Importance of Age vs Grade in HS

Currently my wife homeschools my son and has since he was 5 yrs old.

He could go into 9th grade next year and would be 14 yrs old at that time but I plan to wait until he is 15 to enter him into 9th grade to give him another year to grow physically and to grow in maturity.

With my current plan he would be 18 when he graduates but turn 19 in the summer.

Tradosaurus,
Sounds like baseball is more important to you then challenging him academically. My son won't turn 19 until Spring of his freshman year in college yet he will still be able to play.
What will he do for the year he isn't going to be a 9th grader? How do you intend to keep him engaged in learning if he isn't challenged? Perhaps I am missing part of the equation and the extra year will benefit him to catch up rather then just squeeze ahead, if so, sorry I do not mean to offend. I simply object to people holding kids back so late in an attempt to micro manage sports at the expense of academics.

I never met anyone who was sorry they gave their child and extra year. I have met many that considered it - chose not to wait the extra year - and regret it later.

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Originally posted by calisportsfan:
Tradosaurus,
Sounds like baseball is more important to you then challenging him academically. My son won't turn 19 until Spring of his freshman year in college yet he will still be able to play.
What will he do for the year he isn't going to be a 9th grader? How do you intend to keep him engaged in learning if he isn't challenged? Perhaps I am missing part of the equation and the extra year will benefit him to catch up rather then just squeeze ahead, if so, sorry I do not mean to offend. I simply object to people holding kids back so late in an attempt to micro manage sports at the expense of academics.

Our homeschooling curriculum will certainly challenge my son until he hits high school.

I'm more afraid, based on my 2 older sons that went through the public high schools, that he won't be challenged academically once he gets in to the public school.

Also he has the perfect birthday month (July).

Interesting article! Wonder how the author would classify the HS player who would be too old to play school ball his senior year, so classes are arranged to graduate HS after his junior year? Several players are in that age situation locally, with one, it would not surprise many many baseball faithful if he skipped his senior year & was drafted very high come June 2013. Graduating HS early, seems to be much more common... at least publicized with "older" HS baseball players.

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Originally posted by YesReally:
I never met anyone who was sorry they gave their child and extra year. I have met many that considered it - chose not to wait the extra year - and regret it later.

This so true. Not only athletically but academically, socialy and leadership wise. Our first child, a daughter, was born in May, 1991, and we delayed her starting school. Our church had a wonderful pre school program called a "time to grow" and she did that program followed by full day Kindergarten the next year. When #2 came along in April of 1991 we did the exact same thing. Both have been well served by the extra year. The athletic advantages, which at the time were never even thought of, were just a by product of it. He always played age appropriate club baseball until this past year when our club team organizes the older teams by graduation year for recruiting reasons. In other pre high school sports (football/basketball) that were played by grade year he did have a signifcant advantage, particularly in the middle school years. Next year, when he'll turn 19 in April, he should be in a good position to make a difference.

Delaying school at kindergarten age is one thing. That's a maturity thing. By time they're in the 2nd or 3rd grade, they're all about the same anyway. Holding back a HS kid one year for baseball is just so wrong and selfish. If the kid is making the grade, then it's pointless and is only being done to gain some athletic edge. Suppose you hold back a HS age kid and a kid from a lower grade who plays same position is a stud, then what?

Each parent has to decide what is best physically, emotionally, academically and athletically for their kid. With a spring birthday my son was often more than a year younger than some of his classmates. It didn't make him any less intelligent or athletic.

I can not speak to the advantages/disadvantages for hitters but I can speak to these things for pitchers. You have a big advantage if you are older because each year usually adds a couple of mph to fastball velocity. My son graduaded from HS at age 17 (turned 18 in July). When he turned 19 he was going into his sophmore year in college. His fastball velocity had changed from HS - 88/89 peak 90/91 to 2nd yera of college - 91/92 peak 93/94. While we have no regrets, had he been turning 19 the year he finished HS he would very likely have been a high draft pick out of HS. Hard to say how that would have turned out?

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Originally posted by zombywoof:
Delaying school at kindergarten age is one thing. That's a maturity thing. By time they're in the 2nd or 3rd grade, they're all about the same anyway. Holding back a HS kid one year for baseball is just so wrong and selfish. If the kid is making the grade, then it's pointless and is only being done to gain some athletic edge. Suppose you hold back a HS age kid and a kid from a lower grade who plays same position is a stud, then what?

You didn't prove that holding a kid back one year is wrong and selfish. That's your opinion.

What's wrong with gaining an athletic edge? If one year meant a difference between my kid getting a free ride at a Div 1A college versus a junior college it would be selfish not to hold him back.

Although both my older sons received academic scholarships that covered virtually all of their college expenses: one at a private university and the other at a Div 1A college.

