Coaching Change at Wm. & Mary

wow

Interesting.

MidloDad - You have a PM.

Farr was trying to build that program and they canned him, now Leoni. I think Farr and Leoni both did a decent job while there.

Sounds like the coaches at W&M have one hand tied behind their back and then have their feet held to the fire for not winning. (I'm on a cliche analogy roll this morning!)

It sounds like the athletic department is a little confused when it comes to reality and expectations.

I thought they had the 11.7 scholarships, am I mistaken? I thought Pinzino had told my kid they were fully funded, but I could be wrong.

Midlo where did you read about Leoni? If it is public info I'd like to read it.

I have spoken personally to multiple current William and Mary players(starters) and the ousting of Leoni has been in the cards for a while. If anyone noticed, the school forced Leoni before this year to bring in two new assistant coaches, that were not one of his "guys". Last year, the players held a mutiny of sorts, and went to the AD asking for the removal of Leoni as coach due to his micromanaging, and lack of knowledge of the game. This year, although Leoni improved slightly, there was still much hopeful talk among the players that Leoni would be let go. If you look at William and Mary's team this year and their results, they should have finished A LOT better with their conference record. Hopefully this move will allow their program to finally take the next step!

quote:

Originally posted by BaseballmomandCEP:

Midlo where did you read about Leoni? If it is public info I'd like to read it.

Not much written...

http://www.collegebaseballdaily.com/

Frank Leoni fired at William and Mary
By Brian Foley– June 3, 2012
Posted in: CAA, New Coach

College Baseball Daily sources have confirmed that William and Mary seventh year head coach Frank Leoni has been fired. In 2012, the tribe went 31-25 while going 12-18 in CAA play. Leoni came to William and Mary after 13 seasons at URI where he went 146-118-1 over his final five seasons.

Although the article may have called it a firing, it is my understanding that, technically, it was a nonrenewal of Coach Leoni's contract.

quote:

Originally posted by WB Reporter:
Although the article may have called it a firing, it is my understanding that, technically, it was a nonrenewal of Coach Leoni's contract.

correct

William & Mary is fully funded and has had financial resources for most of Leoni's tenure.

He is a complete micro manager and does not have the depth of baseball knowledge the job requires. Farr did a much better job both on the field and in recruiting.

My understanding is that it wasn't due to winning and losing but due to how the team was run, etc. Interesting and also a little scary for some of us (my kid is committed to play there). Should be interesting to see where they go from here.

Reading some of the comments above, who is running the ship at William and Mary? Who cares if the kids don't like how he coaches?!?! I don't care for the President, but still support decisions because it's the right thing to do. The athletes job is to perform at his highest ability. He (the student) knew what he was getting into when he signed that white sheet of paper to play for Leoni! This is what's wrong with society and sports in general. We always blame the coach and not the players! Comes a time where student athletes need to be held accountable for their mistakes and poor play.

There is no story on this at collegebaseballdaily.com. It doesn't show up in the search results as of 2:20pm either.

What's funny is, when Farr left, there was all this talk about how he was considered unpopular with the players, and how receptive the players were to Leoni and how much they liked him.

I guess all blooms come off all roses at some point.

Player input is important in the sense that you should listen to it and then give it the weight it deserves. If the input is inside information that reveals real problems, that's one thing. If you're letting player griping make your decisions for you, that's a huge mistake.

From what I know, Terry Driscoll (AD) is no shrinking violet and most likely made up his own mind without a whole lot of input from others. I heard many who blamed Driscoll for Farr's departure years ago. I don't know who's right or who's to blame. I do know that the AD gets the last word in such things.

Lack of Baseball knowledge?!? Then shame on the administration for not doing their due diligence in the hiring process. I find that hard to believe.

Why not wait and see if we learn the actual facts on this? I know it is a crazy idea, but the speculation is meaningless...imho.

There is going to be quite a bit of movement this year.
If W&M stays in the CAA, well that is changing and if they go to the Patriot that will put another spin on things. Being a college coach at this level can be VERY scary!

