How will you teach hitting?

Passion,

Do you mean like a hitch in the rotation of the wrists in loading sort of like Hank Aaron?

Shep

quote:

Originally posted by PASSION:
...most mlb hitters are late 60% of the time. ...

Really? So your answer is to be early 100% of the time.

Please proof think your posts.

In followup to Linear's response.

Re: timing you can be early, on time or late. My suggestion is to be on time 100% of the time.

Linear it is not that complex - quit making it so.

Passion,

You may just have a valid point here about timing being more of a problem than the actual swing.

So many times, it is obvious that a hitter can be over-matched by a blazing fastball with good movement and simply can't catch up to the ball.

So many times, the actual plane of the bat as determined by message sent to brain via hand/eye coordination doesn't figure in that unidentified late movement-lol This will cause you to miss the ball with bat anyway.
Food-for-thought
Shep

quote:

Originally posted by PASSION:
...My suggestion is to be on time 100% of the time.

Nice goal. Now a taste of reality.

Why doesn't anyone hit a 1000? Because it's impossible. Hitting is very difficult. Pitchers are paid nice money to make sure you aren't "on time 100% of the time".

So, now you come along with a number that says hitters are late 60% of the time. Really? Well, the best hitters in the world hit .300. For the most part, they are on time 30% of the time. I bet their timing is off a very high percentage of the other 70%. And you want us to believe its better to be early than late. (your words....better to be early than late)

I can guarantee you a loss in BA and a loss in power numbers if their goal is to get their foot down early.

Yes, it's complex. Much more than you know.

Here is another scenerio:

How much can a hitter's hands change the swing- plane while making hand-eye adjustments with continuous updated messages sent to the brain while tracking ball with eyes to impact, and how much power is lost, if any, as the bat changes swing planes throughout this hitting process?
Shep

The above mentioned scenerio refers to a situation of late-movement of baseball as hitter tracks ball to impact.

Even if your timing is correct 100% you still won't hit 1.000-- too many things involved---this is a taste of reality

I do not see the correlation between being on time 30% and hitting .300 --in theory a batter can be "on time" 100% of the time and still hit .300

I am with Passion in that some posters, coaches and so-called instructional websites make hitting more difficult that it truly is.

I am not saying that hitting is not difficult , just that some try to make it much more difficult than it really is

Would it be advantageous for the hitter to start swing earlier in the above mentioned case of late movement of pitch?
Shep

It seems to me the hitter would simply seal his fate sooner-lol

SHEP

For me this is where the eye/brain connection comes in--some just get the signal quicker than others

Linear - point well taken. All of this is very complex.

All I am saying is that in a majority of the cases, hitters get themselves fully loaded and into a hitting position too late. If you took my 60% number to heart it would look something like this:

A batter loads and is in a hitting position too _________ _____% of the time.

1. early 10% of the time

2. on time 30% of the time

3. late 60% of the time

I am talking about getting ready to hit the ball (fully loaded) and not when you swing.

Looking at the statistics above - tell me where the focus needs to be on trying to be ready on time more than you have been.

Next time you go to a high school game, college or any game and watch the batters and see if they are loading too late. Most of the batters will be starting their load after the pitcher has released the ball and getting their foot down right when the ball is crossing the plate. I mean you will see this in 6 of the 9 batters in the starting lineup.

Yes they will go to their practices and work on their swing mechanics, etc. - but nothing will be said about getting into a hitting position/loading earlier. They will think they are on time - but they are not.

This timing thing is also true on breaking balls, etc. It is not just with the 93 mph fastballs.

I think if loading late is more the case than loading early - I would tell batters who are having a problem - to load earlier than you think you should - and maybe they would be on time more often than what they currently are now.

Thats so true TR and those are the hitters that make it to the bigs

quote:

Originally posted by PASSION:
Looking at the statistics above - tell me where the focus needs to be on trying to be ready on time more than you have been...

Write this down. Memorize it. Don't ever forget it. Don't let anyone ever tell you different.....