Like most things in family decisions, this one depends upon circumstances unique to each family.

Our boy has a July birthday and I wanted to have him start school so that he would not be one of the youngest, but Mom prevailed and he will graduate before turning 18, God willing. Not a battle worth fighting because he will more than hold his own athletically and academically. My preference was to hold him back because it seems that everyone who does such a thing is glad they did.

Our oldest (girl) is scheduled to graduate at age 16. She is a freshman at a good college prep school taking honors in every class that offers it. No sports, but she does well in speech & debate.

Every situation is different.

To each his own as long as it is not a burden on others.

While many make the decision before children start school, in our area more and more folks are opting for a year between 8th and 9th grade being spent in home school or private school. Not for everyone - but my earlier comment stands in this situation. An extra year of maturity never hurt anyone on or off the field.

Let's be honest though, it puts others who have gone through the school systems at a very late in the game disadvantage. If you choose to start your child late that's one thing but in my opinion to hold him back at 8th grade to gain a sporting advantage is sort of like getting 4 outs an inning while the other team plays with 3. Were you in public schools you would not be allowed to make that choice for a child doing well in school and there is a reason for that.

I think you thought about this a little late. It's a very calculated move the way you have described it here. You may help him get the advantage in sports but is that the example you want to set? You won't make a lot of friends when people know your story. I have heard of others trying to hold kids back in high school for just that reason and it's never told in a complimentary sense. Let him compete and see if he can stand on his own like the rest of the kids. There comes a time when parent must stop manipulating their kids environments. Do you coach his team?

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I think you thought about this a little late. It's a very calculated move the way you have described it here. You may help him get the advantage in sports but is that the example you want to set? You won't make a lot of friends when people know your story. I have heard of others trying to hold kids back in high school for just that reason and it's never told in a complimentary sense. Let him compete and see if he can stand on his own like the rest of the kids. There comes a time when parent must stop manipulating their kids environments. Do you coach his team

This is exactly the way I see it. Helicopter parents manipulating their kids years in school just so they can gain some artificial edge in sports when academics is the primary reason kids go to school. While I'm not going to tell how parents how to raise their kids, to hold a kid back when academically they can handle the work is selfish and not letting a kid run his/her natural course and learn to grow on their own. What kid in their right mind wants to repeat a grade they have no business repeating. It boils down to insecurity of the parents that their kids don't have what it takes to compete with kids their age. They're calculating how big the kid will be each year to justify holding them back.

But hey, to each their own.

I like to think of it as setting my kid up for success!

As I told my son, when you are 30 yrs old you won't care that you graduated high school at 17 or 18 but you will care if you didn't get the maximum opportunity to make the most of the window of opportunity (which is probably from ages 15-18).

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Originally posted by tradosaurus:
I like to think of it as setting my kid up for success!

As I told my son, when you are 30 yrs old you won't care that you graduated high school at 17 or 18 but you will care if you didn't get the maximum opportunity to make the most of the window of opportunity (which is probably from ages 15-18).

You are right. In the end, all that matters is as parents, we do what we think is best for our kids.

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Our oldest (girl) is scheduled to graduate at age 16. She is a freshman at a good college prep school taking honors in every class that offers it. No sports, but she does well in speech & debate.

Girls mature sooner, both physically and emotionally. Therefore their age at graduation is less consequential. My daughter was seveenteen when she graduated. She verballed before her junior season of softball. It's very normal in girl's sports.

Based on what I have seen in physical development one year can make a huge difference in some kids. By the time someone reads this here it is too late…. To have a real impact CADad you need to go post this at PSBBW..... (Pre-School Baseball Web)

So what do you think of a player that will turn 20 a month after he graduates HS but can hit like crazy and has a cannon for a arm? Clearly has D1 skills but cannot pass a class.

Does he get recruited?

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Originally posted by Thurm:
So what do you think of a player that will turn 20 a month after he graduates HS but can hit like crazy and has a cannon for a arm? Clearly has D1 skills but cannot pass a class.

Does he get recruited?

Kid like this will likely accept a relatively low draft bid to avoid school.

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Originally posted by Thurm:
So what do you think of a player that will turn 20 a month after he graduates HS but can hit like crazy and has a cannon for a arm? Clearly has D1 skills but cannot pass a class.

Does he get recruited?

I think the BOSS wrote a song about him

Sorry, if he clearly has D1 skills, my uneducated guess is he might get a draft shot of some sort or take a shot at pro tryouts??

Great song - sad story!

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Originally posted by RJM:

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Our oldest (girl) is scheduled to graduate at age 16. She is a freshman at a good college prep school taking honors in every class that offers it. No sports, but she does well in speech & debate.