I was at an alumni event with Terry Driscoll recently, as in maybe 3 weeks ago. He said nothing at all about going to the Patriot, and in fact, a lot of his talk was designed to raise money for scholarship funding.

Has that changed suddenly?

quote:

Originally posted by Midlo Dad:
I was at an alumni event with Terry Driscoll recently, as in maybe 3 weeks ago. He said nothing at all about going to the Patriot, and in fact, a lot of his talk was designed to raise money for scholarship funding.

Has that changed suddenly?

Within the past 3 weeks, both VCU (May 15) and ODU (May 17) announced that they are leaving the CAA. That certainly might make a difference to a member of the CAA as it considers other opportunities.

quote:

Originally posted by oldschooler:
Farr was trying to build that program and they canned him.

Did they really "can" Farr (he may have sealed his departure by packing his office up) or did W&M not provide the financial support that Farr sought (hence leading him to pack his office)? My impression from many, many years, and sometimes with a little more than casual information, is that W&M is much more supportive financially of its football and basketball programs and coaches than it is of other sports, including of baseball. The old adage may apply - you get (no more) than what you pay for.

quote:

Originally posted by WB Reporter:

quote:

Originally posted by oldschooler:
Farr was trying to build that program and they canned him.

Did they really "can" Farr (he may have sealed his departure by packing his office up) or did W&M not provide the financial support that Farr sought (hence leading him to pack his office)? My impression from many, many years, and sometimes with a little more than casual information, is that W&M is much more supportive financially of its football and basketball programs and coaches than it is of other sports, including of baseball. The old adage may apply - you get (no more) than what you pay for.

\

Old news...or old rumors...either way...old

quote:

Originally posted by dblemup:Old news...or old rumors...either way...old

Ah, yes, old news. But old news is history and if one does not learn from history, one may be doomed to repeat it.

WB,

Driscoll said that of course they are paying close attention to the shifting conference lineups, but they had no plans to move themselves. Obviously they have to protect themselves from a potential collapse of the CAA, but going to the Patriot means no scholarships at all, and I don't think W&M is interested in that path.

As for favoring football and basketball over baseball and other sports -- you could say that about any college.

'Obviously they have to protect themselves from a potential collapse of the CAA, but going to the Patriot means no scholarships at all, and I don't think W&M is interested in that path.'

Patriot League would make sense for them in terms of academic peers, but I sure hope they don't go that route!

Thanks for keeping us posted, Midlo.

quote:

Patriot League would make sense for them in terms of academic peers, but I sure hope they don't go that route!

I'm curious to know why you think the PL would be a bad option other than the challenges around athletic scholarships. All of the schools are well endowed and do have the ability to put financial packages together on a need basis for athletes with proven academic records in secondary school. Two of the member schools, Army and Navy, recruit some very fine student athletes (although for other reasons than to feed the MLB draft ).

When I went to Lehigh Univ., "need basis" meant the coach "needed" you on the wrestling team, so your bills were paid and you wrote a monthly thank you note to an alumnus.

quote:

Originally posted by Midlo2012:
When I went to Lehigh Univ., "need basis" meant the coach "needed" you on the wrestling team, so your bills were paid and you wrote a monthly thank you note to an alumnus.

You must be old like me! I think they have tightened up the compliance rules a tad in the last 35 years. Now the money gets deposited into the endowment accounts first

Hi Birddog,

Actually I love Patriot league schools, they are wonderful places in terms of academics and in the level of athletics. No insult intended!!

It was just a thought that going from D1 with fully funded scholarships to a league in which they can't offer baseball money would certainly have an impact on the recruiting and on the team. In the short run it would be more uncertain. I don't know how a school makes a transition like that.

It will be interesting to see what happens.

quote:

Originally posted by BaseballmomandCEP:
Hi Birddog,

Actually I love Patriot league schools, they are wonderful places in terms of academics and in the level of athletics. No insult intended!!

It was just a thought that going from D1 with fully funded scholarships to a league in which they can't offer baseball money would certainly have an impact on the recruiting and on the team. In the short run it would be more uncertain. I don't know how a school makes a transition like that.

