Conserving Energy?

OH,

I disagree with you. A catcher should not throw back from his knees - ever. At the youth level, it comes off as lazy. It also forms bad habits of doing so with runner's on base, which could/should lead to teams delay stealing against him.

A catcher's main job is to lead the team. He should be crisp with his throws and set the tempo for his team.

What does he need to conserve energy for?

quote:

While watching MLB games together I've pointed out that every catcher uses this technique.

When he's playing 162+ games in a season, we'll talk. Until that point, I don't really think it is important to "conserve energy" by throwing from his knees. If he gets into the habit of dropping to his knees, he had better have a cannon for an arm for reasons redbird stated....

Redbird5, I'm with you,

Every time a catcher throws I want him to be practicing and reinforcing his throwing mechanics. Whether throwing while warming up before games/practices or while in games. Stand up and throw a nice crisp throw to the pitchers chest. If he does this everytime he catches then he will not need to conserve energy, it will be part of his regular game.

If he needs to conserve energy then he might need to run a few more sprints and poles to get in better shape.

hmmmm. Well. My $.02.

I don't think throwing from the knees would conserve energy. But I do think that sometimes it is a good thing to do. It can show arm strength, and if you're back picking at 1B, then it does get the ball to the 1B's glove faster - you almost always make that play from your knees. And I believe in the idea that a good catcher always shows his best stuff all of the time - let the other team know in advance what they are going to have to deal with in the event they attempt to steal. Many times, if they see great throws, the coach won't even try to send a runner. My kid is 7-7 on the season, and many have not even sent their runners - he makes his throws as "bullet" like as possible, always - no slacking. So why throw down to second from your knees?

And I do think that sometimes a C would need to "conserve" energy - that is: be concise with throws, etc. After all, if you catch every game of the season, imagine how many times you make the throw back to the mound - 100 times per game perhaps???? By the end of a 30 game season, a 16-17 yr C can be pretty wiped, wouldn't you agree??

My HS son conditions regularly, and is in great shape, and is one of the fastest/quickest yet biggest guys on the team, and I do think he needs to "conserve" (my translation: "be prepared") to play 30 full games (and he is).

or even back to the pitcher....

My two cents:

Throwing from the knees is not something that should be encouraged, nor should it be practiced. If a catcher needs to conserve energy, that is a very bad sign. Catchers need to have full energy all game. Also, throwing from your knees doesn't really save that much energy. While it is nice to occasionally relax on your knees, it should be judged on a pitch by pitch basis, and only done with no runners on base.

I like to see my kid at game speed. A strong, crisp throw, chest high - glove side. But, I know some pitcher's who do not appreciate GED10 throwing 100% at 60' 6" or less if he takes up a little ground first!

And, I've seen some really good catcher's throw from their knees too, routinely. Build up his conditioning, he'll appreciate you for it later!
GED10DaD

Nothing wrong at all with throwing back to the pitcher from the knees.....provided no runners are on base and the kid has the arm to make a good,crisp throw back. Any catcher with a decent arm should be able to throw down to 2nd from his knees...no, I am not saying he should, just that he should have the arm to be able to. With runners on, if a catcher throws back from his knees, he is either too lazy or stupid or badly coached to play catcher, period. Get me someone in there that understands the situation and has his head in the game.

Most pitchers want a good, solid throw to them...not one where the catcher smokes them. A smart catcher doesn't want to smoke the pitcher unless it is time to send a little non-verbal message out to the mound to get thy butt in gear (if you ever caught you'll know exactly what I mean); most pitchers get the message pretty quick.

As far as conserving energy, that's a non factor. Actually, it is good to stand occasionally to throw back anyway to keep the legs loose. If you need to conserve energy by how you throw back to the pitcher, I would advise getting into shape first because your margin for error in regards to your "energy" is too fine for you to catch.

All of this raises another question...with runner at 3rd, how many times do you see a MIF back up the pitcher on the throw back? Something fundamental that way too often I see get neglected by coaches, even in HS. Last year I saw three HS games decided by the pitcher having a throw get past him (good throw, just nonchalant effort by the pitcher)and the R3 scored because the MIFs never made an attempt to move over to back up a throw.

Don't even get me started on infielders diving or selling out to keep the ball in the infield with a R2...fundamental situational stuff that some kids just don't seem to get. Oh, well I guess I'm too old to understand how the game is supposed to be played these days.

Unless they are Tony Pena or Pudge, I love seeing catchers throwing from knees, especially with runners on base. We will delay steal on them all day until he gets off the knees.

