How Come Pitchers Can't Hit?

quote:

Why can't they hit?

I used to wonder the same thing but now that I have been exposed to the college level, I think I know why. In high school, pitchers are often the best hitters because they are often the best athletes. At the higher levels of the sport, so much time is put into pitching and hitting that most pitchers quickly fall behind their teammates who are hitting all day long. For multi-position pitchers who also hit, they often find themselves robbing Peter to pay Paul in order to keep up with all of their responsibilities. Every once in awhile, a guy like Tim Hudson, or Kerry Wood, or Micah Owings comes along who can hit no matter what the circumstances. They are obviously the exceptions.

I've wondered the same thing. LOTS of major league pitchers were stud hitters in high school. But very few swing the bat well in the pros.

My best guess: hitting at the MLB level is just incredibly difficult. So difficult that it requires endless work, repetition and practice, even for someone with the physical ability.

Pitchers don't get enough at bats, and don't have the time to get the necessary reps and practice to hone their batting skills and still do what they need to do to pitch effectively.

This, as I said, is just my best guess. I don't really have any insider knowledge of this. I sure would be interested to hear from people who do.

I'd rather them not hit. Spend more time worrying about pitching and leave it to the position players to handle the rest. A single, of course, a double, it happens, a homerun, you got lucky, but for Zambrano to get a triple, he'd have to lose 50 pounds. It would never happen.

Pitchers don't hit for the same reason that very few hitters can be effective pinch hitters. It takes reps. My guess is that the average of MLB pinch hitters is well below that of hitters in general. As far as the ability to hit goes just look at Rick Ankiel once he got the reps.

Pitchers can hit!

When we travel to Australia the past 17 years, we have
placed our American 16-18 year old pitchers in the daily games against the State and National teams of Australia. Several pitchers had not batted in 2 years, because of their high school coach or summer coach judgement.

Last year, we carried 7 pitchers on the 16 player Rays roster. With 12 games in 14 days all pitchers played a position when not pitching their 3 innings.

When a "competitive" pitcher is a batter he concentrates on "seeing the ball".

As you know the role of a hitter is to "see the ball".

After a few successful AB's the pitcher/hitter and the every day hitter, becomes careless and starts "pulling off". Focus and relaxed concentration needs to be maintained.

This is where the coach and the player himself makes the necessary corrections. This is a 10 minute summary of 26 years in International Baseball
and observation of 8,000 players, including pitchers.

Bob

Correct me if I am wrong but once a pitcher advances beyond HS isn't the bat taken out of their hands? College and minor leagues?

This is an interesting topic, and one that I've had a couple first hand experiences with this spring. Two of the players who formerly played on our summer teams are a good example of this topic, and might provide something of an answer to the question. One of these players pitches for a WAC school, and the other is the Friday night starter for a Pac-10 school. They're both very good pitchers, and when they played in high school and summer Connie Mack baseball, were excellent middle of the order power hitters.

This past winter, I had conversations with the coaches at both schools that eventually got around to the discussion about them needing more hitting, especially when they're on the road for conference games with a lighter traveling squad. In the case of the WAC pitcher, I told his coaches that, whether they realize it or not, this player might be one of the more proficient hitters on their team, even to the point that last year he played infield on our summer collegiate team when not pitching and still hits very well. They gave him a bit of an opportunity to hit, but quickly abandoned the idea. As for the Pac-10 pitcher, they too gave him an opportunity to hit, and from what I understand he was hitting pretty well before they too abandoned the project. At this point, neither pitcher will likely see the batters box ever again, except from 60'6" away.

The reason they both are back to pitching only? As soon as they started working on their hitting more, their pitching suffered. Both were getting knocked around more, and both college teams decided that they'd rather have them do one thing very well, pitch, rather than two things to a lesser degree. It didn't matter how well they hit, they're on those teams to pitch, and anything that takes away from that will not be part of their game. It's unfortunate, as they're both solid hitters, in fact one of them is a good enough hitter to be a starter on his school's infield, but their future is pitching and unless they someday are playing for a national league club, I think their only interaction with bats will be in trying to miss them.

Why don't hitters pitch?

Hitters do not pitch because they can't--- and all pitchers think they can hit---my stepson who is a fine lefty pitcher still thinks he is a hitter--he now plays in a 30 and up league--he talked coach into letting him hit---His bride to be described it succinctly to me the other nite--" One slider--two slider--three slider-- SITDOWN"--had to love it


I also do not subscribe to the theory that pitchers are the best athletes on the team--not always the case-_David Wells---Mickey Lolich ??

I'm glad this topic came up. I've been considering this issue for the past year or so.