Girls mature sooner, both physically and emotionally. Therefore their age at graduation is less consequential. My daughter was seveenteen when she graduated. She verballed before her junior season of softball. It's very normal in girl's sports.

Yeah, girls develop sooner so they can start bearing children and take care of the household. 200 years ago it wasn't uncommon for girls to wed and start having kids by the time they were 15.

If girls need to develop to take care of the household, don't boys need to develop to hunt the mastadons?

Tradosauras,
Wow, I hope you don't have daughters. Mine is capable of much more then bearing children and cleaning house.

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Originally posted by calisportsfan:
Tradosauras,
Wow, I hope you don't have daughters. Mine is capable of much more then bearing children and cleaning house.

I have five daughters and yes mothers and housewives are very important these days. I know because my wife is an integral part in raising 9 kids.
The problem is kids are neglected because mommy has to go work to pay for the toys that aren't needed. Or mommy gets "hit upon" at work and then the kid(s) go through a nasty divorce. That what daughters who are taught to go earn a living will experience: the meat market.
To each his own but in my experience the "Leave it to Beaver" family really does work.

Again Wow, a real live unapologetic sexist.

You are incredibly offensive.

Men in the work force never fall for temptation right, it's just women who should stay home and stick to getting the dirt out of those white baseball pants. Honestly, you raise your daughters to be housewives but you don't know who they will marry and let's hope you don't raise their husbands. Odds are with 5 daughters several will marry a man that strays and your daughters won't have the tools to stand up for themselves.

I really understand the dinosaur reference now!

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Originally posted by tradosaurus:

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Originally posted by calisportsfan:
Tradosauras,
Wow, I hope you don't have daughters. Mine is capable of much more then bearing children and cleaning house.

I have five daughters and yes mothers and housewives are very important these days. I know because my wife is an integral part in raising 9 kids.
The problem is kids are neglected because mommy has to go work to pay for the toys that aren't needed. Or mommy gets "hit upon" at work and then the kid(s) go through a nasty divorce. That what daughters who are taught to go earn a living will experience: the meat market.
To each his own but in my experience the "Leave it to Beaver" family really does work.

Wow! We both worked once both kids were in school all day. She worked part time before that. Both kids have been taught to become self sufficient. I wouldn't want my daughter to be in a situation where she needs a man to support her financially. If they both do well they make a great team.

Ultimately getting divorced had nothing to do with the ex working and getting hit on. She got hit on all her life. Even with a wedding ring when she was married.

Trad - do you realize that "Leave it to Beaver" was not a documentary?

I'll try to post here without disrupting the flow:

My son is an October birthday, so he just turned 18 yesterday, but is in the right spot for him academically but probably a year behind where he could be from a baseball perspective. If he was playing D-1 baseball this year, he'd be properly challenged. He's probably spot on academically but a year late from the sports perspective.

My daughter was born in mid August, which around these parts means she's basically a year ahead of her class. For her to have been held back would've been a sin as she's in all honors classes and excelling. To think of her being a freshman now, she'd be totally bored academically and probably bored out of her mind.

From a sports perspective, she's probably a year behind where she should be. She developed academically much sooner than she developed from a sports / competitive / social perspective, so she's catching up in all those areas.

It all depends on the child's development and what you're trying to get out of "life".

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Originally posted by calisportsfan:
Again Wow, a real live unapologetic sexist.

Funny Tradosaurus I am able to do it all. Yes, I am a single working mom who is the sole support of my household and raising three bright, successful kids who don't lack for love or support from me. Additionally, I don't let em have a drink cause it's the easy way out. You are incredibly offensive.

Men in the work force never fall for temptation right, it's just women who should stay home and stick to getting the dirt out of those white baseball pants. Honestly, you raise your daughters to be housewives but you don't know who they will marry and let's hope you don't raise their husbands. Odds are with 5 daughters several will marry a man that strays and your daughters won't have the tools to stand up for themselves.

I really understand the dinosaur reference now!

Well your divorced lifestyle is incredibly offensive to me so I guess that makes us even?

Actually my wife is raising my daughters to be one of the few, the proud, the housewife. I'm sorry you feel that a woman who stays home and takes care of the kids is wrong. I wonder how this country survived all these years with housewives?

My (sr.) son missed the grade cut off by 1 day. Back in kindergarten, we certainly had no idea he would be an athelete. He was big and bright and has remained so throughout school. He will start college at 17. he's gained 8 mph on his fastball this year, so yes, in some ways we are kicking ourselves for not "holding him back". If he was a jr. and gained anything close to even 5 mph his senior year, there would be some incredible opportunities, no doubt. But if everyone held to the same age limits it wouldn't be such an issue.

