Getting into the Ivy League as a regular student is tough

Agreed. Two additional data points:

• Although the Ivies don't offer athletic scholarships, the schools can be really affordable, and a better deal than a 50% baseball scholarship somewhere else. For example, at family incomes up to $140,000, Princeton charges no tuition. Yes, you'd have to pay for most of room and board, but with tuition of $47,500 and about $19,000 in estimated expenses for room, board, books, etc., that means free tuition for a family making $140,000 is equivalent to about a 70% scholarship -- which will beat most baseball offers from other schools.
• And baseball in the Ivy League can be solid, too. Currently, Dartmouth's RPI is #68 (out of the ~300 D1 baseball programs), with series wins against Miami and UCF (which itself has a current RPI of #35).

Ivy admission without some sort of hook is exactly a lottery as Goosegg suggests.  The admission numbers at all the Ivy schools are staggering.  The number of spots available is minuscule and if you deduct the admits for likely letter athletes, as well the spots taken by other kids who have some sort of hook that separates their application, the opportunities at Ivy schools for straight admission is extraordinarily small. 

2019Dad also makes an excellent point in terms of financials.  Ivy financial aid is fantastic compared to others.  As many kids scramble to get a 25% baseball scholarship and hope to possibly add a little merit money if their grades and scores are good, the Ivy money is still likely a lot better, in many cases way better, and has nothing to do with whether you continue to play or not.  If you get hurt, you still go to school with your finances intact. 

For those talented enough, there is plenty of opportunity for professional baseball after the Ivy.  As they say - velocity is velocity, no matter where you throw it.

9and7dad posted:

Ivy admission without some sort of hook is exactly a lottery as Goosegg suggests.  The admission numbers at all the Ivy schools are staggering.  The number of spots available is minuscule and if you deduct the admits for likely letter athletes, as well the spots taken by other kids who have some sort of hook that separates their application, the opportunities at Ivy schools for straight admission is extraordinarily small. 

2019Dad also makes an excellent point in terms of financials.  Ivy financial aid is fantastic compared to others.  As many kids scramble to get a 25% baseball scholarship and hope to possibly add a little merit money if their grades and scores are good, the Ivy money is still likely a lot better, in many cases way better, and has nothing to do with whether you continue to play or not.  If you get hurt, you still go to school with your finances intact. 

For those talented enough, there is plenty of opportunity for professional baseball after the Ivy.  As they say - velocity is velocity, no matter where you throw it.

I know of an Ivy pitcher throwing 96+ as a closer this year.  Yeah, "velocity is velocity, no matter where you throw it!"

Thanks for article Goose, I share a similar view.

Financial challenges really hit the families making $250,000-300,000 per year, no grant assistance and facing an annual $75k college cost.  Or, imagine netting $24,000 per month in income and paying out $12,000 / month toward two college kids at an Ivy and Bucknell.  

I think the Maginot line for "any" grant assistance at an Ivy is $240,000.

Keep your day job.

This article makes the point that maybe those families earning $200k+ don't really need the Ivies (at least for undergrad):

https://www.theatlantic.com/bu...really-worth/521577/

#1 Assistant Coach posted:

9and7dad posted:

Ivy admission without some sort of hook is exactly a lottery as Goosegg suggests.  The admission numbers at all the Ivy schools are staggering.  The number of spots available is minuscule and if you deduct the admits for likely letter athletes, as well the spots taken by other kids who have some sort of hook that separates their application, the opportunities at Ivy schools for straight admission is extraordinarily small. 

2019Dad also makes an excellent point in terms of financials.  Ivy financial aid is fantastic compared to others.  As many kids scramble to get a 25% baseball scholarship and hope to possibly add a little merit money if their grades and scores are good, the Ivy money is still likely a lot better, in many cases way better, and has nothing to do with whether you continue to play or not.  If you get hurt, you still go to school with your finances intact. 

For those talented enough, there is plenty of opportunity for professional baseball after the Ivy.  As they say - velocity is velocity, no matter where you throw it.

I know of an Ivy pitcher throwing 96+ as a closer this year.  Yeah, "velocity is velocity, no matter where you throw it!"

I may have heard something about that kid too.

Agreed.  It is a lifetime opportunity for those that know about it and those that qualify with the academic numbers and baseball talent.  In my personal experience, we didn't know much about the ivys or high academic schools until my son was introduced to Joe Walsh (Harvard HC at the time....not the Eagles guitarist) at PG WWBA by a mutual friend who happened to be in town..  It was a one in a million chance meeting that more or less changed my son's perspective about college baseball at the ripe age of 16.   Joe told him he had the "chops" for Ivy baseball, and began recruiting him.   Son was fielding D1 offers from other schools when we really started looking into this these high academic longshots.  We didn't know any better at the time, but boy did we learn a lot in a short period of time.   The more we looked into the Ivys the more we realized it wasn't a longshot WITH baseball, and they were very generous with financial aid.   We were pleasantly surprised.

Anyone with the talent and desire to pursue this, I recommend you do your due diligence.  You may be very surprised as we were 7 years ago.   He also got a pretty good education.   Good luck!

