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I have and believe it is good stuff.. have a BS in Ex. Science with an emphasis in Biomechanical Principles of Human Movement - the science side of what he teaches is the same thing that is being taught in other places (higher levels)...

I had three former players called up this year to ML's (to make it six total now on ML rosters), I have 13 in minors and a little over 50 in college right now... have had 22 high school age clients drafted out of H.S. in last four summers combined...

people may not agree with everything he teaches, but students are producing on the field...
Last edited by Diablo con Huevos
I am one of Mike Epstein's instructors. My website is listed below. I have worked with and know of numerous players that have had tremendous success through our teaching. Mike Epstein has a number of big league players that train at the Colorado facility and have actually played for Mike while growing up.

It's a really good teaching system. There are lots of good instructors and coaches teaching these mechanics, similar mechanics, AND different mechanics that are equally as good. I/We believe in what we teach, but would never say that our teaching system is the be all end all for EVERY single player.

Mike Epstein has said to me on numerous occassions and from my years of teaching I must say I have to agree with him... Mike's mentor Ted Williams was known to say that "hitting a baseball is the toughest thing to do in all of sports"... Mike says "I used to agree with that, but I've changed my mind. TEACHING SOMEONE to hit a baseball IS the toughest thing to do in all of sports."

If you ever have any questions, feel free to contact me.
Epstein gets some things right........

Tom Guerry could really expand on this for you, but, I'm thinking he may have gotten the boot....I hope not because he knows alot about this stuff, but, he argued with someone who likes to get people booted around here...

Sure does put a crimp in our hitting discussions....
Last edited by BlueDog
I am a baseball coach and father of a four year old who loves to play, so I
research this stuff quite a bit. There are many problems with the Epstein
way of hitting - one being the backward tilting spine angle (leaning back
toward the catcher) through the swing. Another being the lack of an
effective stride move or any stride at all (I went to an Epstein speech and
he never even mentioned the stride!). There are other methods that seem to
really be getting results. One is called "Positional Hitting" which was
invented by a guy named Jaime Cevallos - Major League players have had
impressive improvements in their stats with this, including Rays
superutility player Ben Zobrist.

Anyway, with any hitting system, it's the improvement that is important. In
trying to find the best instructor for you or your son/daughter, ask the
instructor who he has helped to improve. I've even asked for before/after
stats from instructors. Most can only name players they work with, but not
the player's improvements. How much they improve is the key.
quote:
There are many problems with the Epstein
way of hitting - one being the backward tilting spine angle (leaning back
toward the catcher) through the swing.


This should be taught...It's a good thing...





quote:
Another being the lack of an
effective stride move or any stride at all (I went to an Epstein speech and
he never even mentioned the stride!).


Doesn't mean he doesn't teach it.....
Last edited by BlueDog
quote:
Originally posted by BlueDog:
quote:
There are many problems with the Epstein
way of hitting - one being the backward tilting spine angle (leaning back
toward the catcher) through the swing.


This should be taught...It's a good thing...





quote:
Another being the lack of an
effective stride move or any stride at all (I went to an Epstein speech and
he never even mentioned the stride!).


Doesn't mean he doesn't teach it.....


I agree it is a good thing but one needs to be careful when teaching it not to let the student start bending the back.Both my kids did this and both used the epstein approach.
I am not an exxpert to any degree - always looking for advice to help my son keep weight back and not fly open. From a beginners viewpoint it looks like the backward angle helps accomplish this. The other thing I had noticed in some power swings is that the hitter also has a forward leaning tilt (leaning in toward the plate), not sure if this also a component.
I will not pretend to be an expert on Epstein's system as I have not purchased any of the materials but have read everything on his site. I have purchased Cervallos' "Swing trainer" bat and used with my son. All that being said to swing it correctly it appears to mimic many aspects of the Epstein model of focus on lower body to start swing and elbow slotting. So to me they are may not be identical but are very similar at least.
Yes, my son has used for about 4 yrs. We have spent time with Mike and his son Jake. i started studying hitting when my son was about 5, he is 14 now. What Mike teaches is found in all great MLB hitters. The terminology sometimes scares people (rotational hitting, etc) but the results are undeniable. Someone mentioned the stride in here. My son doesn't use a "stride" cause he doeasn't need one. He has more power now than ever. Power is in the rotation of hips/body not the stride. If you have an open you will learn something from Mike and Jake even if you buy in to everything they say.
I have lurked here for a couple of weeks and as my son is younger I found a lot of good stuff, but didn't really find anything I felt I could contribute until now. Passing on my experience in hopes someone can learn from it.