It's strange, we moved from the Northeast when he was little, and the trend was to skip a grade if they were "gifted", to Florida where everyone was holding kids back for "athletic and maturity issues." (Really... athletic at age 4 or 5??) My youngest is 12 and has 14 year olds in his class...huge differences in size among other things. I don't agree with the reasoning to hold kids back unless there is a true academic challenge. It puts the kids who stood by the normal standards at a disadvantage in many ways.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Sunpitch:
But if everyone held to the same age limits it wouldn't be such an issue.

It's strange, we moved from the Northeast when he was little, and the trend was to skip a grade if they were "gifted", to Florida where everyone was holding kids back for "athletic and maturity issues." (Really... athletic at age 4 or 5??) QUOTE]

I think the whole "holding a kid back for sports" is simply not helping the child. If you hold them back for acedemics because they're behind that is one thing. But to hold a kid back in JR. High for sports is just wishful thinking on the parents part.

I'll step on my soap box now:
Every student in this country needs to grow up, get a college degree in a field that provides an opportunity to make some bucks and grow our economy. I tell my own, I'm not approving a major that doesn't result in paying job.

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Originally posted by JMoff: Every student in this country needs to grow up, get a college degree in a field that provides an opportunity to make some bucks and grow our economy. I tell my own, I'm not approving a major that doesn't result in paying job.

I talking to one of the whiners at Occupy Boston. He thought he was entitled to a job. I asked about his major. He told me it's a BA in Philosopy. I asked if Socrates or Plato retired leaving an opening. I told him a BA in Philosophy is Latin for "Would you like fries with your order?" Then in a realistic tone I told him he has no choice but to get a useful grad degree.

If anyone has been by an Occupy location and talked to some of the kids in their 20's you know how unrealistic and utopian this kids are. And those are the smart ones. As the weather has turned cold they've gone home leaving behind the radicals, drug dealers and sixty year old hippies. There may be one hundred tents. But there were only about fifty people there.

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Originally posted by RJM:
... As the weather has turned cold they've gone home leaving behind the ... sixty year old hippies. There may be one hundred tents. But there were only about fifty people there.

Boy, times have changed. The hippies I knew, you'd have 100 hippies and 50 tents. And maybe a few large group tents. And maybe a few roofs melting...
Dude, what forum and I in, anyway?

From a baseball standpoint only..I sure would have liked to have held my son back one or even two years. This really hit home when we recently found out that some kid he was playing with wa a full two years older than he was and had been getting plenty of attention from both major universities and pro scouts.

My son is halfway thru his second year of College at age 19, the age most of his fellow high school teammates were at H.S.graduation.

He is a much bigger, faster, stronger and BETTER baseball player than he was when he graduated high school and or when he was recruited the summer of his Junior year.

Studies have been done, books have been written, the advantage of being older is well documented. I'm fairly confident that being held back, for whatever reason, would not have harmed in any way. We didn't go that route but I have often questioned how wise it may have been, athletically.

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Originally posted by RJM:

quote:

Originally posted by JMoff: Every student in this country needs to grow up, get a college degree in a field that provides an opportunity to make some bucks and grow our economy. I tell my own, I'm not approving a major that doesn't result in paying job.

I talking to one of the whiners at Occupy Boston. He thought he was entitled to a job. I asked about his major. He told me it's a BA in Philosopy. I asked if Socrates or Plato retired leaving an opening. I told him a BA in Philosophy is Latin for "Would you like fries with your order?" Then in a realistic tone I told him he has no choice but to get a useful grad degree.

If anyone has been by an Occupy location and talked to some of the kids in their 20's you know how unrealistic and utopian this kids are. And those are the smart ones. As the weather has turned cold they've gone home leaving behind the radicals, drug dealers and sixty year old hippies. There may be one hundred tents. But there were only about fifty people there.

Well it proves that "getting an education" is way overrated. As an engineer I graduated an educated idiot and didn't really learn anything until years on the job.
I think we need more plumbers, electricians, and A/C techs but that would beneath most parents to encourage their kids this route.
Based on my experience with the public school system (my 2 oldest sons went through public high school) I would guess 75% of kids shouldn't be going to college.

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Originally posted by Prime9:
My son is halfway thru his second year of College at age 19, the age most of his fellow high school teammates were at H.S.graduation.

He is a much bigger, faster, stronger and BETTER baseball player than he was when he graduated high school and or when he was recruited the summer of his Junior year.

Studies have been done, books have been written, the advantage of being older is well documented. I'm fairly confident that being held back, for whatever reason, would not have harmed in any way. We didn't go that route but I have often questioned how wise it may have been, athletically.

I think for boys turning into men that 1 year can make a huge difference physically and mentally. Looking back at my life I wish I graduated at 18 instead of 17 as I added 30 pounds and 2 inches of height in 1 year.