If you're afraid to be late you will never hit your potential.

Think about it. You've just told us 60% of all hitters are late. Guess what........that includes the best hitters that have ever played.

Go tell them to get their front foot down early (so they won't be late) and watch their BA and power numbers drop dramatically.

Hitting is difficult. A very hard thing to do is to time the load/unload to the pitch. Why? Well, first of all, pitchers are trying to f with you. Secondly, there is no such thing as a load. There is either loading or unloading. And this load/unload has to be very quick and well timed.

And because you can't just load, hold it, wait and swing....that is why you just can't put your foot down early.

It's a wave across the country and it's pure hogwash.

And I bet Swingbuster is disappointed because he could sell a lot of contaptions if what you say was possible.

quote:

Originally posted by TRhit:
SHEP

For me this is where the eye/brain connection comes in--

How would you know?

quote:

And I bet Swingbuster is disappointed because he could sell a lot of contaptions if what you say was possible

Linear...shoulders loaded/ closed and foot down with toe 45 degrees...torque...get some ...

You remember that musical group..THE SPINNERS.Did those guys play for you

YOu have a little damage control over at the castle beyond the mote see my new topic/ discussion

quote:

Originally posted by swingbuster:

Linear...shoulders loaded...

Sorry, but there is no such thing as "shoulders loaded". Either loading or unloading.

Get it right for once.

ITS

I kinda feel like the Gazelle tonight-lol Sheppy

Shep,

If that is the case - I strongly recommend you dont attempt a "quick sprint across the plains".

These lions mean business.
LOL

Appreciate the words of wisdom ITS and will keep that in mind in future posts

Not for the faint of heart-lol

Shep

quote:

Sorry, but there is no such thing as "shoulders loaded". Either loading or unloading.

I have a picture here of Hank Aaron he looks like he is ready to hit. Are they loading /unloading or loaded.

*****......... *****

In hitting, torque is a fallacy.....

now BlueDog...really..how do you measure the hips a few frames ahead of the shoulders then. I know your not that pure Ny-man.

OBTW...did he add something to posture connect rotate like SEND THE BAT BARREL BACKWARDS. Has that been there or did he just learn it was a big part of the MLB swing. He sure said it. Maybe he was afraid people were realizing it really was important and he was afraid we would think Mankin reported it OVER AND OVER AND OVER

He posted it as he fired Steve on set-pro and chastized and disowned Mark H.

"In hitting, torque is a fallacy"

Epstein spoke by invitation to the 3500 members of the ABCA as the keynote speaker on this chosen subject.

You, Linear, against 3500 ABCA members and a guy that played college, pro ball and teaches lectures, writes for Collegiate Baseball, Certifies coaches, ....people fly from all over the worlds to seee him and has sold 50,000 DVDs and as many or more hitting books. He has made taching his life's mission.

these are the kind of statements that lost Ny-mans credability...Why follow that. NO torque...spinning is good, close off the lead foot, two stage teaching, ....weak and incorrect stuff..we ain't playing fastpitch here

And what have any of us done close to EPSTEIN..you go first

I can answer that, loading

Guys_Guys

Sorry I'm in the middle of this volitale situation and apologize because I can tell you guys do mean business and I definitely don't want to get caught in the cross-fire. ITS wasn't kidding.

I have no horse with loaded saddle-bags in this race. Simply want to discuss hitting.

Definitely been away tooo longgg...

Sincerely,
Shep-unloading now-lol

Shep,

You should always feel free to participate.

Also - use the low underbrush as cover when necessary - and watch out for the hyenas - we have a few of those too. LOL

Shep


Welcome to world of Linear and Blue Dog

They have all the answers for you---just ask them

HIt

They just keep adding rocks to their backpacks ...its getting heavy

How about some other nymanisms for starters:

Arm strength doesn't matter

Top hand is along for the ride

There is no such thing as tht, just a torqu ing force applied to the bat by back arm inertia that greatly quickens the swing

or some he thought he had to revise:

upper and lower body are separate motor programs

Griffey has the best swing

scap loading isn't that important in hitting

others?

