Hitters knowing how many outs!!

BlueDog- Why? Are you telling me he should take the same approach each time?

Uhhhhhhhhhhhh, yeah!!!......

BlueDog- Do you ever coach in games at a level higher than little league? I'm serious. I'm just curious why you would want somebody to go up there without a plan based on the situation. Call me crazy but I like hitters changing their approach within the at-bat according to the count.

quote:

.......but I like hitters changing their approach within the at-bat according to the count.

So, you want the hitter thinking and depending on you, the Coach...

I prefer Coaches teaching players how to perform their craft (hitting), then staying out of their head during the game and letting them do what they are expected to do, which is to get a hit.....

Yogi tried to tell you Coaches a long time ago that you can't think and hit.....The approach he was talking about is leave em alone and let em hit.....

Ncball, the plan you want is for the hitter to think he can't do anything in a game without your guidance and blessing.....

Just my opinion, but, that doesn't show a penchant for teaching..........Coaches should do more teaching and get out of their player's heads.....

Please Bluedog, tell me what you want a hitter to do with a man on 3rd and less than two out. I'd like to hear your thoughts on this.

I want him to hit the ball out of the park.

What do you want....a ground ball?

bluedog- To the contrary, I want him to be able to think for himself. Practices are for preparation and games are for players. I want them to be able to sit on a pitch that they can drive hard and look for a specific area (middle-in or middle-out). I'm trying to increase his odds in being successful. What's wrong with that.

Chamelon (and others who apply)- So you want him swinging out of his a*#? There are alot of people on this board that like to play contrarian.

FYI- I'm not a believer in settling for ground ball. Far from it. That said, if you don't prepare players for the next level by giving them an understanding of situational hitting then you are not doing your job.

You guys can break down perfect swings all-day long and make it so complicated that you can't even get the message across to the hitter who you are supposedly trying to help. A great teacher or coach is not a reciter like most of you. It's someone who can detect a problem and fix it. Start giving everyone ways to teach and communicate your knowledge and you will be worth reading.

First off hitting is not as complicated as some would like you to think

Secondly we want players to know the situation--number of outs, runners on base, pitch count etc--- we not telling them what to do--if we have prepared them right they know what to do in each situation---we also want them looking for the next base when they turn first on a hit

Baseball can be a very simple game if properly prepared for.

We also want postive outs, ie moving a runner up, because 2 out of 3 times at least you will make an out


nc
As to the level that BD coaches I do b not think you will get an answer---he has never responded before

I believe a player should always know the number of outs, the count, and anything else that could dictate a change in approach. Also, It is not the responsibility of a coach to tell the player what to do every pitch. I don't think NCBall ever implied this. A great team member will alter his approach in order to help his team to score more runs. Knowing the number of outs can also help in anticipating how a pitcher will attack a specific hitter. Making adjustments throughout a game and within an at bat (based on outs, count, conditions, etc.) is what separates the good from the great and what makes baseball a wonderfully complex game.

Whether you favor "situational hitting" or not (I believe BlueDog once opined that “situational hitting is for losers”), it is a fact of life at the higher levels of baseball, and a player who ignores developing these skills does so at his own peril.

Case in point -- for several years, my son was in winter hitting clinics run by a minor league hitting coach who is now a MLB team's organization-wide minor league hitting coordinator. Every year, he would tell the kids in the clinic the same story about the importance his organization placed on situational hitting skills. Very few AAA players would be called up to start on a full-time basis right away, he told them. Instead, they would often be used as pinch hitters, or would get their ABs after being inserted as defensive replacements late in close games. Because of this, the parent club would ask him three questions about a player being considered for a call-up: 1) Can he bunt? 2) Can he move the runner from second to third with no outs with a ground ball to the right side? 3) Can he get a runner in from third with less than two outs with a ground ball or a sac fly? If he didn't answer "yes" to all three questions, the player stayed in AAA.

Again, you may not agree with this philosophy, but I thought this was an eye-opener for the kids in the clinic.

Not that I know so much but that sounds about right to me(Oak)even at youth levels, sitalional hitting says alot about a player.

quote:

.......sitalional hitting says alot about a player.

Yeah, it says he can't hit......

quote:

sitalional hitting says alot about a player.

And about a poster.

Do think something can be said of situational hitting (small ball) as it does seem to win it's fair share of championships. The problem is when coaches cross that line between situational hitting and micro-managing thus situational hitting isn't necessarily a reflection of a players ability to hit!

BLueDog

What makes you think you have all the asnswers and others know nothing ?----you still have not said what level you coach/instruct, if you coach/instruct at all---

In all the time you have been on this site you have never answered a question posed to you other than with a question

I personally think you are a sham---good instructors instruct and do not put others down when they express opinions

BlueDog- You have nothing to offer any of these people. My guess is that you don't have any idea about situational hitting, count hitting, etc.

You are one of those guys who fancies himself as an expert. So far, you have shown you are an expert about nothing. You give no insight to the ability to teach. You are a theory guy on the internet who couldn't coach his way out of a paper bag as far as we know. You show zero practical application in anything you write.

I will not bother reading one more of your posts and would suggest everybody follows suit. You truly are a waste of our time.

ncball

Question---how does a hitter fully do his job if he does not know how many outs there are?

NYdad- I don't look at situational hitting as small ball. I look at it as increasing your odds to be successful. Looking for a specific pitch in a specific zone increases your odds on getting a hit.