It will be interesting to see what happens.

No worries not taken as such at all. I understand the challenges of moving away from fully funded athletic scholarships. The PL member schools struggled with that when the league was formed. Many of us "older" alumns had a difficult time with it as well. In retrospect I think it's actually made the schools stronger but I will admit that you probably won't see any of them competing for a national championship.

As you probably know the league is now permitting athletic scholarships in basketball and I understand that they are are now exploring doing the same in football. You are correct; it will be interesting.

Any speculation on who the leading candidates for the job would be?

How will no schollys in patriot league (potential) affect athletes who are there now on schollys?

NCAA rules now permit a program to offer 4/5 year scholarships. However, I have not yet heard of anyone doing that in baseball. Up until now, all scholarships have been renewable (or non-renewable, or reviewed and increased or decreased) year to year. Players typically learn their fate in exit interviews with the head coach when the season ends.

It would be possible (legal) to move to Patriot and tell everyone in June that their scholarships would not be renewed if only for that reason.

But I doubt W&M would do such a thing to its current players.

I would think a move to the Patriot would be announced with a couple of years of lead time at least. But again, no rule says you have to. Also again, I no of no information that W&M is even considering this.

The Wm and M AD was quoted as being committed to staying in the CAA ....back in April ? or May? I think this talk is just HSBBW talk and curiosity more than anything.

However, I would think as a top nationally regarded state instituation, William and Mary would really want to keep athletic scholarships, and that they need it to maintain their place in their market. Although in many ways they feel more like an Ivy League school, almost all of their 'cross application' competitors are all colleges and universities that are D1 with significant $$ commitment to athletics (other than the Ivy which they do cross with) so IMHO they would really be foolish to drop the athletic funding.

Also, are there any other state Universities in the Patriot League? I don't think so, not that it would matter.

quote:

Originally posted by BaseballmomandCEP:
Also, are there any other state Universities in the Patriot League? I don't think so, not that it would matter.

Correct all of the full member institutions are private colleges (Holy Cross, Lehigh, Lafayette, Bucknell, Colgate, American) except of course for the USMA and USNA where everyone is on "scholarship".

As a side note the PL had five players drafted in the top 25 rounds this week.

Bet a nickel that is WAY better than the CAA!!!!

quote:

Originally posted by 1943 yankees:
Bet a nickel that is WAY better than the CAA!!!!

CAA beat them by one. They had 6 in the top 24 rounds and 11 overall...

CAA has a pretty darned good record when it comes to putting guys into MLB.

Verlander, Hudson, Inge, Marshall, Meredith, and Bray come immediately to mind. And I'm sure I'm missing several.

If you go back to when UR was CAA, you could add Sean Casey, Brian Jordan and Tim Stauffer.

His exit is related to money not performance. He was brought down from the north to recruit the northern money players and he failed to do so.W&M is slowly disappearing in the sports arena's and the school uses those sports that are non revenue producing of themselves to raise money in alumni funds for the school and that's not happening with Leoni.Too many 757 kids and this area has dried up financially,so the AD will most likely look to the north again with greater determination for networking.Birdog and Midlo may have some insight on this and I could be way off,but I am convinced.I also do not feel that this particular program is loaded with Ivy League academics,no more than other CAA schools.Three to four bright lights and the rest ABOVE average. Micro-managing,what's that?That is the typical excuse used in business when the understudies are trying to separate themselves for promotion from the fact that they are poor choices and without personal direction.Sorry!Usually, I am quiet and without opinion but...

posted last night:

WILLIAMSBURG – Frank Leoni, who spent the last seven years with the Tribe baseball program, resigned the head coaching position on Friday afternoon. William and Mary Athletics Director Terry Driscoll will begin a national search immediately and no timetable has been established to name a successor.

"I met with Frank and decided it was in the best interest of both parties to go different directions," Driscoll said. "We would like to thank him for his dedication over the last seven years at William and Mary. Moving forward, we want to reaffirm our commitment to the current and incoming baseball student-athletes."