D3 with Good academics Hopeful -- PG Academic a good option?

I would skip the PG Academic and instead attend Headfirst and Showball events, where he'll be guaranteed to be in front of and interact with college coaches.

https://www.headfirsthonorroll...ball-showcase-camps/

https://www.headfirsthonorroll...l-southeast-session/

Sounds like he is taking all the right steps, fishing in the right pond and, of course, the projectable body and pitching success to date will help, assuming he is in a reasonably competitive HS and travel program.  Distinct possibility that more than one school will look at him and see a kid likely to be throwing effectively in the mid 80's by sophomore year, which will do just fine.

With no athletic $ at stake, I suspect there will be ample opportunity.  The window is not closing, it is just about to open wide as D3 recruiting certainly continues through senior season.  Some Early Decision stuff will go by the wayside but that's not the end of the world.  We have had several players over the years find their D3 homes toward the end of senior HS season.  ENJOY THE RIDE and especially don't forget to enjoy that last HS season.  

3and2Fastball posted:

I would skip the PG Academic and instead attend Headfirst and Showball events, where he'll be guaranteed to be in front of and interact with college coaches.

https://www.headfirsthonorroll...ball-showcase-camps/

https://www.headfirsthonorroll...l-southeast-session/

 

+1,000 to this.  The Headfirst events we've been to have been great experiences with lots of opportunities to talk to the coaches.  PG does not guarantee what coaches will be there nor will they tell you who is coming.

• Concur, I'd pass on the PG Academic Event.
• Go to the NCAA listing of D3 baseball schools....you'll see the standings from the past season which could help you identify a few other D3's in the S.East.
• Another option is the Arizona Fall Senior Classic - lots of D3's of all shapes and sizes attend. 
• Before you get serious about the Headfirst Academic Camp, look at the list of schools attending: any interest by your son, how do your son's GPA-ACT fit within the academic profile of the school? (College Data middle 50% ACT scores of recently accepted students)

Headfirst worked very well for my son.

I would suggest that your son take the ACT again, and try to add a few mph on his fastball, to give him a larger choice of HA schools. The GPA is fine.

I don't have  any knowledge of the schools in your area....I'm a midwest guy. 

Just an observation but he may want to expand his geographic area to increase his chances of finding a school or the right school. D3s are starting to rev up and your son maybe better served with a wide net and getting on as many HA radars as he can. For my son top choices didn't work out either by admissions or $ but he found a home out of his choice area and in the Midwest and it was likely the best fit over all. 

Some good replies already...

My oldest did the PG Academic.  While we really liked the showcase for him, he was a D1 talent and named a top prospect.  I don't think it's for everyone and at this stage, I think it's not worth your time or money.

Youngest son is a D3 guy at school in the mid South.  He did not do PG Academic.  For showcases, HF or Showball this Fall should you/he choose to showcase.

For most D3's and particularly right now for a 2019, it's about expressing interest to the Admissions reps and the baseball coaches directly.  Visit, interview, email, send video, etc. 

Schools are looking for good students like your son and they always need pitching. 

I'm a broken record on Colleges That Change Lives (ctcl.org).  There are quite a few in and around the geographic area you highlighted.  26 ACT and 3.75 GPA would fit nicely.  Schools like McDaniel, Lynchburg, Guilford, Emory & Henry, Juniata, Ursinus...And there are other schools in the ODAC as you noted and in the SAA (where my son plays) like Berry, Oglethorpe, Centre, Rhodes, Sewanee, Hendrix.  And many schools in Ohio, e.g., Ohio Wesleyan, Denison, et.al.

Just my two cents:  playing a fall baseball schedule is nice, but velocity and skill development and the college search should take precedence if he wants to make a college roster.  Work a Driveline program.  Develop better velocity and command.  And pound the pavement to schools that fit.

Good luck!

2boydad posted:

Just an observation but he may want to expand his geographic area to increase his chances of finding a school or the right school. D3s are starting to rev up and your son maybe better served with a wide net and getting on as many HA radars as he can. For my son top choices didn't work out either by admissions or $ but he found a home out of his choice area and in the Midwest and it was likely the best fit over all. 

Agreed 100%. Son had a couple really good HA D3's lined up right in our backyard, but ended up choosing a large University 1300 mi. away in the middle of a city. Bottom line is that he had a lot of good choices from some very classy schools/HC's.