Linear, all I am saying is maybe being just a slight bit earlier on your load. I am not saying to get your foot down while the pitcher is holding the ball or anything. Listen if you are just getting your foot down when the ball is crossing the plate, then you have absolutely no lower stability to hit the ball with any power. Atleast getting into a hitting position a slight bit earlier - will give you a more stable lower half. I cannot see how anyone would disagree with this. Michael Young (Rangers) bought into this and became a hitting leader. Hank Blaylock did not and had a very subpar season. Again all I am talking about is a very slight adjustment.

Re: pitchers trying to mess up your timing. This is nothing new - the good ones do a good job in this area. This is why a batter has to have a CONSISTENT timing approach - no matter what the pitcher is doing. You cannot come up with a different timing mechanism for every pitcher. You have to have a consistent approach - no matter what the pitcher is doing.

Getting into a hitting position slightly earlier, etc. helps you slow the ball down and I believe helps you see the ball better.

Again we are not talking extremes in this case. Just a slight and more consistent approach to timing.

Lets do Top hand along for ride >

I'll start>Thats just on another board, golf I believe it is-lol

Piazza, definite top-hand hitter.

its-

done.

bad show.

just couldn't resist.

will try to turn over new leaf.

Tom,

Thank you.

quote:

Originally posted by swingbuster:

quote:

Sorry, but there is no such thing as "shoulders loaded". Either loading or unloading.

I have a picture here of Hank Aaron he looks like he is ready to hit. Are they loading /unloading or loaded.

*****......... *****

"I have a picture of Hank Aaron....."


This folks is living proof if you needed more than what he's already given.

quote:

..And what have any of us done close to EPSTEIN..you go first

I guess this means you believe in the fence drill.

I guess you believe in elbow slotting.

I guess you believe in ALL your weight remaining over the back leg.

I guess you believe the rear elbow can lead the rear hand.

I guess you believe in drop and tilt.

I guess you believe in weathervaning for God's sake.

He's almost as much of a quack as Mike Marshall. Not quite, but close.

quote:

Originally posted by swingbuster:
And what have any of us done close to EPSTEIN..you go first

Thats an easy one.

We are active - and devoted - members of the HSBBWEB.

I do not believe Epstein has done that.

Strike one on Mike.

New Ny-man quote "posture, connect, rotate, get the barrel going backwards"

At what point did your egomaniancal guru get some new religion. It is now a simple FOUR step process. He invented plagarism.

He and Engishbey fighting over the rights to three words and then boom...there comes the fourth phrase.

Did he finally see hand torque....took him 4 years after Mankin described it. Quick learner

THe tee drill Steve is doing on the "mother of all pathetic post".... I assume is teaching connection. If you taught it any later you would hit the ball into the catcher.

I guess if spinning is your swing you better get used to a very late connection

Teacherman-

You have definitely got the dogma down.

A few more protestations of faith like that and you may get out of the doghouse.

I hear they have some openings over at the scientific site.

You can help perfect the no arm action/no torque fastpitch swing.
Trouble is it might not be best there except maybe in the mens game.

At least Epstein and Lau are describing the actual high level baseball swing.

I don't think you create the baseball swing from the middle out, you have to work the ends of the body against each other(thigh/hips vs arms/scaps).

But maybe I'm not scientistic enough as they say on the Colbert Report.

Does the swing have to be so scientific?==why not just show them?

Young players do not understand the terms used anyway

Isn't it better to be "one on one" and show them what you mean without all the misunderstood terms ???---

quote:

Originally posted by swingbuster:
New Ny-man quote "posture, connect, rotate, get the barrel going backwards"...

Misquoting people is swingbusters main artillery. His mechanics won't stand up so he misquotes others. 3 or 4 examples of it in this thread alone.