As far as teaching my own catchers. I tell them to stand up and make a crisp throw back to the pitcher.

Its 97% all arm when you throw from your knees. You'll save your knees and enery at the cost of your arm or shoulder.

Today I went to watch a catcher on my follow list. He must have subscribed to the conserve energy side of things. Didn't back up first on an infield ball, through from his knees a little too often and lollipopped his throws to second. I should have conserved my energy by staying home.

Many times my son will catch 3 in one day in a tournament and 4 or 5 in a weekend. He does throw back to the pitcher on his knees to save his legs.

He can throw to 2nd from his knees and has picked off a few runners throwing to second from his knees because the runner doesn't realize the throw is going all the way down to second. The runner knows he throws it back to the pitcher from his knees and they lose their guard.

Also, it does speed up the game. He's making crisp throws, just not taking the time to stand up and squat back down.

If he's only catching one game, it's no big deal. However, in tournaments, it is a big deal to save the legs.

Primary reason I would occasionally throw back from my knees to the pitcher (no baserunners) was to control the tempo of the game when I had a pitcher that worked fast and was on his game that day. Vice versa, I would slow things down when I thought my pitcher was rushing himself or needed to get himself under control/in sync. If hitters tried slowing the game down by stepping out/delaying, I'd get pretty verbal with them about their manhood, etc...anything I could do to keep things moving. Basically, I could be a real PITA if I thought it would help my pitcher.

Conserving energy never came to mind on the field. While I was always a pretty good hitter, to me the best part of the game was always when I was behind the plate. Driving in runs was nice but as a catcher I always considered the staff's ERA was also my "catching ERA", so when our pitchers threw a shutout I was probably happier than with a 3 for 4, 3 RBI day. The team lost some games where I went 3 for 4 but never did lose a shutout....funny how that works.

Ozone, I liked your post about "conserving my energy by staying home". LOL...the shame is kids forget that somebody is always watching.

Catching Coach, you left out Molina. Your point about the delayed steal is exactly why you never throw back from the knees with baserunners. That is when you find a smarter catcher to put in.

quote:

Originally posted by High School Dad:
Many times my son will catch 3 in one day in a tournament and 4 or 5 in a weekend. He does throw back to the pitcher on his knees to save his legs.

He can throw to 2nd from his knees and has picked off a few runners throwing to second from his knees because the runner doesn't realize the throw is going all the way down to second. The runner knows he throws it back to the pitcher from his knees and they lose their guard.

Also, it does speed up the game. He's making crisp throws, just not taking the time to stand up and squat back down.

If he's only catching one game, it's no big deal. However, in tournaments, it is a big deal to save the legs.

HS Dad's thoughts mirror mine. I actually wish I had titled the thread, "Throwing Back to the Pitcher". My son's fitness/skills are not an issue, however there can be no question that valuable energy can be conserved in this manner. The advantage of speeding things up in a 2 hour time limit tourney is also a plus. If every MLB catcher throws back to the pitcher from his knees, it's OK in my book...

quote:

Originally posted by OHdaddio:....I actually wish I had titled the thread, "Throwing Back to the Pitcher". My son's fitness/skills are not an issue....If every MLB catcher throws back to the pitcher from his knees, it's OK in my book...

Hey, my bad.... Glad there's another catcher dad here. Let us know how he does the rest of the season. GED10DaD

My son is a catcher. I don't catch him 3 games in 1 day. I think that is crazy to do to a kid. If MLB catchers can't do it, why do coaches insist on doing it to pre-teen and teen players? He catches a max of 2 games in a day. Every return throw to the pitcher requires him to stand up and throw a crisp throw back to the pitcher. We have played as many games as anyone in the country from 8U (playing up against 9U) to 14U last year. His standing up and throwing has never slowed down a game. We have never been a victim to time limits.

I will back up what ozone says...it is a bad habit. Stay away from it. HS and college coaches (as well as pro scouts) will downgrade a catcher who throws back from his knees. Take it for what its worth.

OHDaddio, MLB players also catch pop flies one handed and often don't run out IF groundballs. Since they do it, would you advocate your son following suit? I would bet the answer would be 'no'.

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Many times my son will catch 3 in one day in a tournament and 4 or 5 in a weekend.

The last time our team saw a catcher being used like this, it was a track meet by her 4th game. This catcher easily had the strongest arm during the tournament too. Also opens up your catcher to injury from fatigue.