Congratulations are in order for both the Cubs and the White Sox for giving the baseball world some great baseball this year
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I probably don't speak for everyone, but how great would it be to see an All-Chicago World Series? Don't know if it ever happened before but in today's media crazy world, it would really be something to behold... at least it would here in Chi-town. Odds don't really look like it will happen but stranger things have happened!
quote:Originally posted by TRhit:
Congratulations are in order for both the Cubs and the White Sox for giving the baseball world some great baseball this year
To say the Sox have been playing "great" baseball might be a stretch as they sputtered to the line. The Tigers did what they were supposed to do - bow out and let the Twins and Sox settle this thing on the field. This may be a "great" game.
quote:Originally posted by nc42dad:
...but how great would it be to see an All-Chicago World Series? Don't know if it ever happened before ...
nc42dad: You sound like a Cub fan in denial. The year was 1906 and the Sox prevailed four games to two.
1908 saw the last Cubs WS victory. A bit more recently for the Sox.
TRIVIA:
Only two teams have won a single game playoff and then went on to win the World Series - the 1948 Indians and then 30 years later, 1978 Yankees. Now, another 30 years later, the Sox or Twins have the same chance.
Should be a "great" month of baseball.
Of the two, I think the Cubs actually have the best chance of making it to the WS.
The Angels and the Rays are much tougher than the Dodgers, Phillies or Brewers.
I should have said Red Sox too, right? I'm worried about them as well.
The Angels and the Rays are much tougher than the Dodgers, Phillies or Brewers.
I should have said Red Sox too, right? I'm worried about them as well.
Used to Hit 300-
Cub fan in denial? I don't know about that... just a baseball fan. I must say though, that Wrigley has been much more fan friendly in my experiences over the years.
Cub fan in denial? I don't know about that... just a baseball fan. I must say though, that Wrigley has been much more fan friendly in my experiences over the years.
All of us Chicago area folks are entering uncharted waters now. Two teams on the verge of the playoffs. Right now, it is a good place to be.
Go Sox!
Go Sox!
What year was it that both teams made the playoffs?
quote:Originally posted by igball:
What year was it that both teams made the playoffs?
The only time was 1906 when the White Sox triumphed in the World Series.
quote:Originally posted by nc42dad:
I must say though, that Wrigley has been much more fan friendly in my experiences over the years.
Having grown up on the NW side of the city, yes, Wrigley was/is much more fan friendly.
Can you imagine being 14 yo, having Pops give you a $10 spot and jumping on the El to watch 2 games of a 3 game set between the Cubs and the Big Red Machine? And being able to watch the last 5 innings from the eight row because there was no one in the place? Talk about fan friendly!
now to go to Wrigley its $ 40 just to park, but worth every penny. of course the el is always running.
nc42, I agree with you. I'd love to see both teams get to the WS. I think most Cub fans would hope for that also. Not so sure about Sox fans though. In fact, word is that most Sox fans would rather not make it to the series, than risk losing to the Cubs. I know that sounds nutty, but according to their Chairman, it's true. I could care less who the Cubs would face, at least they would have made it that far.
Rosy, did you just bait the trap to see who would bite?
Ha, Ha Go Sox!
Ha, Ha Go Sox!
quote:nc42, I agree with you. I'd love to see both teams get to the WS. I think most Cub fans would hope for that also. Not so sure about Sox fans though. In fact, word is that most Sox fans would rather not make it to the series, than risk losing to the Cubs. I know that sounds nutty, but according to their Chairman, it's true.
When I was growing up as a kid here, I would probably have agreed with that statement. Not now.
When my kids were very little, we got grief at "the Cell" when we tried to bring in a stupid sandwich for them. At the time they weren't eating junk food.
When the neighbor took us to Wrigley, the waitress brought my kids free Sammy Sosa figurines/cards.
I never could root against the Cubs again (except versus the White Sox). How exciting is the City Series? Crank it up a notch and put the World Championship on the line.......it would be priceless. Two of the oldest, greatest franchises, fighting it out crosstown. How could you NOT want to experience that? Who cares who wins..
If it gets there...We win!
HOME FIELD ADVANTAGE TO THE SUPERIOR TEAM AND LEAGUE!
HOME FIELD ADVANTAGE TO THE SUPERIOR TEAM AND LEAGUE!
