Infield Fly

Coach,
The NFHS Casebook has a number of situations regarding infield flies. This one answers (mostly) your question:

7.4.1 SITUATION G: With R1 on second and R2 on first and one out, B4 hits a high fly to second base which could have been caught by F4. Neither umpire declares “infield fly.” F4 unintentionally drops the ball but picks it up and tags R2 who is off the base. RULING: The half-inning is over as R2’s out is the third out. The infield fly out for the second out holds even though it was not declared. The situation determines the out, not the declaration. The umpires should always declare “Infield Fly, Batter Out If Fair” to lessen any confusion.

So do umpire HAVE to declare IFFs? No, but as you can see above, it is a mistake if they don't. On the other hand they don't have to run poles after the game if they fail to do so!

Umpires are supposed to declare the IF if they feel it is applicable. With a strong wind they not feel it is in effect, but if they do then they should declare. If it is near a line then they should declare IF if fair. I'm sure you realize that is where the ball is and not the position of the fielder, but that you mention it simply to explain the proximity of the ball to the foul line.
When you went out to the pitcher the BU shouldn't be talking to you about your visit in any manner, that is the PU's job. Now if you took that chance to take a potshot at him about the IF then that would certainly bring about the response he gave. However I think that might still been a little strong on his part.
It sounds as though there may have been a little more to the story than we are getting.

Thanks guys - that helps a lot.

MST there is a little more to the story and I am at fault to a degree.

We had the same two umps two days before when we were playing the number 3 ranked team in SC while we were in SC on spring break. My pitcher was pretty much dominating them and we were up 4 - 1 in the top of the 7th (we were home). Same pitcher the whole game and he had maybe one base on balls through six innings. Well the top of the 7th he couldn't throw a strike but he wasn't missing. Corners not called, curves not called and he had three walks in that inning alone.

Now I know you are getting only my side of the story and I understand if you take what I say with a grain of salt because I would. The strike zone really shifted in the 7th and we got beat in the 8th inning.

Two days later we are playing a team from NC and I doubt we get 10% of the curves thrown called for a strike. I start barking from the dugout and then the pop up on the IF and neither one says anything.

I put a freshman into pitch after we are down like eight runs (maybe more) and he's not doing bad but some close pitches don't go our way. He's getting visibly rattled so I go to talk to him. I get out there and say two or three things then the field ump comes over to tell me to get off the field.

This finally ticked me off I just asked him about the IFF because I thought it was poor mechanics and technique on their part so I brought it up.

I guess me asking him about it was my way of getting back at him. He never said anything like you guys said about the ruling. He said it was obviously foul so no point in calling it.

I understand with a strong wind - especially if it's a swirling - but this was a steady breeze blowing towards the field. A little stronger and it might have pushed the ball back into fair territory.

In all honesty my complaining would just have benefitted the other team's offense but I was ticked at the ump from two nights before.

I never should have said anything and didn't during the game against the SC team in the 7th.

I can understand your frustration and if the zone did change in the seventh then that's BS. Umpires are supposed to be impartial and should conduct themselves with professionalism at all times. If the BU jumped you as you say then he certainly is out of line. One, it's not his job. Two, even if it was he should something like" are you sticking with him" or something to tell you move it along. In reality it's the PU's job and the BU should stay out of it. Can I assume he was the PU from the previous game?

When there is a conference at the mound, BU should RUN to the outfield (same place he should be between innings). It is PU's responsibility to terminate the conference. BU sounds like a reda$$ to me.

No they were in the same place as two nights before. The plate umpire never acknowledged me at anytime - before I started barking and after I started barking. In fact in both games there were times I went to the mound and called time loudly and neither one said anything. I finally was at the line asking for time so I could go switch pitchers. This was before I started barking. I don't know if they were oblivious to my asking for time or if they were felt good about themselves. This didn't help my mood any to be honest.

The plate ump just took my barking and I guess the field ump felt it was his duty to take up for his partner or something. He did a pretty good job in the field in my opinion. There were some close plays when we were on offense that didn't go our way but it was that way when the other team was on offense - no problem with that.

