Mr. Guthrie,
You make some good points but I can't agree with your declaration that everything goes back to money as you present it.
My older son participated in PG events with his travel team because that's where the best competition was found. He went to PG showcases to see how his talent matched up against the best players in the country. He didn't take the most money offered to him in a college scholarship, instead selecting the college that best matched his academic goals.
His college first saw him play at a PG tournament and never would have heard of him of he wasn't in Georgia that summer. In baseball, I believe there is no such thing as overexposure. The best thing for the player and the colleges/scouts is to be seen and see as much as possible. Making the right college choice is critical for a student-athlete, as there's not much worse than being in a place that you do not belong and having to transfer these days.
TRHits, in his inimitable bluntness, gets it right when he says the kids he wants are the ones who strive continually to improve. Most baseball players work to be great - to be their best - and should want to compete against the best at every opportunity, whether it be in games or showcases.
Tell the best player you coach that he could play in the Major Leagues but he would be paid the same as a new school teacher and have to work for very little money in a place like a hardware store during the offseason to pay his bills. Then ask him if he would take the deal.
If he's a ballplayer, you will immediately see from his answer that it's not all about money.
quote:Originally posted by workinghard:
Ken, I do see where you are emphatic in regards to PG not taking this as a greed or green issue. And, I believe you and also find PG to be true as well.
But let me ask you this, with the high profile organization you coach, is it for the kids or is it ultimately for the money. You yourself stated "Simply pointing out that every decision made ultimately goes back to money at some point.". Now, I'm sure you have another job and make a fine living doing that, but if you are not doing it for free, wouldn't it ultimately come down to money. Not saying you don't have the kids best interest at heart, cause from reading some of your posts, I truly believe you do.
Thinking to myself out loud: I hope I don't get questioned on this post, I left my kids out intentionally.
You certainly make valid points.
All I can share is my specific financial situation with the organization I coach for. I cannot speak for the organization itself.
By now I think you know I'm pretty candid with what I write.
I can promise you that I'd be very surprised if I'm not in the red each year when you compare my earnings vs. expenses.
I probably could post a quick spreadsheet if you'd like, but I'd hope you would trust me when I say my compensation for coaching in the summer is almost insignificant if not a loss.
Baseballdad,
Along with others, your points are valid.
Although I think my statements are being derived into a dislike for PG and what they represent.
Trust me, that is NOT what I'm getting at.
PG, and what they offer, has brought tremendous value to the amateur baseball scene.
PG will tell you the teams and players I've coached have participated in numerous events.
I guess I'll always have a hard time explaining my point to this specific audience. Although I will continue to try. Why? I ask myself the same question.
Let's try this one...
Let's just use an off the wall analogy. Let's say tomorrow everything in amateur baseball went back in time several decades. To where baseball was played in Little League, Pony League, High School, and onto college.
Now we all know that this is a thing of the past...but for one second just follow me here.
So all the venues, leagues, and tournaments as we now them today are gone. The only opportunities for kids to play baseball come from what I list above...
Would college and pro teams still be able to fill their rosters?
Would college and pro scouts still go out to find players?
Would talent eventually be found?
Of course it would. It happened before and it would happen again.
But that isn't reality. I actually realize that if you can believe it.
But my point is that the venues in place now don't solely exist out of the kindness of someones heart. Most organizations don't as well. And the college and pro coaches don't do it for free either.
Heck, PG charges coaches for the rosters at the events I've attended.
It's a business..........period.
To deny it is only a mask for the truth.
Is it a bad thing? Of course not. There is a lot of good that comes from this business.
My point is......hell I forgot what my point is.
The bottom line is I have extreme passion for the game. I'm crazy enough to think I know a little bit about the game and what each level entails both on and off the field.
It's very sad and frustrating for me to watch the game turn into a self promotion of skills versus what the game is supposed to be about.
The constant grasp for "where do we get noticed?", "what is the best showcase?", "who has the best organization?"...etc.
Just play the game.
Play the game in it's original intent.
9 players + substitutes versus another 9 and theirs.
Playing to win each game, each division, each round of the playoffs, each championship. You know, a long term goal that you achieve as a group...as a team.
Enjoying the time off the field with teammates, building relationships with people that will last a lifetime, and learning valuable life lessons along the way.
It's amazing the opportunity when you think about it.
All the rest of it is just details. Insignificant details about where you rank, where you go, what you do, who sees you...
I just know the game offered me so much more than the emphasis that I see here and most of amateur baseball today.
Along with others, your points are valid.
Although I think my statements are being derived into a dislike for PG and what they represent.
Trust me, that is NOT what I'm getting at.
PG, and what they offer, has brought tremendous value to the amateur baseball scene.
PG will tell you the teams and players I've coached have participated in numerous events.
I guess I'll always have a hard time explaining my point to this specific audience. Although I will continue to try. Why? I ask myself the same question.
Let's try this one...
Let's just use an off the wall analogy. Let's say tomorrow everything in amateur baseball went back in time several decades. To where baseball was played in Little League, Pony League, High School, and onto college.
Now we all know that this is a thing of the past...but for one second just follow me here.
So all the venues, leagues, and tournaments as we now them today are gone. The only opportunities for kids to play baseball come from what I list above...
Would college and pro teams still be able to fill their rosters?
Would college and pro scouts still go out to find players?
Would talent eventually be found?
Of course it would. It happened before and it would happen again.
But that isn't reality. I actually realize that if you can believe it.
But my point is that the venues in place now don't solely exist out of the kindness of someones heart. Most organizations don't as well. And the college and pro coaches don't do it for free either.
Heck, PG charges coaches for the rosters at the events I've attended.
It's a business..........period.
To deny it is only a mask for the truth.
Is it a bad thing? Of course not. There is a lot of good that comes from this business.
My point is......hell I forgot what my point is.
The bottom line is I have extreme passion for the game. I'm crazy enough to think I know a little bit about the game and what each level entails both on and off the field.
It's very sad and frustrating for me to watch the game turn into a self promotion of skills versus what the game is supposed to be about.
The constant grasp for "where do we get noticed?", "what is the best showcase?", "who has the best organization?"...etc.
Just play the game.
Play the game in it's original intent.
9 players + substitutes versus another 9 and theirs.
Playing to win each game, each division, each round of the playoffs, each championship. You know, a long term goal that you achieve as a group...as a team.
Enjoying the time off the field with teammates, building relationships with people that will last a lifetime, and learning valuable life lessons along the way.
It's amazing the opportunity when you think about it.
All the rest of it is just details. Insignificant details about where you rank, where you go, what you do, who sees you...
I just know the game offered me so much more than the emphasis that I see here and most of amateur baseball today.
quote:Would college and pro teams still be able to fill their rosters?
Of course they would, because there has always been more players that want it than positions.
quote:Would talent eventually be found?
Of course it would. It happened before and it would happen again.
This means talent was not missed and IMHO is not the truth.
quote:Originally posted by sandlotmom:
This means talent was not missed and IMHO is not the truth.
Talent will always be missed, regardless of era.
quote:Originally posted by Ken Guthrie:
Just play the game.
Play the game in it's original intent.
9 players + substitutes versus another 9 and theirs.
Playing to win each game, each division, each round of the playoffs, each championship. You know, a long term goal that you achieve as a group...as a team.
Enjoying the time off the field with teammates, building relationships with people that will last a lifetime, and learning valuable life lessons along the way.
It's amazing the opportunity when you think about it.
All the rest of it is just details.
Nice!!!! Good job.