06, I think we've made a similar relevation our son on a smaller scale. He has always been #1 pitcher on his teams and has always batted 3rd or 4th. He started telling me in the past year or two that he doesn't hit as good when he is pitching. Like a good adult, I pretty much blew it off.

But I started noticing this past fall that there may be some truth to that. Then I figured it's probably in his head.

Well, as I thought about it more, I believe it is in his head, but not like that. Hitting and pitching are the 2 most mental parts of the game. Both require a lot of focus, thought, and in game adjustments.

Let's face it, if your playing a position, other than catcher, you have plenty of time to focus on your hitting in a game from AB to AB.

But if you are pitching, that's not the case. You are pretty much focused on pitching.

To illustrate this, I have noticed that when not pitching, Jr. will often have his helmet on and bat in hand when he is the batter behingd the batter in the hole. However when he is pitching I have noticed that he often doesn't get his bat and helmet until he is on deck.

Furthermore, when he isn't pitching, he is most of the time up on the fence or dugout steps with most of his teammates while we are hitting. When pitching, he seems to mostly be on the bench resting, getting fluids, processing what's going on on the mound. I think most of you can see the differences, and the advantages and disadvantages to your hitting.

Just my opinion based on some observations.

When My guy was pitching up to his HS sophomore year I charted the games, pitching and non pitching---he hit at least 100 percentage points lower when he pitched---the baseball brain works hard to allow a kid to do both--one aspect has to suffer

TR, I was sure that someone smarter than me had already figured this out, LOL! I bet Jr.'s stats would be similar to your guy's for sure.

Today, lodi's right --- after (and in many cases even in) hs, pitchers aren't given the opportunity to hit. Becomes a bit of a self-fulfilling prophesy. Probably because the coaches have noticed the same thing as you all have....and because the use of a DH in hs and college gets one more player into the game.

If the player's bat is serious enough, though, it's the mound that gets taken away (thinking of Babe Ruth and Stan Musial as extreme examples). I'd wager most professional ballplayers have pitched at one time or another.

In the minors at least until A+ the pitchers never hit...even when they are a national league team...

My son's current correlation is if he's pitching well, he'll hit well too. If he's pitching poorly, he's not hitting either. The games in the second category are *real* fun to sit through...

The true reason....
the second you become a pitcher you lose ALL athletic ability!

Pitchers don't hit for the same reason that hitters don't pitch. Time management. A player can only get so many reps in a day of practice. To be excellent at a highly skilled sport like baseball or golf, for instance, all the players time must be devoted to perfecting his mechanics at that one requirement...he doesn't have time for anything else.

JMO

This and arm wear and tear is why I would rather Jr. not pitch in HS

Last night Yovani Gallardo (Brewers) threw 8 innings, 2 hits, 0 runs, 11 Ks. The Brewers won 1-0 the only run scoring on Yovani Gallardo's solo homerun in the 7th inning.

Some pitchers obviously can hit.

But for any other position, either you compete offensively or you don't ever wear a MLB uniform.

Pitchers can make it without having to hit. So, many guys who can't cut it as hitters still get to MLB despite the fact that they never could hit pro pitching.

No other position offers that option, so you just don't see it. The non-hitters fall by the wayside.

There was a time when teams would put up with a weak hitting, strong defensive player at SS or C. But we have left that era far behind.

Not sure what he's doing this year but Hampton used to swing a pretty decent bat. Think he actaully pinch hit a few times

quote:

But for any other position, either you compete offensively or you don't ever wear a MLB uniform.

Adam Everett, Brad Ausmus not withstanding...

Sometimes even in high school around here you have a kid that can only pitch and that is it. He can't swing a bat and never has been able to. However, if you have a kid that is an excellent left handed pitcher and has an excellent left handed bat. A coach would be hard pressed to take the bat out of the kid's hands. I don't know if this goes back to what I told my son when he was 8 years old or not, but I told him if someone gets a hit off of you,while you are pitching, the next time you're up get a hit off of them. The same thing goes if a kid strikes you out. You get them out next time when you are pitching. So far it is working. My son is batting around .400 (14/35) and has allowed only 2 earned runs in 12 innings pitching. It may be rare, but I don't see why a player can't do both for a while. However, more teams are looking for pitching, pitching, pitching.......and that ususally wins out over hitting if a player can do that.

Mildodad, you just took the wind out of my sails. Son claims if he is good enough at catching, the hitting doesn't matter as much, darn. Boy only hit .350 his senior year as catcher. Maybe he can switch back to pitching?

