Finer Points of the Game

Good topic.

As sure as water flows downhill, corner IFs and OFs gravitate too close to the lines. Be stubborn. Keep herding them back where they belong.

Gosh this could be (and should be) about a 50-page topic.

We teach our middle IF to "deke" on a hit & run the opposite of what the ball really does i.e. flyball deke groundball. The idea being to get the runner to do the wrong thing.

quote:

Originally posted by d8:
What are some of the finer points of coaching/playing this game that you teach that fans/players/coaches may not know? I am always looking to learn.

Ex. We teach our base runners that if they go back to 1st standing up on a pick-off move, go to the front corner of the bag. This will hand cuff a left handed 1st baseman, and you will be surprised how many times the ball will get away.

d8, I like this one also. It raises havoc at 1b.

Others:
Infielders, firt step is in and read the hop.
Outfielders, first step is back and get behind the ball.
Hitters, one thought at the plate - see the ball.
Hustle, constant communication creates fire/pace of the game.

A majority of the time we pitch away early in the game to see if the other team can hit the other way. If they can't we stay out there. Shift the fielders accordingly to the right side of the field.

d8-
I wanna hear about 2nd and 3rd offense. I've heard this term before but have zero idea what it is. Please enlighten me.

One thing I like to talk to infielders about (especially corner guys) is on dive plays, don't dive perpendicular to themselves, dive back at an angle. For example, if the 3B is facing 12 o'clock and there is a shot down the line, don't dive towards 3 o'clock. Instead work back towards 4 or even 5 o'clock. It may not matter a lot of times, but it might save a hit occasionally or at least save a double.

A subject dear to my heart! All good stuff guys.
Some others:
Runner on third lands with his right foot forward as the ball crosses the hitting zone.
Infielders first priority is to get to the right side of the ball.
On any underhand flip, keep your arm parallel to the ground with your hand extended as if you're going to shake his hand after the toss.
There are about a gazillion more of these!

d8 - I sent you a private message also.


BaseballByTheYard

On balls hit to glove side of second baseman, his first step should be a drop step with his left foot toward the right field foul pole.

On sac bunts we have our 1b make a backdoor throw to 2b every time. It's amazing in HS how often the lead runner just casually makes a turn at 2b and we pick up an easy double play.

In addition, we always have the catcher throw down to 1b if the hitter takes or misses a sac bunt. Again, shocking how bad baserunners can be on bunts.

quote:

Originally posted by ironhorse:
d8-
I wanna hear about 2nd and 3rd offense. I've heard this term before but have zero idea what it is. Please enlighten me.

This is about manufacturing runs. With a runner at 2B and no outs, the runner needs to be moved over to 3B by hitting behind the runner.

With a runner at 3B and less than 2 outs, the hitter's job is to score the runner. If the IF is playing back, he needs to hit a GB in the middle of the field or a flyball deep enough to score him. If the IF is in, he needs to hit a ball through the IF.

If we call for our 2nd and 3rd offense, both R2 and R3 are running on ground balls no matter where they are hit. If R3 is a sure out (hard hit to the corners or back to the pitcher) he gets in a rundown and allows the batter to go from home to second.

Often when R3 gets in a rundown and the R2 has moved up to third the defense will run R3 back to the bag hoping to tag the trail runner with two men standing on third base, but we teach our runners that as soon as R3 makes it back to third he is to take back off towards second....same thing at second, if/when R2 gets back to second the batter (who is now at 2nd) takes back off for first. Lots of times it looks like a cluster for the defense and we wind up score R3 while they are chasing R2 or R1.

Anyway, you can see how this is a much more difficult play for the defense than check the runner and throw to first.If R3 gets outs, we still have runners at second and third.

the one that amazes me is how many times a runner screws up on the Infield Fly Rule. I once saw a bases loaded scenario with a pop-up that dropped between the 3b and catcher. Yep...R3 took off for the plate. Catcher picked up the ball and tagged him out for dp. DUMB! So, when I am the third base coach, I use a signal (touching the bill of the cap) and I remind my runners that the IF rule is in effect. I have found that it also helps remind the umpire so that they can call it early rather than too late. Haven't had a dp in the last four years...so far, so good.

I like to make sure that our catchers know their role in making sure that the pitcher establishes a rhythm.
Some of the things that a catcher can do to help keep a pitchers rhythm is to make sure that he takes care of each and every pitch.
If the catcher is aware of the time factor between pitches he works a little harder to make sure that he does not drop pitches, especially strikes, does his best to reduce the occurence of passed balls and definetly makes sure that all of his throws back to the pitcher are not wild.
A pet peeve of mine is seeing a pitcher have to jump or bend over to receive the return throw from the catcher.
As a general rule I like to have a pitcher work at a rate of 12 to 16 seconds between pitches and our catchers are taught to be aware of this.

These are small, but finer points none the less. I hate when a liner or little duck snort is hit above the IF and the infielder trys to jump up and catch the ball instead of drop stepping, turning into an outfielder and beating it to the spot. I am talking about a ball that they have time to read and get back, not a shot that does not allow them time.

I hate it when infielders do not field the ball out in front and when they do not "play through" the baseball. When I first started coaching high school baseball our infielders would field the ball at almost a dead stop and then almost stand straight up and throw.

We also teach our base runners to get secondary leads on throws. For example on a 6-3 attempt if the runner is on 2B or 3B, we teach them to get a little secondary after the ball leaves the fielders hand, as to possible advance or score on a ball that gets by the first baseman. We want to anticipate before a play happens, so we can react quicker.

quote:

Originally posted by schwammi:
So, when I am the third base coach, I use a signal (touching the bill of the cap) and I remind my runners that the IF rule is in effect. I have found that it also helps remind the umpire so that they can call it early rather than too late.