And, he loves to air others dirty laundry.....helps detract from the holes in his hitting theory.

Keep those arms moving, Swingbuster. Let me know when you want them to connect.

quote:

Originally posted by tom.guerry:

At least Epstein...is describing the actual high level baseball swing.

Right, Tom. Now, visit his site and look at the good swing examples he posts. Better yet, tell us right here, have you ever seen a mlb hitter that looked like this guy????

These are examples of "his work".

When is the last time you saw a mlb hitter fall back toward the catcher when he swings?





I know this is a still picture. I'm not computer smart enough to get his .gifs to work here. Go to http://www.mikeepsteinhitting.com and play the .gifs. Your only conclusion can be.......QUACK.

Yet, he's Tom's boy.

The most interesting thing about this thread is that MOST of you would dissagree on how to teach hitting........ and most of the hitters you'd teach would end up looking pretty much the same.
Rollerman

Mine don't look like that.

i'd hope nobody's would look like that.

I'd take that nice looking young man and his swing. Not high level yet, but on a known path with a known destination.Not headed for the late connection spinning version of dead hands no-stride,which is a good thing since he's playing baseball.

Now it's confirmed......You're both dishonest.

For all other posters, please check out the videos of the others so you can get a clear picture of this "known path" and this "known destination".

QUACK QUACK

That was a very good illustration of a "young" hitter who is well on his way. Definitely hitting against a firm/rigid front side.

Reminds me of a early pictures of Tiger Woods

P.S.(That rocking back motion must be attributed to the paint roller at the end of the extension not seen in picture; reminds me of how I used to rock back when swinging a rake when I was about that age and how I would rock back-lol Is it a paint roller or rake?)

Shep

teach-

that is a compliment coming from you.

Rollerman

Just read your post and say from my humble observation it seems as if everybody who disagrees has their own hitting philosophy and using this board to sell it-LOL

I do have to say however, these guys are very good.

Shep

Shep,

Its' fun isnt it? And informative too.

From my perspective - I liken it to the old Mutual of Omaha show - "Wild Kingdom". I am Marlon Perkins (god rest his soul). I walk around with newcomers and point out the lions and tigers and hyenas. (And occasionally - the carcasses strewn about the plains). LOL

ITS

I do want to thank you for the personal escort through the jungle here.

Feel like your my bodyguard-Where do I send the check?-lol

And your right it is entertaining but informative at the same time

Shep

raiderbb,

Nice soundtrack at website.

Do you have "put me in coach"-like that one too.

Shep

ITS

You have a PM

Shep

Shep,

I looked - but it isnt there yet.

ITS

Should be there now, thought I had to add you to contact list

Apologize,
Shep

PS(Now there though, I hope)

posture connect rotate.......oops and get the bat barrel going back .........if you know how.

Working top half against the bottom defines how the middle works. THere is no other way to work the middle.

***** did not know how to work the top half back .... he should have listened to Mankin about the top and Epstein about the bottom simply taken credit for the end result

quote:

Does the swing have to be so scientific?==why not just show them?

Young players do not understand the terms used anyway

Isn't it better to be "one on one" and show them what you mean without all the misunderstood terms ???---

TRhit

Definately one on one is the best way to go. As Cal and Billy Ripkin say, "celebrate the individual." And as I mentioned before, I thinks it's best to throw some specific science stuff as well as some simple non-science stuff when teaching the hitter.

Still no denial.

My only claim to fame is starting the biggest thread on the HSBBW.

I'm starting to worry, might have to talk to Julie and have her delete this thread if it continues to grow!

Somehow, I think it's going to continue to grow.

