is what they were trying to do. If he quit then so be it in their eyes. They felt he wouldn't be help to the team if that was his position. If he stuck it out and was more motivated then that was their hope. The next time they saw him work out they complimented him on the change! Sometimes kids need a kick in the butt and us as parents are not always the ones to be able to do it. There may have been a better way for the Coaches to of handled it but I do know they had talked to him several times during the year. Nothing worked but this tactic. So I am grateful that they got my Son to look within himself and decide if he wants to be on the field or not. Because when we tried it was considered "pressure".

Some random thoughts here....

I agree with IB; I think people are being a little hard on the coach without knowing exactly what was said. This came from one of the players and rarely do I hear from my own kids exactly what's said, or maybe more importantly HOW it's said. I think what he said is important for players and parents to hear. I'm not suggesting that pitching101 twisted the story or anything but none of us heard it firsthand.

I think IB's statement about the caliber of bench player was a bit exagerated but agree with his point; those kids ARE on the bench because they don't hit, field or pitch as well as the starters. Maybe the school is pretty thin in talent and there's a big drop in production? Maybe the school district is loaded and the dropoff in talent isn't so prominant? We don't know so we can't judge.

Getting back to pitching101's concern; I think it's the best thing for a coach to say, especially at the HS level. I'm sure every kid who made the cut feels he deserves to start, much less play, I know I did! But that's not realistic.

good post sue! We never know what is in our kids minds.

Kmom, no attack, you raise some interesting points

quote:

He's also presenting the opportunity to train and develop and get better to those players who are ready to accept that challenge.

that's a great spin, but just how did you arrive there - - there was nothing positive in his statement to indicate that


"is it our responsibility to make sure our sons are on the field all the time or is it our responsibility to help them become the best ballplayers they can be?"

good question - - imo, parents should support their children AND educate themselves on their interests/activities - at least to the point they can recognize an opportunity
starring them in the face

it's very sad about your friend & his parents - -
someone should have taken all 3 of them aside and politly explained that
OUTFIELD IS A POSITION on the BASEBALL TEAM - that way they wouldn't have looked foolish


.

In sports "real life" begins to settle in at the HS level and coaches each do things differently, whether we as parents like and agree with it or not.

The young men have to learn to accept and adapt

Pitching 101, I would not worry, last year our Freshman team was told the same speech. All the parents were in a uproar. Then after a few weeks Kids started dropping out (grades) were the biggest factor, injuries weekend dirt bikes, ect... Just work hard and things happen for the better. Now this year in JV a lot has change especially players positions. So you never know what to expect year after year.

Nothing strange about that speech at all, this isn't rec league ball or even little league, where everyone is guaranteed to get in the game. The 9 best should be on the field and if you want to be on the field, you get better.

"some of you may make the team but play very little if any"........

I heard that yesterday at tryouts for a 12U girls softball team.

That speech is not unusual but it is not a good way to motivate the players. I have seen several approaches and I like the the one on one Parent/player to coach approach. Take each player with atleast one parent and tell the player what the coaches see as thye players role on the team. The guys who they think may not be regulars get an encouragement speech. Work hard and ean more playing time this year or in the future. Tell them you see them as part of the team and we will work on what ever it takes to get you playing time.
This requires a lot of hard work on the coaches part because he should have a detailed break down on the players strenghts and weaknesses. This approach will help develop players and they know what they have to work on. The biggest problem I have seen is a lack of coaches that know every aspect of the game.
The motivational part is still in the old theat mode. "Skrew up and you sit" I see that as a major contributor to skrewing up.
We all know the pressures of playing and the kids at HS level need support not scare tactics. Tell them when they come out the other end that they will all be better ball players even if they don't get a lot of playing time. Our Elite teams had "Trailer Players" who got little playing time but paid less and were in a developement mode to try and get them to a hidher level of play.

Son's coach this year said something along the lines of (paraphrased):

If you complain to me about playing time, you can pack your stuff and go home...

If your mom or dad complain to me about playing time, I will pack your stuff for you...

I really don't have any issue with him saying that. He is paid to evaluate the talent and make decisions who to play. If he is wrong, his teams will fail and he won't last long anyway. If he is right, (and most of the time they are) he will be successful, AND he will have a group of respectful young men instead of whiners wanting playing time and not worried about the team.

