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Hi, folks,

given the feedback/questions on a couple other threads, I thought I'd describe our experience at this last weekend's HF event in Jupiter.

 

Sat am was devoted to showcase "drills" for lack of a better term. My OF started with two 60's, then moved to two throws each from rightfield to third, and then to home.  Then there was a batting session where the kids warmed up for their actual BP show case.  Also, somewhere in there, was another set of outfield drills that looked like it was more for passing time until the hitting showcase ended. There were no coaches at that drill.

 

60's were timed by Headfirst guys, so it's useful because it's measured by a neutral party. (thanks, Mkbaseballdad, for finding out they do distribute the times to the coaches.  I couldn't remember if they did, or not.)

 

The outfield drills are done in front of ALL scouts/coaches.  They're lined up twoor three rows deep down the first and third baselines between home and the first/third base bags.  As far as I could tell, they watched all kids throw.

 

After the defensive drills the coaches move to the out door batting cages and watch each kid hit. I didn't watch that, but son said it went okay, and that's where they told him his bat/ball exit speed, or whatever it's called.  He said the highest he heard was 89, and most of the kids whose #s he heard were in the high 70's.

 

I think the reason the only written evaluations done by HF personnel are for pitchers is because EVERYONE watches the defensive and hitting drills, but the pitching "drills" are actually the games, so individual coaches are assigned to particular pitchers (or games) and put the gun on them, as well as take notes.

 

There were breaks each day for some brief talks, which son thought were pretty good.  I liked the emphasis on college fit, and making good choices with small decisions.  The coaches' talks were good, too.  Coaches for several colleges talked very briefly about their schools, but spent more time talking about generic but helpful stuff.  I did not get the sense that speakers were trying to sell their particular schools, so they probably were! Some have posted here that the Sullivans talk too much about themselves, but I didn't think so.  I did think the last talk Sunday was a little long, but it didn't really bother me.  Son like it but thought it was too long, though.

 

Games started after noon on Saturday. Sixteen teams with about 14/15 players on each team including PO's. Team remained intact throughout the weekend, but had two/three different coaches each game, so kids got seen by a lot of coaches in the dugout as well as by a group of 6-10 coaches who sat behind a screen behind home plate.  That group of coaches was fluid, with some guys sitting there the whole game, and some moving from field to field. One or two coaches also stood in the shallow outfield, and a headfirst employee umpired.  If coaches weren't on the field they were in the middle area  between the diamonds watching from a distance and being available for casual conversations with kids who weren't playing in that slate of games.  Four fields in a clover leaf with snack bar at the center. Each team played two six inning games on Saturday and Sunday.  If your team played in the first and third game on Saturday, you also played in the first and third game on Sunday.  

 

After some initial prodding, son did well tracking down coaches he had written before hand.  In almost all cases the conversations were 3-4 minutes long, confirming son's interest.  Son would come back to me and say for the div 3 guys it's a bit early for 2017s but they were all glad he had emailed them ahead of time so they could put a face to name as well as watch him play.  The div one guys (Ivies, Patriot League, A-10, ACC) were attentive and spent more time with kids, though I'm not sure why.  One coach told son that he was one of 15 players he was there to evaluate.  Another Div 1 coach who son didn't meet until Sunday playfully asked son what took him so long to introduce himself. From a distance, it was hard to tell what exactly was being accomplished by all this, in terms of "Progress" towards picking a college and (a college picking a kid***).  What WAS happening was son's comfort with the whole process was increasing, and he got to shake hands with 15/20 coaches he had never met before.

 

Admittedly the most comfortable conversations were with coaches son had some obscure personal connection with.  One coach had coached son's high school coach.  One young coach went to a rival high school.  One coach played with someone who had been my student.  

 

The overall experience was quite good, especially if your son is interested in high academic div 3's.  Lots of coaches, lots of informal time for connecting with those coaches, lots of active scouting.