My son is high school pitcher and also plays 3 base. When he pitches he gets dh'd. It's ok with me and it gives another kid a chance to particpate in the game. My son is a good hitter usally ends season 350-400.
I do know of schools that at sophomore level if you are a pitcher that is all you do, no position no batting. What a shame IMHO to pigion-hole a kid so early. My son is a very good pitcher and an excellent 3 baseman, which one he continues at is up in the air. I am very happy his school has seen his talent at both (along with his summer team) and continue to let him develop both along with his hitting skills (which have developed some big time power this year)
Thanks to coaches like his for not stiffling his skills into one dimension to early.

baseballdad,
From our experience, I don't believe it is unusual at all to pitch and play position in HS. Our son did. Many do.

However, this game gets more and more competitive as players mature. The college game is nothing like the high school game. Milb is another step up.
As players move up, the game is faster, much more skilled, and played at a very different level.
Very few have the skills to play baseball beyond high school at any position. It is a very, very different game, both physically and mentally.
Think about how difficult it would be to try and be a position player and pitcher. While you are trying to compete at a high level in each, some who equally or more talented are just focused on pitching.
While your son is trying to compete, some who are equally or more talented are solely focused on hitting and fielding.
Finally, you cannot underestimate the difficulty in the mental transition from HS to college baseball.
When you look forward, it isn't a question for many players as to whether they play one or the other, it is whether they play at all.
The gap in talent level and depth of talent level that allows kids to pitch and play a position in HS does not exist in college baseball.

infielddad-I agree with you, I was talking about high school age were IMHO unless they either do not want to or are uncapable should be allowed to field a position as well as hit if the have the talent and not have to make a choice so early. Many kids I've seen at 15 that pitch also are very good fielders and hitters and at this level haven't figured out which path if either will take them to the next level--I think 15 for the most part is to young to HAVE to make a choice by your high school coach---Would you agree with that? Just MHO

You just have to look at the individual kid - can he hit or not is the issue. I have had both. If my pitcher can hit he's going to hit and if he can't then he's getting DH'd for.

I can only remember one kid who had to be DH'd for. He couldn't hit water if he was in a row boat in the middle of the ocean and it was sinking. He could pitch though - he's in college right now getting it paid for by pitching.

quote:

Originally posted by Baseball Dad 46:
infielddad-I agree with you, I was talking about high school age were IMHO unless they either do not want to or are uncapable should be allowed to field a position as well as hit if the have the talent and not have to make a choice so early. Many kids I've seen at 15 that pitch also are very good fielders and hitters and at this level haven't figured out which path if either will take them to the next level--I think 15 for the most part is to young to HAVE to make a choice by your high school coach---Would you agree with that? Just MHO

Sorry, I did not realize your comments were solely limited to HS.
In terms of the question you have raised, I can only go by personal experiences. From what I have seen, HS coaches at the varsity level want their teams to compete and perform at the team's highest level.
Necessarily, they play the 9 best, hit the 9 best, and pitch the 5-6 best.
I actually do not think the player gets to make the choice on whether to pitch "and" be a position player at the varsity level in HS.
My personal view is that if the player wants to do both, he needs to demonstrate his ability on both.
If he isn't in the top 9 position players, hitters and 5-6 pitchers, then he needs to work harder to get there. My answer might be different at the JV/frosh soph level.
But, by the time players are at the varsity level in HS, they need to take responsibility for their play, and the improvement needed if they are not at the level they want to be to pitch and hit.

My son a freshman "pitcher only" on his JV team, at a school with a yearlong baseball program in a highly competitive league. It's been a hard spring getting used to this. He's a good hitter. He's a good first baseman. But he's a much better pitcher. A week or so ago, he had an epiphany; ironically during a game in which he struck out 8 in 4 innings but got tagged with the loss because of the many errors behind him. He told me later that he realized he'd proven himself as a pitcher, while the other kids -- including 2 playing first -- were still trying to prove themselves. He didn't need to play 1st when he wasn't pitching; in fact, he said it made more sense to let the other kids get as many innings at 1st as possible in order to become strong first basemen. That would be the best way to make sure the team was as strong as possible when they were varsity.

I guess this philosophy is a "team player" type of outlook. But he was very happy when the coach let him DH the next game.