Bobblehead


At the HS level why does a coach have to talk to the parent(s) when it comes to this discussion

I believe it helps keep parents in line. They get 1 chance to voice their concerns and you get less complaining in the stands. I find it works reasonably well but nothing is perfect.

I have to agree with the earlier posts by Innocent Bystander, Dad10, and Jon Doyle: it is a rude welcome to the real world, some guys can handle being on the bench and some can't, some guys will weed themselves out, and the coach is just being honest. Sorry - I don't know how to enter those all as individual quotes, but if you read this far, you know who said what.

micdsguy - yes I do know players who've not gotten into a single HS game and I know guys who've not gotten into a single AAU game - regardless of the expense to their parents. The coaches didn't feel the kids in question were ready to be on the field. As the parent of a player who used to have lots of splinters in his b*tt, I can tell you firsthand that it hurts like h*ll to know how bad he wants to be out there and how hard he's worked, but the decision to keep working and keep trying belongs to the kid. My job was to be his emotional support system. I NEVER told him it was the coach's fault - the coach was playing favorites or was a lousy coach or any of the rest of it. I may have felt that way and may have sounded off privately to my husband or a trusted non-baseball friend - but never to my son. The end result is that he respects his coaches and doesn't question thier authority under any set of circumstances. The coach is the coach. Period.

mniteramble - I agree kids develop with playing time, but unlike your situation where the varsity gets most of the bp while the jv shags balls, our coaches train every kid they roster because the jv competes to win, as well as the varsity, and those jv players will be the varsity down the road.

Bee - you are correct, OF is a position, but the player in question's folks are still in the LL mindset of the best players are in the infield. A number of folks with son's on other AAU teams tried to talk to them, but their decision is based on their thought pattern. Nothing you can do about that.

And with regard to coaches presenting players the opportunity to train and develop, etc. - I don't know the coach this thread is based on, but I know what happens around here. When my son was in 8th grade, our high schools were still 10, 11, and 12, so the freshman team was at the jr high (7,8,9) and there were no middle school programs. The freshman coach rostered 16 guys - 10 freshmen, 3 8th graders, and 3 7th graders - because if nobody from the lower grades was trained to play, who would be there the following year when all of the freshmen moved to the high school? Now we have grades 9-12 in the high schools and we have middle schools. The freshman team is all freshmen, but we have middle school teams with 6th through 8th graders. Also, even though we have two very big high schools in our city (over 2200 students each) both schools started at least one freshman player, last season.

The other thing to consider is that I'm sure the coach's speech was a bit longer and more comprehensive than just the quoted statement in question here.

The rest of his talk could very well have offered additional perspective and useful information to the kids who listened and absorbed it. We won't know if that's the case since we weren't there to hear it, but it seems reasonable that there could have been more to it.

Where do kids (and parents) get this nutty idea they have some RIGHT to play? Maybe its because kids on every other HS team, including basketball, get some playing time.

Even the last kid on our basketball bench got 5 or so games played.

----
Not sure about football, though. We have a no cut policy and the FB season is pretty short.

Making cuts is something that has to be done. Ifyou coach long enough you get the feel of how to do it. Who do you keep etc etc. the obvious is the obvious. but how do you handle the kid who may or not see some time. It is all about their personality. If you know they are going to moan or groan about PT then you have to do what you have to do. Especially with upper classmen.

I go with more important to be on the field as much as you can. This is what helps develop a young player, playing time, practice time. If you are not going to get it, you can do one of two things. Give up or continue to improve by going to practices or seek out lessons and wait for that opportunity to come. Prove them wrong. Playing time is earned no matter what team you play for. I think the coach was giving a challenge. JMO.
When a player moves to a higher level team, or up to a more competitive HS the really talented player in LL, becomes a player like everyone else. The really talented HS player, becomes a player like everyone else with his elite summer team (they are all good that is why they are there), and that player going to college, becmes a college player just like everyone else (they are good that is why they are there).

nice replies guys, adn just to clarify, he said this to the whole team, did not point anyone out in particular. Though i don't think anyone will drop out.


ps. my brother will no longer be using this ID, only me.