Icing Mechanics/Process

My son has a pitcher's icing "sleeve" that he used to use after throwing.  It is designed specifically for pitching and has a cold pack for both the shoulder and the elbow, with velcro straps that keep everything in the right place.  You keep it in the freezer until needed. Search for "pitchers icing sleeve" and you'll find dozens.  With that said, my son no longer ices after throwing on the advice of his school trainer and the pitching coach.

Just make sure you put something between your skin and the ice bag like a towel or a shirt.  I went through phases of icing my arm but when I did, I would ice the back of my shoulder and the inside part of my elbow.

My son no longer ices.  

He used to get pretty sore after pitching, it would linger for several days.  He no longer does.  He has a post throwing routine he does now instead of icing.  

2017LHP - there are quite a few threads on post pitching icing. There are definitely proponents of the practice, but there are a lot of people who do not advise icing. There are some pretty interesting debates in some of the past threads, if you have time to read through them.

 

My 2018 still ices. He uses an arm sleeve that has slots for ice packs. They are pretty inexpensive at any sporting goods store. I don't think it really does much for him physically, it's basically a mental thing at this point. If it makes him feel better mentally and I don't think it's really doing any harm (it may slow down recovery very slightly), then I don't have a problem with it. The main factor in his recovery are his post-throwing exercises and routines.

 

If the right people see this thread and want to jump in, you may get a good debate on the positives vs. negatives on icing.

Went and read the other thread you mentioned after posting this and it's clear you have read all the past threads. Including the running vs. non-running threads. lol

On a side note, HS varsity coach made the whole team run for 25 minutes after a tournament game this weekend. Heard him talking about the usefulness of flushing lactic acid, especially pitchers. wants them to get aerobic exercise and opposed to anaerobic exercise. Most parents just looked at him like they were totally lost. I "ran" as far away from that discussion as I could.

My original post was an attempt to get an avid icing proponent to describe what their icing process involves.  I am not a fan of icing.  Not a fan of icing simply after an outing. Not a fan of icing if there is some general muscle soreness.  Am a fan if icing if there is pain/injury in which inflamation will likely occur.  I guess my real question is whether there is some level of unavoidable "injury" incurred during most pitching outings such that icing after every outing is appropriate.  If that is the case, is this focused in the joint (elbow, shoulder) as I would assume muscle soreness by itself would certainly not benefit from icing.  As I've seen so many comments about icing not benefiting recovery, I was hoping to get some comments as to when icing is appropriate.  As for the process, I actually think the bucket would work well for the elbow as opposed to a bag of ice or ice pack that cannot envelope the entire joint (in high school we iced our ankles using buckets of ice water).  I see kids wrap a bag of ice to their shoulder and it looks like they are icing a very specific spot on the shoulder and not the entire joint (this would require a 2-3 lb large bag). When I had post-op PT on my shoulder they used really big bags that covered front, back and top of shoulder. 

Surely there has to be one or two avid icers out there.  Was reading one of the posts on Velocity and someone was talking about managing through injury by icing.  I can definitely see how icing was a given 20+ years ago when pain was sort of an acceptable side effect of pitching.  Surely someone has sat there with their elbow in a bucket of ice.  Instead of current icing mechanics, perhaps some of the older folks can share stories of their icing tecnhiques from the early days.

Hopefully they have gotten better. I remember those first coming out when I was a teenager. My parents dropped a huge chunk of cash on it and I felt the coverage was terrible and it was uncomfortable in terms of the frozen parts digging into your arm rather than resting around it.

 

I'm sure everyone is different, but my sister is a physical trainer and she lives by the lactic acid flush after a heavy workout in the gym, though she says all you need is 10 minutes or so on an elliptical. I do that too at the gym and found it helps my body recover faster and makes me less sore the next day. My high school teammate would run after his outings to flush out the lactic acid (but he called it something else). He swore by it, so I would run with him. I thought it worked.

 

My first two years of college, we ran sprints/poles til our d_cks fell off at the end of practice once or twice per week. On the remaining days we ran 2-3 miles on the track, sometimes with stadiums on each lap. Our coach never said it was to flush the lactic acid, I figured it was just for conditioning for the obvious reasons pitchers need their lower bodies to be in shape. But after starts, he would send us behind the outfield fence to run 15-20 minutes, so I am guessing it was for the lactic acid too. On the rare day he felt nice and gave our legs a day off (excluding the days preceding a game/weekend series), I felt I noticed a little more soreness/tightness. Placebo effect? Maybe.