 

Finally, something happened at the very end of the weekend to a kid I never saw before and doubtful I'll ever see again.  It is exactly what several folks on this board have told me could happen and it was amazing to see it play out.  A coach came up to a kid who was standing next to me with his father. i had no idea who they were, and there was no reason for us to be in proximity to each other, but he was so  close I could hear every word exchanged between the coach and the boy.  Coach basically introduced himself, asked kid where he was looking to go to school, and told him he liked how he pitched, and after a few minutes of answering kid's questions invited him to campus and said "I'll email but I think I have spot for you."

 

So it DOES happen.

 

And one last word of advice: if your kids go to an event like this, make sure they're programmed to swing the bat.  Counts start at 1-1 and I lost track of how many kids struck out looking.  Coaches HAVE to see swings.

 

"Don't be mean now because remember: Wherever you go, there you are..." Buckaroo Banzai

Last edited by smokeminside
Original Post

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Originally Posted by smokeminside:

Hi, folks,

given the feedback/questions on a couple other threads, I thought I'd describe our experience at this last weekend's HF event in Jupiter.

 

Sat am was devoted to showcase "drills" for lack of a better term. My OF started with two 60's, then moved to two throws each from rightfield to third, and then to home.  Then there was a batting session where the kids warmed up for their actual BP show case.  Also, somewhere in there, was another set of outfield drills that looked like it was more for passing time until the hitting showcase ended. There were no coaches at that drill.

 

60's were timed by Headfirst guys, so it's useful because it's measured by a neutral party. (thanks, Mkbaseballdad, for finding out they do distribute the times to the coaches.  I couldn't remember if they did, or not.)

 

The outfield drills are done in front of ALL scouts/coaches.  They're lined up twoor three rows deep down the first and third baselines between home and the first/third base bags.  As far as I could tell, they watched all kids throw.

 

After the defensive drills the coaches move to the out door batting cages and watch each kid hit. I didn't watch that, but son said it went okay, and that's where they told him his bat/ball exit speed, or whatever it's called.  He said the highest he heard was 89, and most of the kids whose #s he heard were in the high 70's.

 

I think the reason the only written evaluations done by HF personnel are for pitchers is because EVERYONE watches the defensive and hitting drills, but the pitching "drills" are actually the games, so individual coaches are assigned to particular pitchers (or games) and put the gun on them, as well as take notes.

 

There were breaks each day for some brief talks, which son thought were pretty good.  I liked the emphasis on college fit, and making good choices with small decisions.  The coaches' talks were good, too.  Coaches for several colleges talked very briefly about their schools, but spent more time talking about generic but helpful stuff.  I did not get the sense that speakers were trying to sell their particular schools, so they probably were! Some have posted here that the Sullivans talk too much about themselves, but I didn't think so.  I did think the last talk Sunday was a little long, but it didn't really bother me.  Son like it but thought it was too long, though.

 

Games started after noon on Saturday. Sixteen teams with about 14/15 players on each team including PO's. Team remained intact throughout the weekend, but had two/three different coaches each game, so kids got seen by a lot of coaches in the dugout as well as by a group of 6-10 coaches who sat behind a screen behind home plate.  That group of coaches was fluid, with some guys sitting there the whole game, and some moving from field to field.  If coaches weren't on the field they were in the middle area  between the diamonds watching from a distance and being available for casual conversations with kids who weren't playing in that slate of games.  Four fields in a clover leaf with snack bar at the center. Each team played two six inning games on Saturday and Sunday.  If your team played in the first and third game on Saturday, you also played in the first and third game on Sunday.  

 

After some initial prodding, son did well tracking down coaches he had written before hand.  In almost all cases the conversations were 3-4 minutes long, confirming son's interest.  Son would come back to me and say for the div 3 guys it's a bit early for 2017s but they were all glad he had emailed them ahead of time so they could put a face to name as well as watch him play.  The div one guys (Ivies, Patriot League, A-10, ACC) were attentive and spent more time with kids, though I'm not sure why.  One coach told son that he was one of 15 players he was there to evaluate.  Another Div 1 coach who son didn't meet until Sunday playfully asked son what took him so long to introduce himself. From a distance, it was hard to tell what exactly was being accomplished by all this, in terms of "Progress" towards picking a college and (a college picking a kid***).  What WAS happening was son's comfort with the whole process was increasing, and he got to shake hands with 15/20 coaches he had never met before.