The Cubbies will manage to screw this up, they can't help it, it's the natural order of things and a century of fruitless battles proves it. The White Sox just beat three different teams in three days. They just got hot when it mattered most much like 2005. Beware, the Sox will find a way. The good news in 4 or 5 days from now, Mayor Daley won't need to worry about shutting down Wrigleyville bars. 
quote:Originally posted by HSDad:
The Cubbies will manage to screw this up, they can't help it,
Manny! Manny! Manny!
Geez, with pitching like that who needs Bartman?
I think the Cubby pitchers went poo poo in their panties tonight.
WHERE ARE ALL THE "L" FLAGS??? SHOULDN'T THE "W" FLAGS COME DOWN AFTER A LOSS???
I didn't realize 1 win = 3 victories and a playoff series victory. Like I said this afternoon, Cubs in 4. Now maybe 5 though.
5 what? More centuries?
Memo to wrigley field maintenance dept:
Order 9 EXTRA LARGE "L" flags.
designating our:
PLAYOFF RECORD OF FUTILITY!!!!!!!
Order 9 EXTRA LARGE "L" flags.
designating our:
PLAYOFF RECORD OF FUTILITY!!!!!!!
I'm tired of hearing on the radio the last couple of days that Pinella doesns't know how to manage in a short series. Not to long ago his WC Mariners team unfortunately swept the 95-game DIV winning White Sox in 2000. The press has to get off Pinella. None of Pinella's decisions cost the Cubs. Its totally on the players. I'm a White Sox fan, but Pinella is a very good manager and I like him. I think any of us would take him sitting in the Sox dug-out. There is a shortage of very good managers in this game. And we are lucky to have Ozzie too. We had a real bad ERA of Lamont, Bevington and Manual. Yikes.
How do you defend him batting Soriano in the lead off spot (1 for 14) after the way he performed in the playoffs last year in the leadoff spot? How do you defend him batting Fukudome 10 times in a three game series after watching him the last two months of the season?
How about Lou letting Dempster lose a game all by himself? Clearly he should have been yanked more than a couple of batters sooner in game 1. Or how do you defend not playing Lilly, Johnson and very little playing of Fontenot? These three were playing as well or better than anyone on the team the last month of the season. Either Fontenot ofr Johnson would have been much better than Fukedome. Lou just sat in the dugout until he turned into a pumpkin.
Or doing nothing to generate some runs via small ball considering they weren't hitting?
Lou deserves the blame just as much as or more than the players. Managing in a playoff series is a different animal than managing a regular season game, few of which are life or death. I saw a lot of Dusty in Lou during the playoffs. Please tell us just Lou did that qualified him as a very good manager? Torre and his staff completely outmanaged and outcoached The Cub staff.
Or doing nothing to generate some runs via small ball considering they weren't hitting?
Lou deserves the blame just as much as or more than the players. Managing in a playoff series is a different animal than managing a regular season game, few of which are life or death. I saw a lot of Dusty in Lou during the playoffs. Please tell us just Lou did that qualified him as a very good manager? Torre and his staff completely outmanaged and outcoached The Cub staff.
One thing is for sure, I was probably spot on in my previous posts about the Cub fan. You guys are so bitter and have watched a bad club play for so long, you don't know a good thing when you have it. If the Cubs got swept and Lou batted Soriano down and didn't bat Fukudome at all, you'd be complaining about why he didn't go with what made the Cubs the best team in the NL and the odd on favorite to represent the NL in the WS. But I guess that is what it like to be a Cub fan; should-a, would-a, could-a. You don't know the nuances of the game. The Cub players crapped in their shorts, plain and simple.
I believe if you asked me in August, I would not have wanted Soriano and Fukudome batting 1 and 2 in the batting order. It is definitely not a shoulda, coulda thing. Also, just because you are a Cub fan doesn't mean that you do not know the nuances of baseball. It just means that despite knowing the nuances, you follow this team that drives you crazy.
Tuzi....
You are right...the Cubs did **** in their shorts. Lou didn't, he just slept through it. If he is a "very good" or "great" manager," I guess the bar is pretty low.
Speaking of ****, what "Nuances of the game" are you talking about? I'd really like to hear a good answer to that one. This is one Cub fan who knows they got beat plain and simple, but Lou is part and parcel of it.