My son completed this program about six months ago with a local instructor. I must say he and I couldn't be happier with the results. For the last several years he has always played on some of our area's best travel teams, but it was certainly not because of his stick. He is an excellent defenseman and decent pitcher and that got him on these teams.

So as you can imagine being like most competitive dads I had many days of angst trying to help my otherwise very athletic son get over his inability to hit. His mother would argue it was my fault as I let him start hitting on non dominant side and did not make him switch to dominant side until this past year when almost twelve. Sadly she is probaly more right than wrong. Big Grin

I spent lots of time and money on lessons (note word usage) trying to see some improvement. Always left these lessons feeling like we were making progress but now know I should have realized I was really just letting someone make a few bucks off me and my kid.

So May of 2010 ran across a local instructor teaching this method. The cost was outrageous but he and I were truly desperate. He was falling farther and farther behind and the grumblings were getting lounder and louder from his coaches. My guess he was at best a .200 hitter and zero power. My son wanted to try this program and we decided we would give it a shot.

After two professional instruction sessions (note word choice) I could see immediate results and a change. No live hitting yet but swing on video was starting to change. Long story short one month later hit first two homeruns in Cooperstown of all places and had a great fall season where he hit .400 and batting in the four and five hole by end of season.

So I should be a huge fan of Epstein system right? I think I am but more importantly and the reason for my post is that I think the most important investment as parents we can make in our boys' baseball futures is the commitment to professional instrucion. I think oftentimes we as parents get too hung up on what is being taught to our boys vs. who is doing the teaching.

There are lots of folks out there giving lessons. You need to find someone who is a professional instructor and who your son will click with as well. They will not only teach your son the right way but they will help instill confidence and trust which leads to more confidence. Hitting a baseball is a confidence thing. With it you can do great things, without it you have little chance.

Trial and error and if you can't see the results on the field then you need to move on, because when you find someone you can trust they can truly change things for your son. My son and I now believe in his ability and the confidence from that makes this so much more enjoyable.
I have used it with my son who is now 12. We started with doing video lessons with Mike and Jake over the internet. Then we went to an Epstein hitting camp and met a great instructor of the Epstein hitting method.

I took video tape of my sons progress here on my http://www.youtube.com/user/BaseballDadsGoneWild

We started September 12th 2009. That first video is without any instruction, his hand eye was very good, but as you can see his mechanics are poor. Click see all under uploads.

Flash forward to March 2010. As you can see lots of tilting (head and spine), back arching etc. I would say this has to do with a weak core. I think many younger kids do not have the strength to fully do the technique correctly....have patience, your son or daughter will get stronger.

We just had a lesson this past Sunday, it is the feature video on the page. Not perfect, but it's looking a lot better than it was last March!!!

Results last year were great! Can't wait for the season to start!
quote:
Originally posted by Zeninfinity:
I have used it with my son who is now 12. We started with doing video lessons with Mike and Jake over the internet. Then we went to an Epstein hitting camp and met a great instructor of the Epstein hitting method.

I took video tape of my sons progress here on my channel http://www.youtube.com/user/BaseballDadsGoneWild

We started September 12th 2009. That first video is without any instruction, his hand eye was very good, but as you can see his mechanics are poor. Click "see all" under uploads. The videos are in chronological order.

Flash forward to March 2010. As you can see lots of tilting (head and spine), back arching etc. I would say this has to do with a weak core. I think many younger kids do not have the strength to fully do the technique correctly....have patience, your son or daughter will get stronger.

We just had a lesson this past Sunday, it is the feature video on the page. Not perfect, but it's looking a lot better than it was last March!!!

Results last year were great! Can't wait for the season to start!


At the end of the day, the Epstein Method is well, for lack of a better word, methodical. They have seen so many hitters that they have a fix for every problem/challenge with your cut.

It's easy to critique a hitters swing. It's a whole other deal to be able to have the means (read drills) to fix it. The Epsteins excell ih this area.
My son started using the Epstein when he was 8. He has always had great hand eye coordination and good power,even before he started with the teaching.BUT,the Epstein approach turned a good young hitter into a great young hitter with exceptional power.

I was fortunate that his teacher was a friend and was able to work with me to teach him.