  It's sort of unfair that they go by velo so much with pitchers. A 6'4" Junior on my son's college team barely touched 80 when he showed up on campus as a Freshman. He now sits 87-89, and touches 90+. Two others on his team also hit 90- one is a Lefty, and he has a hellacious slider. I would bet that almost all of them developed that velo after they attended college.

    Stuff your son full of food as much as possible, and look into limited use of protein shakes. That should help him a bit put on a bit of muscle. Both of my sons were/are bone skinny, and had to eat like Joey Chestnut to put on some lbs., and some MPH.

   If you can get the ACT up to 28-30 it'll open up doors for you. Gotta move fast though, as spots will fill up during the ED (NOV1-15), and EDII(DEC).

  Your son's height will give him some advantage over shorter recruits. 

Thanks again... the collective all y'all are the source of information I trust most.

Every coach has told him he needs to bulk up and throw harder...

Makes me wonder if playing Fall baseball, and how that constrains training, hampers his development more than it helps his recruiting. With the Velo where its at now, playing in front of coaches isn't accomplishing much.

Currently, there aren't any D3 baseball programs in SC.

http://web1.ncaa.org/onlineDir...sion=3&sport=MBA

IMO, here's his dilemma... If he shows up on almost any D3 campus next fall at 6-4 180, with a FB sitting 85, he's going to make the team and have a chance to contribute regardless of how much interest that school shows him this fall. Most D3s are not in the habit of turning guys like that away.

However, if he shows up next fall at one of the better D3 baseball programs in your region (Roanoke,  Christopher Newport, Randolph-Macon, VA Wesleyan) and his FB is just touching 82 and he can't get guys out, then he may not make the team, and he probably won't play if he does.

My advice would be to visit a number of schools that are a good academic fit this fall. Include schools that have all levels of baseball success. Apply to a mix of schools that he liked this fall. Then in the spring when you have a better idea about his "bloomage", start contacting the schools that fit his skill level. He should have until May 1st with most schools as far as admissions. It doesn't sound like you're looking at highly selective D3s. For the others, it's never too late to get recruited, or to just bet on yourself and show up.

Good luck.

3and2Fastball posted:

I would skip the PG Academic and instead attend Headfirst and Showball events, where he'll be guaranteed to be in front of and interact with college coaches.

https://www.headfirsthonorroll...ball-showcase-camps/

https://www.headfirsthonorroll...l-southeast-session/

 

Yes^^^

Be careful about accepting the advice that 2019 D3 recruiting goes well into senior year...my boy just committed to a D3 in Maryland and the coach stated that they were pretty much done for 2019s...also said the cutoff has been earlier each year for many schools...good luck.

This is true. Many D3s  have cut off dates and coaches are trying too get guys locked up with ED. Later for RD. My D3 was recruited by a lot of D3 From Mid August  until late October/early to mid November. (It was going somewhat fast as we had an in the know coach helping us)  Nothing I recall once application Deadlines came. 

His coach told me some years they can get them by ED some years such as my son's they have to go to RD and then hope they commit to the school.

JUCO now NAIA son had  D3s approach him Sept/Oct then nothing as he turned them down. Not his route. He did have a top D3 recruit him as a transfer this summer. 

Both  sons had NAIA recruiting until early summer as they have a rolling admissions. Others we know find state schools at various levels into spring and summer of senior year but that can be risky waiting. If recruiting doesn't seem to go as you would like For D3 there are still options. Never give up just adjust expectations.

 I admire your son's flexibility.  Not to hijack the thread but my 2019 OF will only consider 4-5 HA's that are still showing some interest and they are wrapping things up by first week in October.  They all say he's in the mix, one of our top 3, etc. etc.  I have not reason to doubt their stance but it's incredibly exasperating that they all want to see him again after we spent all summer trying to get in front of these very coaches.  All will require ED if he's fortunate enough to get an offer.  If he doesn't get an offer at one of these four schools he's most interested in he may just bag the baseball route and take his chances on a purely academic front.  Problem there is he's middle of the road test wise (50% at his target schools--32 ACT) and baseball is really his only hook (unless some school likes his quirky underwater photographs).  

