illegal substitution/ protest

He's not an illegal substitute unless he has already been in the game or some other action has made him ineligible. He is an un-announced substitute. He does not have to be listed on the line up. There is a POE this year that states that all subs must be listed however there is no penalty if a coach fails to do so(that's nuts, I know). The player entered the game when he took his place on the pitcher’s mound and the ball was put in play.

The protest will not be upheld. Nothing changes during the game because a protest has been lodged.

quote:

Originally posted by Forest Ump:
There is a POE this year that states that all subs must be listed however there is no penalty if a coach fails to do so(that's nuts, I know).

I've said it before, but I think this rule is transitioning to be similar to softball's roster rule. However, instead of adding it immediately, they're giving coaches a year or two to get used to it.

quote:

Originally posted by cabbagedad:
California HS
Team A puts in a new pitcher in top of 4th. Team B doesn't have him on the submitted roster but doesn't do anything yet...

What should happen regarding protest? What should have happened at the game regarding the player?

A. The player is not an illegal substitute. (3-1-1)
B. The protest should be denied.
C. The player should have, as he did, continue to play.

Thanks guys.

Cabbaagedad, as with any filed protest, the ruling or decision on "the ruling" does not get made right on the spot.

That is why the protest process exists, the umpire makes a ruling and a team thinks the ruling is in conflict with the rules, if they can't come to an agreement on the field file the protest and play on.

Ever see a friendly sandlot game end because an agreement couldn't be reached on a call? I'm pretty sure that's where the term "I'm taking my ball and going home" originated..

Well baseball has fixed that and quite effectively IMO. We ain't gonna argue, kick nor scream nor rant, nor rave, we are gonna agree to dissagree and play on and let some cooler heads figure it out tomorrow.

The protest goes to what ever protest channels your league/state has in place.

The decision to uphold or deny hinges on many things, and can take different shapes.

For example if the team protesting goes on to win the game the protest won't be upheld. That is we aren't coming back to re-play. Yet the umpire may be chastised and taught the correct ruling had he messed it up (not the case in the OP by the way).

If the play or in this case the player participation had no bearing on the final score it'll be denied regardless of who won.

The protest is what gets the ball rolling if you will. The protest is noted in the scorebook and should the protest be upheld, then play resumes at the exact spot in the game the decision by the umpire was made with the correction/s if any.

quote:

Originally posted by jjk:
Well baseball has fixed that and quite effectively IMO. We ain't gonna argue, kick nor scream nor rant, nor rave, we are gonna agree to dissagree and play on and let some cooler heads figure it out tomorrow.

The protest goes to what ever protest channels your league/state has in place.

The decision to uphold or deny hinges on many things, and can take different shapes.

In Missouri high school baseball, a protesting coach has 10 minutes to find the applicable rule, case play, or state-approved documentation to prove the umpires were incorrect. If he can't find it in the 10 minutes, the protest is denied and the game continues. If he can, the call is fixed on the spot.

quote:

The protest goes to what ever protest channels your league/state has in place.

Good thing I threw in that disclaimer.

Missouri sounds like one of those "no protest states" to me.

So either you have very well versed coaches or lots of perfect umpires, sounds like heaven..

So, an improper ruling is made, coach wastes 10 minutes looking, can't find it, left it on the bus, or forgot it, or umpire still disagrees.

How does it ever get fixed should the umpire actually be incorrect?

quote:

Originally posted by jjk:
So, an improper ruling is made, coach wastes 10 minutes looking, can't find it, left it on the bus, or forgot it, or umpire still disagrees.

How does it ever get fixed should the umpire actually be incorrect?

I would hope the coach is smart enough to have his book near him. If not, tick tick tick.

If the umpire still disagrees, even with full proof he was wrong, the game continues with the protest being denied. After that, I guess the coach could file a report with the state, giving details of the incident. The state won't change the outcome of the game, but the official, I suppose, could be suspended.

I prefer to think I'm perfect.

quote:

Originally posted by yawetag:

quote:

Originally posted by jjk:
So, an improper ruling is made, coach wastes 10 minutes looking, can't find it, left it on the bus, or forgot it, or umpire still disagrees.

How does it ever get fixed should the umpire actually be incorrect?

I would hope the coach is smart enough to have his book near him. If not, tick tick tick.

If the umpire still disagrees, even with full proof he was wrong, the game continues with the protest being denied. After that, I guess the coach could file a report with the state, giving details of the incident. The state won't change the outcome of the game, but the official, I suppose, could be suspended.

I prefer to think I'm perfect.

Well "I am" perfect and I can't find anything wrong with ya ;')

But this'll never work in Wa. where, if a coach breaks out a rule book on the field, he's gone..

I actually witnessed this at a 15's State BR tourny!

quote:

Originally posted by jjk:
But this'll never work in Wa. where, if a coach breaks out a rule book on the field, he's gone..

Well, if a coach just runs to the field with a rule book, he's gone, too. He has to state he's protesting the incident and THEN get the books out.