Here is a video clip when he was 9

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aEjeotQgQtU


And later at 11. This is a side toss drill where I throw a couple balls and he has to pick out 1 and hit it.(I am throwing all over the place to see if he can make adjustments just to put the bat on the ball)

At about the 2:50 mark he starts hitting for power.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nd86QYneHCY
Last edited by tfox
quote:
Originally posted by BackstopDad32:
I have lurked here for a couple of weeks and as my son is younger I found a lot of good stuff, but didn't really find anything I felt I could contribute until now. Passing on my experience in hopes someone can learn from it.

My son completed this program about six months ago with a local instructor. I must say he and I couldn't be happier with the results. For the last several years he has always played on some of our area's best travel teams, but it was certainly not because of his stick. He is an excellent defenseman and decent pitcher and that got him on these teams.

So as you can imagine being like most competitive dads I had many days of angst trying to help my otherwise very athletic son get over his inability to hit. His mother would argue it was my fault as I let him start hitting on non dominant side and did not make him switch to dominant side until this past year when almost twelve. Sadly she is probaly more right than wrong. Big Grin

I spent lots of time and money on lessons (note word usage) trying to see some improvement. Always left these lessons feeling like we were making progress but now know I should have realized I was really just letting someone make a few bucks off me and my kid.

So May of 2010 ran across a local instructor teaching this method. The cost was outrageous but he and I were truly desperate. He was falling farther and farther behind and the grumblings were getting lounder and louder from his coaches. My guess he was at best a .200 hitter and zero power. My son wanted to try this program and we decided we would give it a shot.

After two professional instruction sessions (note word choice) I could see immediate results and a change. No live hitting yet but swing on video was starting to change. Long story short one month later hit first two homeruns in Cooperstown of all places and had a great fall season where he hit .400 and batting in the four and five hole by end of season.

So I should be a huge fan of Epstein system right? I think I am but more importantly and the reason for my post is that I think the most important investment as parents we can make in our boys' baseball futures is the commitment to professional instrucion. I think oftentimes we as parents get too hung up on what is being taught to our boys vs. who is doing the teaching.

There are lots of folks out there giving lessons. You need to find someone who is a professional instructor and who your son will click with as well. They will not only teach your son the right way but they will help instill confidence and trust which leads to more confidence. Hitting a baseball is a confidence thing. With it you can do great things, without it you have little chance.

Trial and error and if you can't see the results on the field then you need to move on, because when you find someone you can trust they can truly change things for your son. My son and I now believe in his ability and the confidence from that makes this so much more enjoyable.
My son started working with an Epstein certified instructor about three years ago and we have been very pleased with the results. KCDawgjr has pretty good wheels and great hand/eye coordination, so he’s always been able to put the ball in play and leg out a hit when needed. But, as we saw the competition getting better and the base paths getting longer, it was pretty obvious that those hits would decrease tremendously as he got older.
I did some research and ended up talking to the Epstein instructor on the phone and decided to give him a shot. The first lesson was free as he mentioned that what he taught was somewhat different from what I may have heard from other instructors so he wanted to make sure that I was good with what I was hearing. He videotaped my kid and pointed out a few things and then went straight to showing how the swing works. At the end of the first lesson, he videoed some more of my kid’s swings and we take another look. There was marked improvement in just 45 minutes.
So, we signed up for a seven lesson package, and my son went to work over the next few weeks. The first lessons, he rarely even hit a thrown ball. There were a lot of drills that he went over and over with him until he got them right. After each lesson he was given homework designed to build muscle memory for the swing. Needless to say, by the end of the 7th lesson my son was hitting better, harder and further with every swing.
While I wish I could say that my son son’s batting average increased dramatically after those lessons, it didn’t, at least initially. He hit more line drives straight at people that year than I have ever seen. I swear I don’t think I have ever seen a more snake bit kid. But, he persevered with the swing and finally the law of averages swung back to normal. And though his stats didn’t show how good he was hitting, the coaches certainly noticed.
He still visits the instructor for a refresher now and again, but it’s not something that we do on a regular basis. Prior to each season we’ll go in and the kid will do some workouts with his instructor and get back up to speed, but for the most part he just does the drills and monitors himself. As the instructor said over and over, “you have to become your own swing coach to be successful.”
One thing you need to keep in mind is that this swing is different than what a lot of coaches teach. Since he started the “Epstein method” he’s played for 3 different coaches and each one has tried to “fix” his swing. Which is funny, because when one of them called me to offer him a spot on the team said they were offering because he absolutely killed the ball at his tryout. Another one told him that if he didn’t change his swing to meet what they were asking then he’d probably hit 9th the entire year – by the end of the first tournament he had moved to leadoff. He made the freshman team at his high school this year and it’s so far so good there, but we’ll just wait and see.
quote:
Originally posted by Low Finish:
I like Epstein, don't get me wrong. He's probably the best of all the "DVD" gurus. (My name for them).