MidAtlanticDad posted:

Currently, there aren't any D3 baseball programs in SC.

http://web1.ncaa.org/onlineDir...sion=3&sport=MBA

IMO, here's his dilemma... If he shows up on almost any D3 campus next fall at 6-4 180, with a FB sitting 85, he's going to make the team and have a chance to contribute regardless of how much interest that school shows him this fall. Most D3s are not in the habit of turning guys like that away.

However, if he shows up next fall at one of the better D3 baseball programs in your region (Roanoke,  Christopher Newport, Randolph-Macon, VA Wesleyan) and his FB is just touching 82 and he can't get guys out, then he may not make the team, and he probably won't play if he does.

My advice would be to visit a number of schools that are a good academic fit this fall. Include schools that have all levels of baseball success. Apply to a mix of schools that he liked this fall. Then in the spring when you have a better idea about his "bloomage", start contacting the schools that fit his skill level. He should have until May 1st with most schools as far as admissions. It doesn't sound like you're looking at highly selective D3s. For the others, it's never too late to get recruited, or to just bet on yourself and show up.

Good luck.

Midatlantic pretty much has this one nailed. The one place we differ is at 6'4" 180 and throwing 82 I would guess (and be willing to bet) you still make the team regardless if you get anyone out in the fall just because of the projectables...I watched some of the best D3 baseball teams this past spring quite often including multiple games vs 2 different teams that made the WS and IMO neither one of them would have cut a kid that is as what is being described here.

My sons team was not far from the WS and I would bet the house he makes that team as walk on.

It's always better to have a guaranteed roster spot than trying to walk on..at any level..my advice would be to narrow a list down quickly and send videos directly to the head coach..schedule visits from the responses and ask directly when meeting with the coach if he is offering a guaranteed roster spot if it's a D3..you don't want to be the one in a game of musical chairs left without..that's what it is at this point in the calendar.

I have to disagree with the "you make the team at 6'3" (where he is now) and a RHP at 79-81 (where he is now).  Some teams.  Maybe.  But that is a big risk.  My son's HA team cut multiple guys like that (incl at least 2 guys over 6'4"), unless they were a submariner.  Too many RHP throwing mid 80's and UP.  Other schools may have room for a project, but know your market -- do your research if your son really wants to play, if not recruited and tries to walk on anywhere.  

And be careful if anyone offers a preferred walk on status...when I hear that I run the other way.

smokeminside posted:

 I admire your son's flexibility.  Not to hijack the thread but my 2019 OF will only consider 4-5 HA's that are still showing some interest and they are wrapping things up by first week in October.  They all say he's in the mix, one of our top 3, etc. etc.  I have not reason to doubt their stance but it's incredibly exasperating that they all want to see him again after we spent all summer trying to get in front of these very coaches.  All will require ED if he's fortunate enough to get an offer.  If he doesn't get an offer at one of these four schools he's most interested in he may just bag the baseball route and take his chances on a purely academic front.  Problem there is he's middle of the road test wise (50% at his target schools--32 ACT) and baseball is really his only hook (unless some school likes his quirky underwater photographs).  

Unfortunately, that's the way it is with D3 BB. Unless the coaches have seen your kid multiple times before, then they will want him to come to their camp. Had it happen with my eldest...they wanted him to come to a Sept. camp after he had Showcased ( very well) and visited their school in August, but with no promise of anything. His HS coach was an alum and he had updated them on his progress. We finally decided not to go the camp, as there were other, similar schools that were showing interest, and they weren't an expensive plane ride away.

   As it was, Sept and early OCT. of Senior year was filled with visiting camps, and playing in PG Tournaments. He turned down many, many camps...some with somewhat generic invites, but others with direct coach contact. There simply was no time to go to all of them. Unfortunately, though, I think that attending a camp is usually a must if you expect an offer from a school, unless they have extensive knowledge of you before the "silly season"(fall of Senior year for D3's).

  He also had some interest from a couple of HA D1's, but since it was last minute,  far away, and  hard to gauge the level of interest, he declined to attend. 

Twoboys posted:

I have to disagree with the "you make the team at 6'3" (where he is now) and a RHP at 79-81 (where he is now).  Some teams.  Maybe.  But that is a big risk.  My son's HA team cut multiple guys like that (incl at least 2 guys over 6'4"), unless they were a submariner.  Too many RHP throwing mid 80's and UP.  Other schools may have room for a project, but know your market -- do your research if your son really wants to play, if not recruited and tries to walk on anywhere.  

