Compliant vs Challenging

Halfmoonslider

No I never had a kid say I was full of it or an*&%^^^ or &^%$##$. Being old school I would not appreciate it and he might and would probably be playing lacrosse or tennis or golf or whatever other sport they have in the spring. I coached for many years and some of the things that kids do today would definitely test me now. an assistant coach told me that a kid called him an ***&^%$# in front of players. the head coach was on the lines. Nothing happened. Looks good from where I am standing

Very interesting topic. I will be curious as to hear others' opinions. Personally, I probably handle things a little differently. I expect my players to react as well as think in situations. There is not always time to discuss philosophy at the time. I expect our players to execute without question what they are called upon to do at the time. Then, after the inning or game I am happy to explain what we are trying to do. I think it helps them to understand why, for example, I called for a certain pitch,if they can see the positive result from it. I encourage my players to ask about philosophy and ideas because I want them to learn and I feel that if I can not justify my ideas then maybe that isn't the way to do something. Kids have some very good ideas when we listen to them. I do not however tolerate confrontation with a player. It leads to nothing positive. If a player speaks innappropriately, they will be told to come back tomorrow after they re-evaluate their role on the team, or may simply not see their name on the line-up next game. This quietly tends to teach them about life. Don't expect to go in and tell your boss that he / she is "full of it" and still have a job the next day.

hsballcoach

Ditto.

Years ago I once had a kid who questioned his spot in the batting order. He was batting 9th. He was moaning and groaning how he was better etc etc etc. I took his advice. I moved him from 9th to the bench. The kid I replaced him with had a 2-3 day with a couple of rbi. Lesson learned.

I love the kid who tells me it matters not where he plays in the field--just tell him what slot he is hitting in---on our tea, I look at the #9 guy as another lead off man

Tr;

you may desire to rotate the #9 hitter with the #1 hitter so the #9 understands his role.

The #1;#2 and #9 hitters role is "to be on base" one of two times at bat. All hitters role is to "see the ball".

TR; we learn this from not the Japan coaches, but former Major League players; Mike Diaz, Joe Rudi, Bob Oliver and Mike Sadek all whom have worked at our clinics and Academy's.

Bob Williams

Consultant

I talk to the boy--that is all that is needed--I want the #1 guy leading off the game

I learned it from my dad who was a very fine semi pro catcher and baseball strategist and my first coach

Maybe I'm not communicating my issue well. One time discipline is very easy. "Get the heck off my field and come back when you've learned your lesson". Anybody can do that. That doesn't take a talented leader. I've had to do that. That wasn't my point.

I'm talking about a longer term maturity issue. This came up briefly in another thread. What do you do with the kid who is good enough to play for you without giving you his soul. He has soooo much more to give, but hasn't matured enough yet to figure that out. He may be real good someday, he may plateau, but there is more in him. He has the physical skills now, but the passion is not there. He wants it, but doesn't REALLY want it. He says all the right things, but it's lip service. He has no desire to please you, but he does just enough to stay in the game. I guess the question is how can we put Rudy's head in our talented players bodies?

I had a kid who played for me for 4 years before high school. He was one of these kids I'm describing. I was constantly on him. Boy he was talented though and did just enough to stay in my ballgame. He lost the big games, he acted out on the mound and I dealt with it all. He went to another local school and sat the bench on varsity his freshman year and then last year his sophomore year he goes 10-0 with a sub 1.00 ERA, is basically unhittable and hits a ton as well (which he never did for me) He basically receives the highest award you can get in our state and now has scouts chasing him everywhere. But poor ole Coach Halfmoon is feeling like he didn't get it done as a coach and a leader. Is it just time that healed this kid or am I missing something? I started out as a dad coach and somewhere along the line I've come to take this as a vocation (although not getting paid can be a powerful leverage!). Yup I have another job to keep my wife in jewelry , but I spend long, long hours trying to get better at this. Am I selfish in worrying about who helped this kid find "it"? Maybe writing this down is therapy enough.