Hitting the ball to the right side with a man on second and no outs will either get you a hit or get you an out. Either way, you have advanced a runner and been productive.

I'm not talking about a ground ball. I'm talking about looking for a specific pitch in a specific zone to be successful driving a ball in that situation. Conversely, a guy comes up and pulls the ball to the left side. Now, a hit is great but an out doesn't move that runner up. Tell me, which one is better?

ncdad

I call it producing " productive and positive outs"

quote:

NYdad- I don't look at situational hitting as small ball

Perhaps I use a broad brush but situational hitting and small ball are synonymous IMO.

quote:

I'm not talking about a ground ball. I'm talking about looking for a specific pitch in a specific zone to be successful driving a ball in that situation. Conversely, a guy comes up and pulls the ball to the left side. Now, a hit is great but an out doesn't move that runner up. Tell me, which one is better?

Turning on a pitch on the inside half and ripping a double off the LF wall

NYdad- That's great except when he hits a rocket right to the left fielder and the runner doesn't move up. I will add that it does all depends who the hitter is.

Way back when in 1993, I had a guy who I consider an excellent coach working with us. He had coached at the college level and was a small-ball advocate for all kids. Well, we had a kid who was 6'4, 225 lbs. at 16 who crushed the ball. He was a dead pull-hitter (still is with the Phillies) who really struggled with hitting the ball away. I whispered to him to respect the coach and knock down the LF fence. All was forgiven when he was successful with that.

quote:

That's great except when he hits a rocket right to the left fielder and the runner doesn't move up. I will add that it does all depends who the hitter is.

Perhaps situational hitters are a byproduct of all the small ball being played

Baseball strategy has many faces---I know this--for us if we have a runner on second with no out he better be at third or across the plate with the next batter--like I say-- we like productive outs

I believe that situational hitting is important not only to MLB organizations but at any level. Starting with the most basic circumstances, who really wants their slow, slow, very slow hitter oblivious to the fact that he is at bat in the home half of the last inning in a tie game with runners on first and third and one out? At least he needs to know what you DO NOT want him to do, right? OK. That is a form of situational hitting.

But it is much more than small ball and much more than knowing how many outs there are. The hitter should consider how many runners are on base, where are they [double play possible or sac fly scores a run] and who are they [fast runner on first but slow runner on second]. How is the defense playing me and what are their weaknesses and strengths? Have I seen enough of this pitcher to know how he is trying to get me out or likely to try and get me out. We could go on and on but hopefully you see my point.

However, once the hitter has made his situational assessment and determined his game plan [get a pitch I can pull, I can take the other way, I can hit on the ground, I can hit to the outfield in the air] or had it determined for him [coach just gave me the bunt sign, where do I need to put the bunt easy down first base, easy down third base, hard past the pitcher's left, hard past the pitcher's right] he should step in the batter's box and think about nothing but execution.

TW344

TW


Well said !

quote:

Originally posted by TRhit:
BLueDog

What makes you think you have all the asnswers and others know nothing

We don't have to worry if TR has any answers do we.

Perhaps more than you realize Chameleon


and I dont answer questions with a question

Hi Richard!!!

quote:

The hitter should consider how many runners are on base, where are they [double play possible or sac fly scores a run] and who are they [fast runner on first but slow runner on second]. How is the defense playing me and what are their weaknesses and strengths? Have I seen enough of this pitcher to know how he is trying to get me out or likely to try and get me out. We could go on and on but hopefully you see my point.

However, once the hitter has made his situational assessment and determined his game plan [get a pitch I can pull, I can take the other way, I can hit on the ground, I can hit to the outfield in the air] or had it determined for him [coach just gave me the bunt sign, where do I need to put the bunt easy down first base, easy down third base, hard past the pitcher's left, hard past the pitcher's right] he should step in the batter's box and think about nothing but execution.

TW, just curious but when/where does recognize the pitch, time it and hit the **** out of it fit into that equation

quote:

Looking for a specific pitch in a specific zone increases your odds on getting a hit.

Actually, Ncball, it greatly increases your odds of striking out.......If the pitcher is worth anything, you aint getting that belt high middle of the plate not too fast fastball your hitters are looking for.....And, yes, when you say "specific" pitch and "specific" zone, that is the pitch you mean!!

quote:

I don't look at situational hitting as small ball.

Well let's think about it....There's small ball and there's long ball......And, it dang sure aint long ball!!!

quote:

Hitting the ball to the right side with a man on second and no outs will either get you a hit or get you an out.

Now, there'a a brilliant statement....

I can see Jack Benny with his hand on his face saying, "Rochester, I didn't know that".......

quote:

ncball

Question---how does a hitter fully do his job if he does not know how many outs there are?

TRhit

How does a pitcher fully do his job if he knows the hitter is thinking??....

Answer:...Very easy, that's how!!

Lets take it a step further - how do either the hitter or the pitcher do their jobs if they both think that the other guy is thinking about how they are thinking.

And what if they arent thinking at all - but think that they are.

Then it really gets confusing.

And round and round we go. As usual.

LOL

Anybody remember the 2006 World Baseball Classic ? Still believe in longball ? Write the book, "How I lost with superior talent" Judging by this thread you'd sell a few copies ...

BLUEDOG


A hitter knowing how many outs there arewhen he steps into the batters box does not necessarily correlate to "thinking" in the box---it means that the hitter knows what the situation is


By way answer the question---what level to coach? Or are you an INTERNET INSTRUCTOR ONLY?
we know that you do not give answers