You know all they would do is start a new thread with same or similiar topic-

Shepster

TR,
There are some of us that think everything can be interpreted though scientific methodolgy.
There are some of us who think that everything can be explained in terms of scientific understanding..... and there are some that cannot or will not understand that type of explaination.
Some have become extinct and some still do....stink.
But the constant is change. Baseball is finally catching up with other sports in the method of analysis and teaching. What and how we teach in the future will certainly be different from what we teach now. Don't discount scientific methodolgy, it's what has made western civilization great.
Rollerman

Rollerman--you tell that to a 12/13 year old who wants to learn how to hit

And I do not discount anything--I just think all the mumbo jumbo does not work on young kids--they need to be talked to in english and shown

Or older adults.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Linear:
If you're afraid to be late you will never hit your potential.
QUOTE]

This is a very valuable point. We can discuss the mechanics of hitting for years, but without adding the mental approach to hitting against quality pitching our hitters will struggle.

PG

I saw opening at PG website.

Is it still open?

Shepster

How does a real hitter load/unload his pelvis?

A real hitter, buster. Not talking about those who try but come short by using their arms.

Linear ...this is what you don't get about how discussion groups work. We do care about your thoughts. So why don't you get off the "grader' side and post a few paragraphs about

How Linear thinks you should load the pelvis?

We can read it. THere will likely be some tips I can use there ...I can help my players...so on and so on.

The Ny-man thing is over. That culture is over. He did you guys bad , not in his total teaching, just in how he had people emulate his authoritative arrogance.

It is not becoming and doesn't work for me.

Bob started a great site here and after being a member for 3 years, I’ll tell you the clips I’d like to see the most. Some front views of Barry Bonds, Jim Edmonds and Vladimir Guerrero at their computers corresponding with Linear and Blue Dog during this thread.

Secondly, “How will you teach hitting”?

What would happen if everyone just tried to take what they have learned about hitting and make it less, instead of more, complicated? Are we here to help more coaches help more hitters or to make an Encyclopedia Nimannyca and/or Niman-Webster Dictionary & Thesaurus Online?

Lastly, does more physical strength and less fear of the ball need to be factored in when we compare clips of MLB hitters to those of youth and higher level amateur hitters?

Thanks,

THop

Linear--you always rap others for having a closed mind--look in the mirror pal and stop regurgitating "stuff" from other supposed teaching sites--you only have one way and that is "yours" or should I say your Gurus.

By the way how much you get for your "lessons" in the real world--you know anyone can "teach" in cyberspace

Tim...good post..

I was visiting by phone with a coach in Houston yesterday. We were laughing at ourselves a bit. We decided that you could take one group and teach mechanics and another and teach the mental side of pitch count and looking FB zone and the later might win.

You are correct.. you cannot put a mechanically sound swing on a ball when you are afraid to assume the hitting posture in time to swing.

Again, your right about strength. My next door neighbors 7 yo has a hard time with rotation swinging his game bat without total body strength. He can with a Swiftstik

Furthermore ...the pitches he will be lakely facing for two years will have so much arc on them that he will have to stay on his back foot to get on plane

It all must evolve over time

Hey Swing,

Is your next door neighbor's 7yr old playing slow pitch softball?

Write back soon,
Shep

quote:

Originally posted by swingbuster:
...how he had people emulate his authoritative arrogance...

You poorly define the "attitude". Has little to do with authority. Little to do with arrogance. Has everthing to do with dealing with misinformation and falsehoods and getting rid of them.

I didn't learn it from him. I learned it growing up in a pool hall. It's called "street smarts". It's called "separating truth from fiction and not being afraid to point it out".

Try spouting some bs in the pool hall. You'll get a degree of red a$$ that you'd rather not have.

It's probably the highest form of honesty. Not the most politically correct. Not sugar coated........just not afaid of telling it like it is. Telling someone what he needs to hear v what he wants to hear.....with gusto.

quote:

Hey Swing,

Is your next door neighbor's 7yr old playing slow pitch softball?

Write back soon,
Shep

If he does I will get Linear to teach him to spin

Linear...posture, connect, rotate, and get the bat going backwards.

I know my reading previledges were rovoked on ****** but when I was booted Paul was not mentioning the fourth one. I haven't heard you mention it. Why did Paul write it in his post

Swing,

Disappointed that you think anyone would care about this nonsense.