6'3" throws 80 has always relied on command and control - I am sorry sir but that isn't getting cut IMO.

He is going to get at least one season, that gives the pitching coach 1.5 years to work him. If he ticks up to low 80's with command he is going to be a very nice midweek starter who you are happy to throw on game 4 or 5 of a weekend if you get backed up by rain and or snow delays.

Bottom line is its impossible to guess based on numbers alone.  Best thing to do is work hard and try to get better.  Try to get up to 85mph and that will increase your chances significantly.  If you cant throw harder than your SS, your chances are not too great.  Do the research on the schools that could be a match.  How many pitchers do they have on staff?  Find their names, search for them on youtube, PG etc...more than likely you'll find video and stats on them.  Close your eyes and look at the numbers, does your son fit in?

Also, I'd like to mention something about D3 recruiting.  There is no "committing" at the D3 level.  There is absolutely nothing that binds a player and school together.  It is only a verbal agreement that the coach has a spot for you and that the player wants to go to that school.  Either party can and have changed their minds.  I had a D3 coach tell me that he does not consider a player "committed" until they show up for practice the first day.

That's true in general, but in my admittedly limited experience, the players who apply ED with a coach "tip" at HA D3's all get in and all show up.

JCG posted:

That's true in general, but in my admittedly limited experience, the players who apply ED with a coach "tip" at HA D3's all get in and all show up.

Very true...ED is as close as you get.  In our case my son will finish the last 4 of his official visits in Sept. and then decide which school to apply ED.  There are a couple of schools he would HAVE to apply ED, otherwise he risks not being able to get in.  

As mentioned before...without 'Coach support' during ED, the chances of getting into the elite HA schools is extremely tough.  The average SATs at HAs include the ED athletes.  Once you get past the athletes, the SATs for everyone else are through the roof .  And even then, high SATs, and high grades may not be enough unless you are #1 in your class from a remote state, are a diversity candidate, have a lot of family money to donate or are a legacy.  Net-net, it's unlikely that a 1300 SAT score gets anyone into a top 30 Liberal Arts college without Coach support.

Happened to see a couple of days ago that U Richmond has a camp in September that several other schools also will be at also.  Especially if It’s within driving distance for you, then could be of interest:  

http://collegebaseballcamps.co...ll/?event=7192#event

Dont known anything about the UR camp and I don’t think my son will be going—just fyi. 

Chico Escuela posted:

Happened to see a couple of days ago that U Richmond has a camp in September that several other schools also will be at also.  Especially if It’s within driving distance for you, then could be of interest:  

http://collegebaseballcamps.co...ll/?event=7192#event

Dont known anything about the UR camp and I don’t think my son will be going—just fyi. 

My boy (2020) went to their camp about a month ago.  Said it was well run.  A classmate went to the Princeton camp, then to the Richmond Camp.   Said the latter was run much better.

I may have missed it but the original posted never referenced HA - he asked about schools with decent academics. He then listed several schools in the VA area are that are good schools...nothing about HA. Nothing about the top 30 schools in the country.

As far as the grades he posted and the numbers he posted he is going to get into each and every school he listed as well as about 80 percent of the others in the country. These schools in my dealing don't do ED - Swarthmore, Johns Hopkins and the like may but that isn't what is the OP asked about. He certainly doesn't need a coach to walk him through admissions.

Go find a school your son likes and wants to attend - then reach out to the baseball coach. It won't be that hard I pinky swear!!

K.I.S.S....

Clueless PM me if you want I can give you a list of 30 plus schools with several hours of you that at least some if not many of them would be happy to talk with you.

OLD_SCHOOL got it right with respect to my son.

He is a good but not outstanding student so HA schools like Hopkins are not on the table (its also not what he wants). Admission into the schools we are thinking about should not be a problem. His ACT places him at 25%tile at a school such as Sewanee, but otherwise we are good with admissions. Merit-based aid would be less at a higher echelon school such as Sewanee (probably putting it out of reach), but his grades and ACT score generates enough merit aid to make schools like Roanoke and Randolph-Macon close to the NC state school price tag, which is what I can afford.