I'm not saying the plate ump cheated or shifted the zone on purpose because there were some plays we should have made or basehits to drive runners that we didn't make. I just thought it was curious neither one said "IFF if Fair".

quote:

When there is a conference at the mound, BU should RUN to the outfield (same place he should be between innings). It is PU's responsibility to terminate the conference. BU sounds like a reda$$ to me.

Agreed 100%

And in my chapters there would be a serious post game discussion if you stuck your nose into the PU's business......

Run to your position and stay there...the Pitcher and catcher and anything procedural with them belongs to the PU.

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Originally posted by coach2709:
No they were in the same place as two nights before. The plate umpire never acknowledged me at anytime - before I started barking and after I started barking.... This was before I started barking. ....The plate ump just took my barking .

Do you see a common thread of juvenile behavior here? Where under the rules of proper sportsmanship do you believe you have attained an constitutional right to "bark" like an inane fool to the officials?

You got ignored and you're peed off about it? You had best praise Allah you didn't bark yourself into the parking lot and on your way home which would have been the just and righteous thing to do with you, Mr. Dog.

Woof.

I'm not trying to be a smartalic here or anything. I would suggest every high school coach doing this.
I would suggest that you take a few weekends this summer and umpire some youth games or tournament ball. You seem to have a great desire to understand baseball from an umpire's view. This is a good thing. Reading the rule book from an umpire's view and having to make calls on the field will help. Just a suggestion. Again, I think every coach should do this, or at least those who really care.

ALLKNOWING or is it allnot knowing?--I am not quite sure from your inane posts to date
What does Allah have to do with baseball?

WOOF---what is your agenda pal--I understand you have one everytime you come on a new board

By the way barking at an ump is part of the game and most umps don't ignore and they bark back

By the way coach I have one for you---yesterday in a college game the batter squares to bunt and it was questionable as to whether or not he offered--I myself wasnt too sure---the third base coach walks down very quietly to request the home plate ump to ask for help from a base ump---he gets within 10 feet of home plate, has not said a word yet and the plate umpire, he did have a Napoleanic Complex , yells at the coach "get back in your box"---real cool--right GARTH???


You just gotta love the men in blue---most of them think the uniform gives the eternal power

quote:

Originally posted by Jeff Connell:
I'm not trying to be a smartalic here or anything. I would suggest every high school coach doing this.
I would suggest that you take a few weekends this summer and umpire some youth games or tournament ball. You seem to have a great desire to understand baseball from an umpire's view. This is a good thing. Reading the rule book from an umpire's view and having to make calls on the field will help. Just a suggestion. Again, I think every coach should do this, or at least those who really care.

You bet they should and the chances are zilch. They wouldn't stoop so low to become in service of the game as we do. Nope, once they "come down to our level" then they are commoners just like us. Screw the facts that you can learn so much more about the game from the officials' perspective, they just want to make sure they have someone on the totem pole they believe (not that we are) is a notch or two below them.

quote:

Originally posted by TRhit:
ALLKNOWING or is it allnot knowing?--I am not quite sure from your inane posts to date
What does Allah have to do with baseball?

Call me when you get both answers.

quote:

WOOF---what is your agenda pal--I understand you have one everytime you come on a new board.

I'm not your pallie and you have what as proof of the latter?

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By the way barking at an ump is part of the game and most umps don't ignore and they bark back

Idiot umpires abound, they argue back like idiot coaches who think it's "part of the game".

quote:

By the way coach I have one for you---yesterday in a college game the batter squares to bunt and it was questionable as to whether or not he offered--I myself wasnt too sure---the third base coach walks down very quietly to request the home plate ump to ask for help from a base ump---he gets within 10 feet of home plate, has not said a word yet and the plate umpire, he did have a Napoleanic Complex , yells at the coach "get back in your box"---real cool--right GARTH???

Have coached for decades, don't now. Real cool? Real stupid is more like it.

quote:

You just gotta love the men in blue---most of them think the uniform gives the eternal power

Couldn't agree more, most umpires I know are insecure little boys who like RAT coaches with the same afflictions, spend way too much time measuting their ***** lengths.