My junior year, I played for a pitching coach who may be one of the smartest baseball minds around. He's a family man who hates travel and being away from his wife and kids, otherwise I would not be surprised if he would have been a major league pitching coach. I know he was approached by several organizations to be a lower-level minor league pitching coach but declined. His philosophy was a lot less running, you did your leg work in the gym at 6am twice per week. We occasionally ran light poles and ran up a hill (forwards and backwards). I thoroughly enjoyed the lack of running, but I noticed I did not recover nearly as quick. Placebo effect? Maybe.

Not sure if I am old enough (33) to fall under the "early days," but I never missed an icing. From age 8 through high school, I would ice after I pitched in a game, be it a start or in relief. In high school, I also iced when I went really hard in throwing a bullpen (ie: if I didn't get to throw that week and needed work), and I always iced for every bullpen before games started, as a precaution. Also being an outfielder, I would ice when I could tell I needed it after a heavy practice of throws to bases, or if some arm soreness and pain came. In college, I iced after every practice that involved anything outside of very easy throwing. Games, bullpens, long toss, flat grounds.

 

I tried the bucket with ice water a few times. It burns, and obviously you are only getting your elbow. As mentioned above, my parents bought me one of those ice arm sleeves, very uncomfortable and the coverage sucked, though they may be improved now. My father would always buy a bag of ice from Circle K and I would use that in ziploc bags and hold it with my off hand. From high school on, and what I think is the best, is going to the trainer after practice (I got my running in first). The little ice chunks that look like rabbit turds are the best. Id load up a bag for the inside of my elbow, load up one for the outside, one for the front of my shoulder, and one for the back. The trainer or a teammate then wraps the ceran wrap around the bags, keeping them snug in place, but not so tight it cuts off the blood flow. I always had a very thin long sleeved shirt that I used as my icing shirt. The ice went over that so it wouldnt burn the skin/make you want to take it off. I usually iced 20-25 minutes and took it off. I think this is the most comfortable and provides the best coverage.

 

There is probably research that doesn't like icing, and there are probably many great pitchers at all levels who don't do it. My dad was old school, you ice, and you wear a jacket between innings and on the base paths. I followed that and they both worked for me. I still had two major arm injuries, but I think those can happen to anyone, and I think mine were caused or at least greatly influenced by a mechanical flaw in my follow through. Up through the first injury (senior year HS), I did not have all of the arm issues my buddies and peers had. I was a tall skinny guy who put a lot of effort into my pitches, I began throwing a breaking ball at 9, and before I stopped throwing it at the advice of a well respected pitching coach, I had a slider from 12-15 that was absolutely filthy but was max effort and he was looking out for my long term health.

If I had a dollar for every baseball person who talks about lactic acid and doesn't have a clue what they're talking about, I could be a rich person. 

Thats awesome

Let's skip the lactic acid discussion altogether.  I'm looking for more stories like RGD's where he gets wrapped up with 4 bags.  Surely there are some folks that maybe had some old school college trainers that required icing despite a kid's reluctance to ice.  Anyone ever had any disagreements escalete with high school or college coaches?  Any stories about icing in 30 degree weather?  Anyone have any experience directly or thorugh son with ice baths (all the rage in NBA) or that freezing chamber (30 below)?

our college coaches both wanted us to ice, but the guys who wouldn't would just walk to the trainers w us and just not put any on. Strongly encouraged but not enforced.

In terms of ice baths, I have taken a couple. Im hard pressed to think of any time a baseball player would take one without it being overkill. Only thing I can think of is maybe a hardcore offseason workout. And by that i mean cross training, plyometrics, weights, sprints, etc, full intensity, all in the same day.  Even then, i dont think it would be worth it cuz they suck, bad. And in that instance, youre in the offseason so its not like you need to bounce back quick for a game or anything

I played basketball in HS, so I can see the demand for that especially after logging 40 plus minutes a night on a consistent basis.

I am not a big proponent of our baseball players icing after games or practices. We do have some who will anyway, but unless they are in pain, I don't encourage it. We had a few kids last year who liked to come in for Game Ready treatments afterwards. The only one I can remember taking an ice bath after a baseball game was our catcher, and that was normally only if they had another game the next day.

 

We had a softball pitcher who would often ice bath the day after a game. After a game, she'd have 4-5 ice bags. One on each knee, the elbow, the shoulder, and sometimes her shin. The catcher was the same sometimes.