Ted Williams has the best overall description.

And, most importantly, which do you see first?

His heel getting down, or the rear hip helping to create "forward by turning" and rotating into foot plant?



when i look at a number of epstein guys i tend to see alot of back foot spinning..not ALL but a "majority" of them..am i wrong?
quote:
Originally posted by Low Finish:
I like Epstein, don't get me wrong. He's probably the best of all the "DVD" gurus. (My name for them).

Ted Williams has the best overall description.

And, most importantly, which do you see first?

His heel getting down, or the rear hip helping to create "forward by turning" and rotating into foot plant?



Heel down, weight off the rear allows hip to rotate. Martial Arts 101 from 2000yrs ago!

Nice swing Chipper!
Wogdoggy,

I've never noticed "spinning" on the back foot to be a problem with any of the Epstein hitters I've seen - although truthfully I'm limited to those I've seen at my son's lessons under the single instructor. All of the ones I've observed end up on their back toe.

That said, as my son finishes his swing, his front foot will sometimes roll over or open up. It's well after contact but the instructor does seem to have a problem with it as he likes the way he comes all the way through.
Zeninfinity;

where are you located? What team is your son playing on?
My son Robert has hitting lessons at Montgomery HS and he sells the SSK bats to the ML players, including the Panda and Milky and the Oakland A's new Cuban player.

We have 2 Australian teams and 2 teams from Mexico visiting in June.

Visit our web site <www.goodwillseries.org> for info.


Bob
<rwilliams@goodwillseries.org>
quote:
Originally posted by wogdoggy:
quote:
Originally posted by Low Finish:
I like Epstein, don't get me wrong. He's probably the best of all the "DVD" gurus. (My name for them).

Ted Williams has the best overall description.

And, most importantly, which do you see first?

His heel getting down, or the rear hip helping to create "forward by turning" and rotating into foot plant?



when i look at a number of epstein guys i tend to see alot of back foot spinning..not ALL but a "majority" of them..am i wrong?


Well, I assume you're calling "spinning" squash the bug. And in the past, Epstein had a big problem with that. Now, I would say that there are other problems with his teachings. I'm not so concerned about the rear foot, as long as the rear hip and leg do what they have to.
quote:
Originally posted by KC Dawg:
Wogdoggy,

I've never noticed "spinning" on the back foot to be a problem with any of the Epstein hitters I've seen - although truthfully I'm limited to those I've seen at my son's lessons under the single instructor. All of the ones I've observed end up on their back toe.

That said, as my son finishes his swing, his front foot will sometimes roll over or open up. It's well after contact but the instructor does seem to have a problem with it as he likes the way he comes all the way through.


not the front foot but if you place a bottle on the side of his rear foot and he spins into in..its a spin.you want the back foot in the L position.if he spins or squashes the bug he needs to be fixed. my opinion
wogdoggy, I can tell you that I have looked at that in the past, and it's not been a problem. But, I haven't seen what he's doing since he started practice with his school team. He has a doubleheader on Monday so I'll take a close look then.

We were more concerned with some of the "swing down" direction he got in the first couple of practices. But, he says he's been driving the ball very well - two line-drive singles yesterday in an intrasquad scrimmage - so his coach has pretty much left him alone on that aspect.

Thanks for the heads up.
My 13 yr old son went through it a year ago.
Being old school I was close to pulling him from the very first lesson.
Then it started to click.
Somewhere around the third or fourth session the light went on...for both if us.
He went from an average 300 hitter with an occasional flash of power to leading his team in every offensive category.
(110 AB, .613avg., 729obp, .831ball in play, 3K.)
The most amazing number to me is the 3k.
How did Epstein method affect that number? Simple. It allows the swing path of the bat to stay in plane with the path if the ball for a longer period of time through the hitting zone. Huge difference. Its an awesome thing to see a kid at that age go with the pitch and be able to hit to all fields with power and confidence.
For me and my attitude I guess you can teach an old dog a new trick.
For my son...I guess I'll just enjoy watching him Having fun putting the ball in play...isn't that what its really all about?
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