 

Admittedly the most comfortable conversations were with coaches son had some obscure personal connection with.  One coach had coached son's high school coach.  One young coach went to a rival high school.  One coach played with someone who had been my student.  

 

The overall experience was quite good, especially if your son is interested in high academic div 3's.  Lots of coaches, lots of informal time for connecting with those coaches, lots of active scouting.

 

Finally, something happened at the very end of the weekend to a kid I never saw before and doubtful I'll ever see again.  It is exactly what several folks on this board have told me could happen and it was amazing to see it play out.  A coach came up to a kid who was standing next to me with his father. i had no idea who they were, and there was no reason for us to be in proximity to each other, but he was so  close I could hear every word exchanged between the coach and the boy.  Coach basically introduced himself, asked kid where he was looking to go to school, and told him he liked how he pitched, and after a few minutes of answering kid's questions invited him to campus and said "I'll email but I think I have spot for you."

 

So it DOES happen.

 

 Smoke, thanks for taking the time to post, you provided a good visual of the overall event.  Sounded like a lot of kids; did you think it was too many kids and a challenge for kids to get time with coach's?

Glad to hear your son reached out ahead of time, sounded like he got some traction.

Given this experience, if you had to do this again, would you've waited till next summer to go to HF as a incoming senior? 

 

an FYI was our 2017 was at HF this past summer in NY -- there are FOUR different two day sessions with about 250 players in each session.  That means almost 1000 kids over the eight days.  That's a lot of kids, which is why they have so many coaches there (over 100 this summer).  Most coaches stay the whole time, some have unavoidable conflicts and may miss a day or two, some schools have multiple coaches there since they have so many potential players to watch.  

 

I know it isn't about November Jupiter, but it might help to know the numbers for summer so everyone has a sense of the size of the event.

Gov, we would go again but whether other juniors should go is a question with no easy answer. We went this fall because there were schools there that otherwise would not have been able to see my son until next summer.  We weren't (actually, to be honest,I wasn't) comfortable with only rolling the dice next summer.  

 

Simply put, Jupiter had a greater concentration of schools on his list than any other event we're aware of in the next six-8 months, so we went.  (However, as you know, our situation is unusual.  Son plays varsity soccer and it's a winter sport.  There are no opportunities for him to go during season to events others may choose to attend. Baseball for him starts before soccer is over.  He's stuck, but  I heard countless times from other parents at Jupiter that they were going to this or that camp in December or January or February all up and down the East coast.  That's simply not an option for my boy.)

 

My thoughts for others considering going as juniors: son thought that some D3 coaches seemed to be telling him it was a little early, and to stay in touch throughout the year, and to really hit it hard next summer.  But I think the Div 1 guys are really trying to get a look at juniors....and whether there are any of interest as soon as they can.

 

I wasn't surprised by the number of kids.  If a kid makes contact with coaches a few weeks ahead of time, and then goes looking for them during his down time at the event, the numbers aren't so daunting.  The coaches were available. Sometimes a kid would have to stand in line for a few minutes to talk to someone, or might have to wait for a coach to come off a field, but if a kid was assertive enough he would be able to see the coaches he wanted to see.

 

So far, he's received  highly personal emails from several schools he hadn't previously considered before so even schools he had had no contact with before Jupiter saw enough in him to write him. Not an overwhelming response but an indication that kids are getting seen, even if they haven't had earlier contact.

 

btw the ratio of kids broke down like this: 40% 2016's, 40% 2017s, and 20% 2018s.

 

Last edited by smokeminside

Smoke,

One thing that stands out is the number of 2016's that were there; I never would have thought that high a percentage.  

Evidence that the Academic schools hold off to fill slots?  Kind of defies the thinking that the coach will ask players to apply ED and he will support them through admissions. Or lot's of 2016's chasing few spots remaining

Smoke, greetings from your neck of the woods. (North shore of Kauai to be exact.) Great primer on the event.  Sounds like your son has a lot of legit interest; that's great! I  imagine that the Sacramento  showcase is a bit smaller - there are only two fields in that complex. We are waffling a bit on going there or to the NY event next summer.