Maybe if you stuck to the subject - and left out the inane soap opera **** - you would get back on track with your usually very solid suggestions. IMO.

I also think that if you - and whomever else - want to piss all over each other in the continuing moronic "wars" - you should do it on your own bandwidth.

IMO - You guys are starting to treat this place as if it is your own personal playground - with no responsibility to anyone or anything other than your own egos.

I certainly expected more of you.

Very disappointing. IMO


Do us all a favor - elevate the conversation - and teach something.


JMHO

quote:

Originally posted by swingbuster:

Linear...posture, connect, rotate, and get the bat going backwards.

I know my reading previledges were rovoked on ****** but when I was booted Paul was not mentioning the fourth one. I haven't heard you mention it. Why did Paul write it in his post

First of all, what you've quoted is not written in his post. Another misquote. Another dishonest effort on your part.....of course, when your facts don't work your ONLY shot is to shoot the messenger.

Aside from that, that 4th element has been around a long time. I'm guessing 2 maybe 3 years. It is not what you describe. It has nothing to do with the barrel going backwards.....and I bet you've actually heard it before, for quite some time, and are distorting it for your use. More dishonesty.

Has more to do with the knob than the barrel.

But, you won't get your education from me.

quote:

Do us all a favor - elevate the conversation - and teach something

its..

Count my words and count his and see who gives full teaching responses.

Just doing a little back door stickin up for my friend Steve.

I have found a new way to enjoy these forums.

You read anybody's post and guess Linears three word rebuttal and slowly pull the bar down and see how close you get. If he ever gets sick or something he might give me his passwords and I can "keep up the bad work"

Still no denial.

quote:

Still no denial.

Still no denial.

BINGO

ITS

Apologize to board for my role in that nonsense.

Turning over new leaf. Let us get back to the art of how to teach hitting properly at benchmark level of proficiency.

Back to Rotation>BB ITS Linear Bluedog and several other of us came to the conclusion that bottom half rotation is 98% completed at contact. ITS brought up interesting topic we can ponder about the legs and how they contribute to the process of hitting.

I propose the stronger the legs the farther and harder the ball sails upon contact. Any takers?

Shep

Linear ...I honestly think upon reading others post he realized that the bat barrel path generated by hand torque was really important in creating resistance and inside path. After reading what was written about

posture , connect, rotate...he just decided to get ahead of the curve and do the Vasco de Gama and stake claim on upper body mechanics for himself too.

Al Gore invented the internet....why not ?

BOTW..its...I'm "as they say in holdem"...all in on the subject...sorry

posture, connect, rotate maybe but bat going in reverse, naww. Bat should remain stationary during beginning process of uncoiling lower half.

Torque created from strongest legs gets strongest results.

Shep

quote:

bat going in reverse, naww

shep ..you miss that you miss big opportunity to help kids

quote:

Originally posted by swingbuster:
Linear ...I honestly...

You know what they say when the first thing someone says is "honestly"

quote:

...I think upon reading others post he realized that the bat barrel path generated by hand torque was really important in creating resistance and inside path.

"I think"......as in speculate, hope, need, want, desire.....to frame him and his theory this way.

Don't let the facts get in your way.

The following two hitters are synced to toe touch.



In an effort to help you "see" what you can't see I've given you some free advertising.

You know, any ad is better than no ad......even a negative ad.

Charterer and founder of a little league program named after me which has grown to several thousand with 8 fields must be that missed big opportunity that I miss-LOL

Need picture of my name on side of pressbox on main field? Would you like for me to email it to ya? Bloomfield Little League in Macon,Ga

Reference:B.L.Clark who is current president.

Sorry pal, you are very wrong in your analysis/evaluation of the Shepster.

What I miss is the big opportunity to evaluate, recommend and sign worthy HS/College/free-agent pro prospects while getting paid to do so-LOL

Paid my dues with the little kids a long time ago but still not beneath me and do occasionally help kids even now with their baseball.