Are you saying that the umpires know your signal and watch for it?

Jimmy....no, its more like I know their signal, (although I don't change it based on the number of outs). As I gained more coaching experience, I started paying alot more attention to how umpires communicate with each other. So I copied the sign for infield fly situation and now I use it with my base runners all of the time when the situation presents itself. So, at best, I was simply smart enough to steal what somebody else was already doing and find a way to make it useful to my team. On the other hand, I often get a quick glance from the BU, usually right after he's confirmed it with his partner.

With a runner at third and the infield in, we keep our third baseman even or one step back with a righhanded hitter up. Figuring that most hits to the left side will be hit hard enough for our third baseman to make the play at home. I would rather do this than bring him way in like some do and give up a bigger hole for him to get the ball through.

Stealing Home
Less than 2 outs and less than 2 strikes, R3 not being checked before P starts his wind-up good opportunity. P checks runner and then takes close to 3.5 seconds to deliver is another good opportunity.
If P does not freeze R3, R can extend his lead out to 18 feet and go as soon as P starts windup and using a pop up slide to the front corner of the plate.
To do this effectively know your R time from stealing lead to home.

Reading the throw out of the outfielders hand. Runners in scoring position have to read the outfield throw going to third or home. Lead runner advancing and outfielder overthrows cutoff trailing runner better move up.
A lot of times the runner can read the trajectory out of the hand and tell if it will be high and over the cutoff.
How many time do you see a first and third situation instead of a second third because someone was not alert on the throw.

help to control the running game by teaching a deception move for a RHP. For the most part well taught runners read the pitcher's feet. Front heel lifts runner goes or fakes, back heel lifts runner back.
I like to add a little extra to a pitcher that has the jump pivot down. In high school the BU is usually between 1st and 2nd with a runner at 1B, so this allows for better opportunity to execute.
I teach a pitcher to press down hard with his toes on the stride foot. This allows the heel to lift with very slight bending of the knee. Once the heel is lifted then the pitcher performs the jump pivot and completes the throw to 1st.
The delay between front heel lift and jump pivot are minimal. "Deception is the perception of similarity."

Here's one I thought was very smart:

Two outs, runner on second. With a two strike count on batter, R2's job is to read a strike, and take off. This came into play in my son's game last weekend. An infield hit turned into an RBI because the runner was on the move, scored easily as the throw to first didn't beat the runner.

quote:

Originally posted by Rob Kremer:
Here's one I thought was very smart:

Two outs, runner on second. With a two strike count on batter, R2's job is to read a strike, and take off. This came into play in my son's game last weekend. An infield hit turned into an RBI because the runner was on the move, scored easily as the throw to first didn't beat the runner.

My college coach (years ago) taught me this one. Over the years, my teams have stolen MANY runs on this.

With a hitters count, we always say "look fastball, adjust to breaking ball". This way they aren't surprised by the fastball and it reminds them to keep their hands back on the breaking ball.

If we know a team runs the wheel for a bunt defense, as soon as the 3b crashes we break for third. All we have to do is beat the SS to the bag.

Throw with your legs and hips, not your arm. This is what I mean

Runners at 1st and 3rd, our hitter pops out foul anywhere, both runners tag and go.

Throw goes home R3 hits the brakes and we get 2nd base.

Throw goes to 2b R1 hits brakes or gets in rundown and run scores.

(Assuming everything goes perfectly, which it always does......)

Iron, your offensive play reminds me of this defensive one. R's on 1st and 3rd, < 2 outs. Fly ball (fair or foul) hit in the "triangle" either on 1b or 3b side (3b/SS/LF converge or 2b/1b/RF converge). P must become relay man home setting up on the 3b or 1b cutout.

Another wrinkle . . . the 1st/3rd defense you have called will determine what your P does w/ the relay throw (assuming R3 and R1 tag). Better hope you've coached up your CFer to become a MIF in this situation.

Ironhorse,
My finer point would be how to keep your runners from leaving early on a wheel play. We place the 2nd baseman right by the bag. SS wheels and 3rd baseman does not vacate until half way. Pitcher does not pitch until SS is 3/4 of the way to the bag. We have never had a runner leave early on us that has not gotten picked off. On top of that our SS is always set up to make receive a throw and not involved in a foot race to the bag.

Ironhorse.....How foul are the pop up you talking about on the tagging w/runners on 1st & 3rd?

With a runner on second I like teaching the shortstop screen/timing pick move whree shortstop screens in front of the runner, timing indicator for pitcher to make his pick to second, as second base covers.

Works good on offense with a smart runner against a team that does not execute it properly

quote:

Originally posted by IEBSBL:
Ironhorse.....How foul are the pop up you talking about on the tagging w/runners on 1st & 3rd?

Anything that goes deeper than the base (that kinda kinda 3b/ss/lf bermuda triangle in LF foul territory for example) or something straight back for the catcher on a field like ours that has a lot of foul territory. Makes for a real long throw to 2b.

quote:

Originally posted by lefthookdad:
With a runner on second I like teaching the shortstop screen/timing pick move whree shortstop screens in front of the runner, timing indicator for pitcher to make his pick to second, as second base covers

Be careful with that. If you have your ss run in front of my runner we're gonna have him steal right when the ss crosses back into the baseline. We'll bet obstruction every time.

yep, that's why the the last part of my post says it can work just as good on offense with a smart base runner. I always teach both sides of a play, action and reaction. Plus I teach our ss to peel off toward the grass, never back across.

Base stealing technique.....enjoy!

Optimal Base Stealing Technique