Son added 1 mph to his PR last night so thats a positive development. Hopefully he can add 2-3 more and it all goes smoothly.

I really want to thank all of you for your thoughts and insights. This discussion has been really helpful to me. I am very grateful to you all!

Texas1836 posted:

3and2Fastball posted:

I would skip the PG Academic and instead attend Headfirst and Showball events, where he'll be guaranteed to be in front of and interact with college coaches.

https://www.headfirsthonorroll...ball-showcase-camps/

https://www.headfirsthonorroll...l-southeast-session/

 

Yes^^^

3AND2,  SOCAL OG, and TEXAS,  are you guys saying the HF and SB camps are better opportunities than the PG Academic or all PG showcase events?   Is the player profile/ranking/exposure on PG not worth it?  

I'm asking because, my 2020 attended a HF event in June.  Looking for diversify and attend a PG Prospect Showcase in November.  

JYNY - I think there is tremendous value in a Perfect Game profile and in Perfect Game showcase.   I plan on having my 2021 kid attend a PG Showcase or two when he is ready to do so. 

For the original poster, though, whose kid is a 2019, time is of the essence. With Headfirst, they will know ahead of time which coaches will be there, they can contact the coaches of schools they are interested in ahead of time, and talk to the coaches in person at the event.  The OP specifically mentioned Roanoke, I think... The Roanoke coach will be at that Headfirst event.

JYNY,

This is my opinion. PG events assign grades that really are eyewash and only mean anything to PG and the kids/parents.. The grades are basically a psychological tool to "hook" players/parents into either trying to get a higher grade than a buddy or teammate or to try to increase their own grade. In other words, attend more events to raise your grade. Fact of the matter is, the measurables reported during the events are the only real thing that the coaches find value in. College coaches will assess with their own eyes or someone the know and trust. An anonymous "PG scout" writing a scouting report on your player at the showcase is not going to be a determining factor in a player's recruitment.

Getting in front of the coaches, the decision makers who decide if your player has what it takes to play at their program, if they are better than who they have on their board currently, is most important. You may find that getting to a HF or Showball camp gets them in front of those coaches, but often times you are just getting in front of an assistant coach who does not make the offer decision. If you impress them, that can sure open doors, but the best event to get to is one in which the head coach is attending (in my opinion).

Perfect Game tournaments certainly draw coaches out in the summer, no doubt. Great opportunity to show your stuff if a ball comes your way, you hit it well, or have a great outing as a pitcher. But that leaves a lot to chance, right? Camps give those coaches a lot more opportunities to see those skills.

I agree with GARYME, I'm not a huge fan of the PG format/grading.  A scout I know personally just laughs when people talk about PG grades/ranks.  However, I think its good to do an event or two, I just wouldn't count on that as part of your recruiting process.  I think in total my son may have done 1 or 2 PG events...I don't even think he has a ranking or grade but he still received plenty of D1 interested from other showcases/events.  My biggest issue with the PG Academic event is they will not guarantee who is going to be there...or give you a list of who has committed to being there.

Your mileage may vary but our experience with the HF events was fantastic.  Son spoke personally with many coaches and received lots of emails/txts from coaches after the event.  

I'm not as big a fan of the Showball events...but that being said the very first contact my son received from a school came out of a Showball showcase.  The showball events are run very much like a factory line and the coaches are not as accessible to the players. Where in contrast at HF the coaches are very accessible and encouraged to speak with players.  At showball the format is just not very conducive for communication.

Thats just been our experience...

Best of luck!

I'm with you, Socal OG. HF worked much better for us than Showball, BUT;

1- I know others who had the reverse experience.

2- My son had a mediocre tryout at Showball, and killed it at HF.

Son never did a PG Showcase, but just played in some of their Tournaments. Don't think it hurt. He got on a couple of flattering mentions... if nothing else, he could pad the resume with them for a coach doing(duing?)  diligence on him. 

In general, I think people have to keep in mind that the whole HF thing is designed specifically for Ballplayers who also are high achievers in the class room. There are very few schools attending HF that will look at you if you don't have at least a 27-8 ACT, and many want at least a 30. GPA's also need to be at least 3.5, and in most cases with a rigorous course load.

    In my son's top in state public HS, that eliminates about 90% of his Varsity team. On his travel team(where just about everyone is playing ball after HS), about the same.