Bitter? Don't know a good thing when they have it? I know this....Ozzie might not have won that series if he were managing the Cubs, but he sure wouldn't have gone down without a fight. In my lifetime, the sox have been every bit as bad as The Cubs, so any sox fans must be bitter too......if you've been watching the sox over the last 50 years you have been watching a lot of bad baseball as well.
I'm not bitter, just disgusted at a team that didn't come to play. It isn't so much that they lost...they didn't even give themselves a chance.
You are right...the Cubs did **** in their shorts. Lou didn't, he just slept through it. If he is a "very good" or "great" manager," I guess the bar is pretty low.
Speaking of ****, what "Nuances of the game" are you talking about? I'd really like to hear a good answer to that one. This is one Cub fan who knows they got beat plain and simple, but Lou is part and parcel of it.
Bitter? Don't know a good thing when they have it? I know this....Ozzie might not have won that series if he were managing the Cubs, but he sure wouldn't have gone down without a fight. In my lifetime, the sox have been every bit as bad as The Cubs, so any sox fans must be bitter too......if you've been watching the sox over the last 50 years you have been watching a lot of bad baseball as well.
I'm not bitter, just disgusted at a team that didn't come to play. It isn't so much that they lost...they didn't even give themselves a chance.
quote:I believe if you asked me in August, I would not have wanted Soriano and Fukudome batting 1 and 2 in the batting order. It is definitely not a shoulda, coulda thing. Also, just because you are a Cub fan doesn't mean that you do not know the nuances of baseball. It just means that despite knowing the nuances, you follow this team that drives you crazy.
Why would you have not wanted Soriano batting 1?
Cubs 2008 record 97-64
2008 Cubs record with Soriano leading off – 69 wins – 36 loses
2008 Cubs record with anyone other than Soriano leading off – 28 wins – 28 loses
Doesn't the above make it obvious if you are the manager?
PG
There is of course no record of how the Cubs did with Soriano hitting 5th. That record is with Soriano in the lineup (batting 1st), period. If anything those numbers (69-36) should make it obvious to Lou that Soriano should be in the lineup, but maybe not 1st. IMHO, they may have done a bit better with him in the 5 spot. There is no way I'm going to be convinced that with his OP% he should be hitting more often than anyone else. Then you put Fukedome behind him and no one is getting on at the top of the order. They might have been playing well at times during the season, but not right now.
The same goes for Ted Lilly, who in spite of being their best pitcher the last month never threw a pitch during the series.
Yep, when Alphonso is hot he can carry a team, but when he is in Shawon Dunston mode, forget about it.
What should have been obvious to Lou after a game or two of this series is that he needed to shake things up a bit, especially if what the radio guys are saying is true about Lou confiding to Jerry Reinsdorf (of all people) before the playoffs that he was concerened about his offense.
Again, they just got beat but it was kind of like letting a guy punch you in the nose and not doing anything to keep him from doing it over and over again.
There is of course no record of how the Cubs did with Soriano hitting 5th. That record is with Soriano in the lineup (batting 1st), period. If anything those numbers (69-36) should make it obvious to Lou that Soriano should be in the lineup, but maybe not 1st. IMHO, they may have done a bit better with him in the 5 spot. There is no way I'm going to be convinced that with his OP% he should be hitting more often than anyone else. Then you put Fukedome behind him and no one is getting on at the top of the order. They might have been playing well at times during the season, but not right now.
The same goes for Ted Lilly, who in spite of being their best pitcher the last month never threw a pitch during the series.
Yep, when Alphonso is hot he can carry a team, but when he is in Shawon Dunston mode, forget about it.
What should have been obvious to Lou after a game or two of this series is that he needed to shake things up a bit, especially if what the radio guys are saying is true about Lou confiding to Jerry Reinsdorf (of all people) before the playoffs that he was concerened about his offense.
Again, they just got beat but it was kind of like letting a guy punch you in the nose and not doing anything to keep him from doing it over and over again.
I'll stand behind what I said. Please look at the stats for this year's playoffs and last year's playoffs. They speak for themselves.
The Cubs were not necessarily better because he was leading off during the season. They were better because he was in the lineup. He only batted leadoff. That does not necessarily make him a great leadoff hitter. He was the team leader in homeruns. Of cource, they are going to be better with him in the lineup over the course of a 161 game season. The might have even had a better record if he was hitting in a more appropriate spot in the batting order where his homeruns were producing more runs.