I think that someone on this site pointed out that the path from Ivy to MLB tends to favor pitchers more than say SEC to MLB.  Fenway might have an idea on this.   Chris Young and Kyle Hendricks, but of course there were Glanville and De Rosa who were position players.

Yes, gotta have a hook.  There are a lot of very accomplished students out there.  Our oldest (non-athlete) got in to Princeton (opted for Davidson) with a hook of traditional accomplishments, but her accomplishments were at a very young age comparatively.  

One of my son's former coaches has a close relationship with an Ivy head coach.  Basically we were told about a year ago that my son had both the academic and baseball talents that made him very attractive to the school.

We looked at the costs, and unfortunately we are in the group that makes too much to get a lot in aid, but not enough to actually be able to afford for him to attend.  Regardless, for the opportunity I would have done whatever necessary to find a way to pay for it.  Ultimately, our son took a lot of factors into account and decided that an Ivy wouldn't be a good fit for him.  My bank account is thankful.

A former teammate will be playing for Dartmouth next year.  He's a 6'7 lefty that's a legit two way player.  High 80's fastball, stud defense at first, hits for power. Real nice kid. Great grades as well.  He would have had plenty of options, but decided that Ivy was the best fit for him.

Texas1836 posted:

I think that someone on this site pointed out that the path from Ivy to MLB tends to favor pitchers more than say SEC to MLB.  Fenway might have an idea on this.   C

Most Ivy baseball players are looking to the path to the boardroom not the MLB. Just say'n.

Also not all Ivy $$ packages are the same, Princeton, Yale, Harvard tend to be much more generous than others. My son had an offer from an Ivy and I was surprised how much they thought we could "afford". By all means if you have the academic and baseball profile explore all of them if they become available to you. 

BOF posted:

My son had an offer from an Ivy and I was surprised how much they thought we could "afford". 

How true.  When I filled out the FAFSA and got our "expected contribution" number, I literally laughed.  I mean sure - I can come up with that as long as I cut back on extravagant purchases like groceries, electricity, and rent. Like who really needs that stuff anyways?

Was the EFC at an Ivy institution more than it was at a competing non-Ivy academic school? 

9and7dad posted:

Was the EFC at an Ivy institution more than it was at a competing non-Ivy academic school? 

In our case the Ivy's actually had a lower EFC than the FAFSA.  Off the top of my head it still would have been something like $18,000 a year, but that's a lot less than the FAFSA came up with.

I think it all boils down to the endowments any particular school has.  There are probably non-Ivy schools that are both more and less expensive.  It would have been a little less expensive for our son to go to Harvard than to be a commuter student at the University of Miami. Had to scratch my head a little at that one.

9and7dad posted:

Was the EFC at an Ivy institution more than it was at a competing non-Ivy academic school? 

Yes by over 1/2. We're talking a lot of $$ over 4 years. I only have one data point and I know that some Ivy's are more generous than others, you should just be aware that they are not all the same.  

My three cousins got accepted and went to Ivies. The view in our family is it's a living fetus until it finished grad school. So these kids went Penn/Michigan Law, Harvard/Tufts Medical and Yale/Juilliard. I'm the blond sheep in the family with UCLA/UCLA.

The one that went to Yale got 1600 on her SAT's and never got anything but A's in high school. Plus she was already a known Tanglewood actress in high school (Tanglewood is summer stock for top collegiate actors) with articles about her in The NY Times and Boston Globe. She got accepted  to every Ivy she applied but Harvard. One brother was already at Harvard. 

I'm guessing Harvard didn't see dad as having any money left over to donate. At one point he had kids in Yale, Harvard and Michigan Law at the same time without any aid.

Completely agree that a shot at the Ivy League is too good to pass up. However, I will add that of my two brothers (both in their 50's now) the state school educated one has consistently earned twice what the Harvard educated one has over the years!

Louise posted:

Completely agree that a shot at the Ivy League is too good to pass up. However, I will add that of my two brothers (both in their 50's now) the state school educated one has consistently earned twice what the Harvard educated one has over the years!

This is getting off the track of the thread. But ...

I've seen Ivy Leaguers act entitled while someone who attended a lesser college has creative ideas and daring. My cousin has spent his life at one major law firm. He clerked for two important judges before this job. He gets his shorts in a bunch every time he sees a less educated friend, relative or acquaintance sell his company he took the risk to start for eight figures. The difference is he's had one job in a safe place. He's done very well. But he's never taken a risk in his life. I keep reminding him life is about being happy not who dies with the biggest pile of money. 

BOF posted:

9and7dad posted:

Was the EFC at an Ivy institution more than it was at a competing non-Ivy academic school? 

Yes by over 1/2. We're talking a lot of $$ over 4 years. I only have one data point and I know that some Ivy's are more generous than others, you should just be aware that they are not all the same.  

I'm pretty familiar with the Ivy and of course they are not all the same.  HYP is widely known to have a little more aggressive financial aid posture than the other five schools. 

Under the assumption that merit money is not a factor at a competing school, it's pretty rare to hear of an Ivy getting beat on a straight financial aid package.  Certainly an Ivy accepted kid can choose to go to a variety of schools that will give tremendous merit money, and for some that may be the best choice.