Shep

Linear

The younger hitter video clip out of uniform is wrapping bat.

Shep

He wraps 380 foot HR as 9th grader...you do that?

Wrapping is breaking down forearm / bat angle less than 90 degrees....don't think so.

The striking part of the barrel will be aligned with the spine at toe touch from a side view on good hitters. That barrel position at toe touch is not wrapping OR all MLB players wrap...you chose

All rotational mechanics accelerate the bat barrel backwards.

Okay, compare bat angles of two hitters linear posted and tell me you can't honestly see the difference in angles.

It is obvious to me but maybe I need glasses.

Shep

This will catch up to him as he progresses to higher levels and better pitching.

He's going to have to shorten it up like the big league hitter does and not even think about flattening the bat in a wrapping fashion.

Remember, performance at the lower levels does not ensure the hitter is ready for the next.

Shep

quote:

analysis/evaluation of the Shepster.

I was evaluating your statement not you....I stand by mine

Linear...what is the lead leg doing on your guy in uniform. Does the lead thigh swing open some after foot plant breaking the foot plant over?

Do any of you keeping this thread lively have any recomendations as to private hitting instructors in the Central Florida area. It seems that most of you guys are big on "power rotational". I (my son)has not been to any instructor who really empisized rotational power. At least not in those words.

quote:

He's going to have to shorten it up like the big league hitter does

Agreed...he is a little long here but he is working off a tee drill station with the ball toss location inside his lead foot post stride.

His head is down and the real hitters foward...this does alter the set up some.

We are comparing a drill station against 88 MPH pitching. They will not be identical I am sure.

Swing

Now I can buy that. You have a taker.

By the way, I really found the posts on this thread on Dec 20 & 21 to be insightful and helpful.

Sincerely,
Shep

Shep,
You have a PM.

floridafan,
Ck your box.
Shep

Shep,
Thanks, Got it!

Hey...Sorry everyone, I didn't mean to shut down the thread! Come on, lets get with it again. I apologise...
How will YOU teach hitting?

BBSCSOUT,

Been thinking and dicussing Brett. Talked with a big kid that hit like Brett and played for Kittrell at U of South Alabama.

Brett is closed which puts the hands inside the line every swing even with no negative move. His bat is flat and he uses flail to turn the shoulders and send the bat in the correct arc getting the bat through the zone. THese guys tend to hit the ball out front and have good power.

This 30 something, ex-college guy outlined how he did it. I recall his HS days and hitting balls people are still talking about.

It really is a different style and I am not a big believer in style...but I must give in here

Steve E quote
"can you create movement which facilitates connecting the momentum path of the bat to the momentum path of the shoulders---such that they very quickly become ONE angular momentum path.

BB

Brett is hitting off tee in not live. Hard to evaluate swing that is not in game situation.

He is definitely wrapping to some extent though which probably attributes to why he was late all the time and most of his hits were to the opposite field throughout his career.

This clip of Bonds simply demonstrates his ability to stay relaxed in his arms prior to the start of rotational movement so that he won't tighten up and contract too soon which will slow bat-speed significantly.

I teach a hitter to develop some kind of methodical rhythm or movement prior to the actual rotation as demonstated by Bonds. If you will notice the batter without a significant hitch gets back to the proper stationary bat position much quicker.

Shep

quote:

Bat should remain stationary during beginning process of uncoiling lower half

In all respect this is at the core of this dicussion. The batters ability to get angular momentum from a stationary position is what IS in question . If this is your opinion then you are right for many hitters and there are many that cannot get the barrel out from stationary beginning

shep

This is a quote from Mankin.... understanding HIS point of view took some time and study for me.....

Keep in mind as you practice, although hip and shoulder rotation is important, the ultimate purpose of all swing mechanics is to rotate the bat-head – first, back toward the catcher. Therefore, as you concentrate on inducing hip rotation, concentrate even more on accelerating the bat-head rearward – this may help you keep everything in sync.