If you are going to make a valid comparison. Show the Cubs record with him in the leadoff position and compare it to their record when he is in the batting order not in the leadoff position.
The Cubs were not necessarily better because he was leading off during the season. They were better because he was in the lineup. He only batted leadoff. That does not necessarily make him a great leadoff hitter. He was the team leader in homeruns. Of cource, they are going to be better with him in the lineup over the course of a 161 game season. The might have even had a better record if he was hitting in a more appropriate spot in the batting order where his homeruns were producing more runs.
If you are going to make a valid comparison. Show the Cubs record with him in the leadoff position and compare it to their record when he is in the batting order not in the leadoff position.
Cub batting averages in the playoffs. You tell me where the problem is.
Soriano .071
Fukudome .100
Lee .545
Ramirez .182
Soto .182
Edmunds .200
DeRosa .333
Theriot .273
Fontenot .333
Ward .333
The first position in the batting order hit .071
The second position in the batting order hit .083
Soriano .071
Fukudome .100
Lee .545
Ramirez .182
Soto .182
Edmunds .200
DeRosa .333
Theriot .273
Fontenot .333
Ward .333
The first position in the batting order hit .071
The second position in the batting order hit .083
Near as I can tell, Soriano batting 5th in the lineup - 0
It looks like the only two times he didn't lead off and was still in the line up the Cubs were 0-2.
I do agree he would be better as a 3 hitter (he can steal bases and hit home runs). He strikes out too much and doesn't walk enough to be an ideal lead off hitter. But they were a .500 team when he wasn't the lead off hitter. How do you change that in the playoffs?
It looks like the only two times he didn't lead off and was still in the line up the Cubs were 0-2.
I do agree he would be better as a 3 hitter (he can steal bases and hit home runs). He strikes out too much and doesn't walk enough to be an ideal lead off hitter. But they were a .500 team when he wasn't the lead off hitter. How do you change that in the playoffs?
What PG and Tuzi said.
Sweet Lou was good enough to inflate your opinion of a better than average MLB team. They looked like a world beater next to the weak level of play in the senior circuit.5-8 VS the Dodgers says it all.
Maybe:
It was your big game no shows, Dempster, Ramirez,Soto and Soriano( Do you think if he batted 5th, things would have been different?). Last month it was Lee you were whining about!Turns out he was your best man when it counted.
Bottom line is any close look at the flubby record and you will notice that they play real well VS the Pirates and Braves(16 over) but not so good VS the better NL teams,none of which are even in the top 5 teams in baseball.
Y'all simply deceived yourselves...you just wanted a World Series team and you REALLY wanted to match our Sox! Well, you are going to wear argyle forever gents!
Sweet Lou was good enough to inflate your opinion of a better than average MLB team. They looked like a world beater next to the weak level of play in the senior circuit.5-8 VS the Dodgers says it all.
Maybe:
It was your big game no shows, Dempster, Ramirez,Soto and Soriano( Do you think if he batted 5th, things would have been different?). Last month it was Lee you were whining about!Turns out he was your best man when it counted.
Bottom line is any close look at the flubby record and you will notice that they play real well VS the Pirates and Braves(16 over) but not so good VS the better NL teams,none of which are even in the top 5 teams in baseball.
Y'all simply deceived yourselves...you just wanted a World Series team and you REALLY wanted to match our Sox! Well, you are going to wear argyle forever gents!
Oh well, didn't turn out to be such a great season after all did it?
Neither of our teams showed well did they?
Yes I wanted a WS, but it had nothing to do with the white sox. Anyone should have known the Cubs may have had a chance but certainly were not a dominant team that you would have expected to win it all.
Anyway, things look bright for me. I still have 4 of my favorite teams in the playoffs, counting my new favorite team THE RAYS! Since they are my soon to be home team it seems like a good time to back them!
Neither of our teams showed well did they?
Yes I wanted a WS, but it had nothing to do with the white sox. Anyone should have known the Cubs may have had a chance but certainly were not a dominant team that you would have expected to win it all.
Anyway, things look bright for me. I still have 4 of my favorite teams in the playoffs, counting my new favorite team THE RAYS! Since they are my soon to be home team it seems like a good time to back them!