LHPMom

infielddad--No need for the sorry . I think we are in agreement. My son is a freshman who is both 3B and pitcher like I stated. He was starting 3 B and a pitcher on freshman-- he was moved up to sophomore because there 3B went to varsity (he was not a pitcher). My son mainly was moved up to play 3B, he has pitched a little but that was not there need. He is having fun and enjoys both the coaches and players (it helps they haven't lost since he moved up 11 games ago). If he doesn't get to pitch much in HS this year--so be it, he will pitch agianst the best competetion in country this summer and play 3B and we will go from there. My concern always is he having fun--I think he should be pitching for the HS more but what I think doesn't matter Thanks for the input I learned a few things.---Oh LHPMom the E's are always tough but it sounds like you both have a great attitude and approach, hope it works out well--good luck.

quote:

Originally posted by Baseball Dad 46:
infielddad-I agree with you, I was talking about high school age were IMHO unless they either do not want to or are uncapable should be allowed to field a position as well as hit if the have the talent and not have to make a choice so early. Many kids I've seen at 15 that pitch also are very good fielders and hitters and at this level haven't figured out which path if either will take them to the next level--I think 15 for the most part is to young to HAVE to make a choice by your high school coach---Would you agree with that? Just MHO

My pitcher, in JV, pitched and was ss. When he moved up, they took the bat out of his hands at 15. Why, because as good as he was as a position player and hitter, he was a better pitcher and it was obvious. He didn't make the decision someone made it for him, guess that you might think they were stiffling his skills.
Looking back, son will tell you that he is very glad that they took the bat out of his hands early and he was able to concentrate on pitching only.

The way I see it, in some way a decision has been made, for now, your son is a 3bman and part time pitcher.

There is a reason why coaches make those decisions (pitchers only pitch), and I am glad that it was made for son, because if it was up to him he'd be doing both until graduation, and that might have stiffled him more than taking the bat out of his hands early.

My LHP son went to college as a pitcher only. I think not being allowed to hit (even in the cage) took alot of the joy out of the game for him. He had been having great summers at the plate playing American Legion baseball. I can certainly see why he was a pitcher only in college. But I also understand that he enjoyed both aspects of the game -- pitching and batting. And yes, he was also DH'd for in high school when he was the starting pitcher. I thought that allowed him to focus on the task at hand.

The biggest reason pitchers can't hit isn't mental or physical; it's because the American League needed a boost in attendance in the early seventies.

And every once in a while, some Bozo wants to extend it to the NL, instead of the AL returning to playing baseball.

DH in the NL, Too

In the immortal words of Crahs Davis, "I believe there ought to be a constitutional amendment outlawing Astroturf and the designated hitter."

ya
agree, i think the post was suppose to be about 'why pitchers don't hit' but 'why pitchers can't hit'. i bet most pitcher are great hitters. so, i guess the reason most hs and college teams dh their pitchers is so they can focus on the pitching....its a tough job. what you guys think?

quote:

Originally posted by Midlo Dad:
Some pitchers obviously can hit.

But for any other position, either you compete offensively or you don't ever wear a MLB uniform.

Pitchers can make it without having to hit. So, many guys who can't cut it as hitters still get to MLB despite the fact that they never could hit pro pitching.

No other position offers that option, so you just don't see it. The non-hitters fall by the wayside.

There was a time when teams would put up with a weak hitting, strong defensive player at SS or C. But we have left that era far behind.

Now that my son's a Sophomore, there have been many well-meaning parents/coaches/travel ball recruiters that have told my son that if he's going to be a pitcher, he shouldn't even worry about hitting. He was first told this as a Freshman and I felt that this was the worst thing that they could have told him.

Why, you may ask? Because before it was said, he hit great, once he heard that, his hitting really suffered. His attitude then became, I'm a pitcher so who cares if I hit. Well, his current HS coach does care, possibly because he is a RHP and a lefty batter. His pitching has never suffered whether he was hitting good or bad. I am thankful to his current HS coach for having the insight to continue to encourage and develop his skills as an all-around player and not just a pitcher. This year, he has the 2nd highest batting average on his team.

Who you going to thank if your son wrecks his arm sliding into a base etc ?
I have seen this way too many times. One guy was also on the Nike JR golf tour. He lost his scholarship and is no longer able to play at a high level.
It is a calculated risk. There have been posters on here who had son's football injuries cut their BB careers short. If your son is a great pitcher he should be careful about playing a position.

IMO pitchers hit as long as they are one of the better hitters on the team. If your best pitcher is one of your best hitters is a HS coach going to keep him on the bench 4 out of 5 games? I don't think so.

I would imagine this happens in college also. I know of a couple of kids recruited, signed and played as two way players at an ACC school.

If you are a top notch hitter and pitcher you might not have to make a decision on which one to drop until pro ball.

You can get hurt only being a pitcher as well. You can get hurt if you try and cross the street. You can get hurt slicing a tomato. You can get hurt carrying your luggage.

Pitchers aren't porcelin dolls that require extra care and tenderness. They are highly skilled athletes and if you can find one who can do more than pitch then you let them do it. The vast majority of guys will not go past high school. And those who do get past high school most won't get past college and so on. So why limit what and how much you play based on "I hope one day to be a pitcher at ______"?