Hey, good to hear from you!  Leaning towards Sacramento ourselves simply because it seems like it might be a smaller event.  Just have to be as clear as possible on who is going to be there.  

 

Love the north shore of Kauai.  The light house and bird sanctuary is one of my favorite spots on the islands.  Hope you're having a great time!!

Originally Posted by Gov:

Smoke,

One thing that stands out is the number of 2016's that were there; I never would have thought that high a percentage.  

Evidence that the Academic schools hold off to fill slots?  Kind of defies the thinking that the coach will ask players to apply ED and he will support them through admissions. Or lot's of 2016's chasing few spots remaining

Gov, I'm not sure but I think it's the latter: 2016s chasing those last spots.  But I'm not an expert.  Your guess is as good as mine.  I was grateful that there weren't more 2017s.

Originally Posted by Gov:

Smoke,

One thing that stands out is the number of 2016's that were there; I never would have thought that high a percentage.  

Evidence that the Academic schools hold off to fill slots?  

I can't say for sure why this is but of the schools that contacted my 2016 after HF only a few of them have players showing as "committed" on PG and he was contacted as late as 2 weeks before HF Jupiter by another school and asked to visit (that school has none listed on PG).  I think a lot of these schools still need players and a lot of these players are still chasing a spot.  

We'll know a lot more with the early signing period now in progress. 

 

I was amazed how many 2015's were at HF Jupiter last year.  Given my 2016's experience this year, we see many D3's locking down players much earlier than happened in my 2012's year.  I think recruiting continues to get earlier and a lot of 2016's are chasing fewer spots now than seniors were a few years ago.

 

Might just be the schools I'm looking at on PG, but very few ever have committed players with PG profiles.  Or maybe the kids just don't update their profiles.

 

One other "trend" that I've noticed comparing 2012 to 2016 recruiting, is the large number of underclassmen at events.  HF Sac this year was only about 60% 2016's...that's a relatively small number of kids getting exposure the Summer before their Senior years.   

Being a former small college coach and recruiter, I have a question.  How does a DIII lock down a 2017 player in 2015?  I understand if it is a Duke, Stanford, Vanderbilt, or other DI college, making a good offer.   But doesn't nearly all of small college recruiting involves the current senior class.  It is just too difficult recruiting underclassmen early unless you are their #1 choice to begin with for academic or location reasons and that could still change.

 

Anyway, we always looked for the DI player that wasn't getting any DI offers.  I don't ever recall getting an early commitment away from a DI offer.  Then again, I didn't work at the nation's premier academic schools.

 

Are there many DIII schools getting early commits?  Guess I thought that was a DI issue.

I haven't seen any D3 schools with 2017 commits listed on PG and I have the "recently submitted commitments" page open on my computer and look every day.  I started watching to see if 2016's school was adding pitchers after our visit and now just look to see if anyone we know has received an offer.  

 

The majority of players we know who have "committed" to a D3 school this fall were looking for spots at D1 schools most of the summer and when that did not happen they switched focus to D3 schools.  It could be different in other regions.  I'm just going by what I see in the Northeast.

 

In regards to HF - they have both D1 and D3 academic schools attending so there could be early commits coming from the events to the D1 schools (I just noticed that Cornell has a 2017 commit listed today).  

It seems very late for a 2016 to be getting any offers from a D1 and little late for D3 offer since ED has passed for most schools.  There are exception, though, in that some D3 schools will get X number of slots with admission support and request player submit application” regular decision”. Teammate of my 2015 went through it in November 2014. RC requested transcripts, test scores and financial aid form for a pre-read with school. Was given the go ahead one week later to submit application “regular decision” along with a letter stating what financial aid may be subject to final FASFA etc.    Player was notified by admission 3 weeks after submitting app of his acceptance, even before ED decisions came out!    In his case I thought was a D1 player who just didn’t get any offers for whatever reason.

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