Halfmoon,
It sounds like you are a very good coach because you care for your kids. I think the statemant you made summed-up what changed this kid. "He sat on the bench on varsity his freshman year." Maybe this let him see that he had talent but talent alone doesn't get you there. I try to take kids to a local college game and let them see what it is like. I have on more than one occasion explained to a good player that didn't appreciate their gift that the only difference between them as a talented player and the college player is hard work and coachability. Sometimes it works...sometimes it doesn't. The painful truth is that until a kid truly wants something bad enough to work at it and do what it takes to get it, it doesn't matter what those around them say or do...they have to want to do it. It's simply the difference between those with potential and those that succeed. Keep your head up that player may one day realize how much you tried to help him.

Halfmoon I get where your coming from. Personally I have alot of respect for the kid that has that little fire inside of him and marches to a different beat. Some of my best players were these kinds of kids. They are usually the ones that say "Why would we cut it on the first and third play in that situation coach". "Coach I would have never had Bill bunt in that situation". Or stuff like "Why do we have to be at practive before the time you tell us practice is"? What I have always done with kids is tell them I have no problem with them disagreeing with me. But they had better see me in private and then tell me like they see it. As long as they dont disrespect me or other coaches in front of the team its all good with me. I respect a kid that meets me in private in the outfield during bp or in the fieldhouse etc and lets me hear how they really feel. I like it when they stand up for what they believe in. I tell them how I feel and we talk it out man to man. I encourage them to speak their mind and I encourage them to stand up for themselves. I try to teach them how to do this in a respectfull way and in the right forum. I dont like robots. Dont look at me and say yes sir no sir and never really talk to me. I want kids to be respectfull and to be team players. But I dont want yes men.

Coach May

You make a great point--

I remmeber when I came out of college and went to work in the construction field-- One day our General Superintendent walked into our site office muttering to himself-- all I could hear was "I have to fire him. All he does is yes me to death. Son don't you ever yes me like he does"-- from an old war horse as he was. The words became etched in my brain forever---they apply is all walks of life--- incidentally he later became one of my business partners up until 1985. And he can tell you that I never "yessed" him-- we were known to have some heated debates but we never yessed each other.

Coach May ,you have a PM

Will, on my son's HS team, one of the seniors, who was a team captain, called one of the coaches a f***ing F*gg*t. Our head coach stripped him of being a team captain and indefinitely suspended him. The "indefinite" suspension lasted one day, a preseason scrimmage. The day after that he was back to being a starter and has played nearly every inning since.

So, what do you think about the message our head coach sent?

Hmmm...was he? Just a weak attempt at levity there.
The player(s) I'm describing is/are respectful, just think they know more at times. Outword disrespect is another matter. Not having been there I don't know if I can comment on it, but if a player said that to me I'll tell you exactly what I'd do. Seriously first of all I'd probably have a chuckle. Anyone who knows me and has the guts to say that...well lets just say has cajones or is self destructive. Next I'd probably take a public poll right there. Who here on this team agrees with Johnny? If a majority raise their hands, I make Johnny Captain for life and we move on. If not and Johnny desires to continue to play for me, then he'll have to atone for his isolated but emotional outburst including suspension if that's what it takes. One thing for sure...whatever I decide doesn't change for good behavior. 3 days means 3 days. Life means life. That's why as a leader you can never ever over-react and then back off IMHO. Also, I don't think it's necessary for a coach to explain his decisions to parents of uninvolved players who might be judging him. Parents perspectives are always clouded by their concern first for their son. I know as I am one too.

o6 catcherdad

To be a good coach you have to be consistent. Kids are not stupid. whatever rules are for all the players. You know winning was important to me. but more importantly it was the journey to get there. If the journey includes looking the other way when something happens because it might affect that won loss record you lose.

Will...well said!