@RJM posted:I remember how cool it was to be a freshman and away at college. These were big moments ... orientation cookout, first time walking across campus as a student thinking I was grown up, first classes, etc. I feel sorry for kids missing out on this.
😢
@CTbballDad posted:Sorry for you and your son, but I think you're being too kind in giving JHU credit. My take is they, and other schools, delayed so long intentionally, so families have very little choice to look elsewhere.
This ^^^
My 2020 son has a summer teammate who is an incoming freshman at JH. Told my son him and some other incoming were taking a gap year.
Ok Chico...... Holy Cross just pulled the bait and switch too. My daughter literally just picked her dorm room on Thursday, they've had my money since early July and an email just came saying no kids on campus. I need to use the 24 hour rule but I am on tilt..... I am going to be asking for tuition at the same rates as on line summer classes - which will be a 50% reduction. So I will not be an empty nester in a few weeks. Holy Cross totally pulled the switch......
Waiting for a NESCAC school to take this leap of online for the fall.
@Gunner Mack Jr. posted:Ok Chico...... Holy Cross just pulled the bait and switch too. My daughter literally just picked her dorm room on Thursday, they've had my money since early July and an email just came saying on kids on campus. I need to use the 24 hour rule but I am on tilt..... I am going to be asking for tuition at the same rates as on line summer classes - which will be a 50% reduction. So I will not be an empty nester in a few weeks. Holy Cross totally pulled the switch......
Princeton same deal. Reversed to on-line only this weekend. Why now? What changed? If anything the conditions in NJ improved month over month over the Summer.
@Gunner Mack Jr. posted:Ok Chico...... Holy Cross just pulled the bait and switch too. My daughter literally just picked her dorm room on Thursday, they've had my money since early July and an email just came saying on kids on campus. I need to use the 24 hour rule but I am on tilt..... I am going to be asking for tuition at the same rates as on line summer classes - which will be a 50% reduction. So I will not be an empty nester in a few weeks. Holy Cross totally pulled the switch......
I'm sorry for you and your daughter, Gunner.
At this point, my son is leaning toward taking a gap year. He only has a few more days to decide.
I'm not sure what he should do. No question that freshman-year-from-home is going to be substandard (even at a 10% tuition discount). On the other hand, in 2020-21 a record number of college students taking time off is going to meet with a record low number of employment and internship opportunities (plus essentially no travel options). I think the next 12 months will largely be a lost year if my son doesn't start college. But maybe that price is worth it in hopes of a more normal 2021-22 freshman year?
For now, my daughter's school is still planning to have students back on campus in 2 weeks.
Meanwhile, Forbes says 20% of Harvard freshmen are deferring admission for a year, and only 25% are opting to live on campus:
@Chico Escuela posted:I'm sorry for you and your daughter, Gunner.
At this point, my son is leaning toward taking a gap year. He only has a few more days to decide.
I'm not sure what he should do. No question that freshman-year-from-home is going to be substandard (even at a 10% tuition discount). On the other hand, in 2020-21 a record number of college students taking time off is going to meet with a record low number of employment and internship opportunities (plus essentially no travel options). I think the next 12 months will largely be a lost year if my son doesn't start college. But maybe that price is worth it in hopes of a more normal 2021-22 freshman year?
For now, my daughter's school is still planning to have students back on campus in 2 weeks.
Meanwhile, Forbes says 20% of Harvard freshmen are deferring admission for a year, and only 25% are opting to live on campus:
August 20th, 1pm.... that's my son's move in date. I hope that holds up..... I did see/post the Forbes article too. Neither of mine will take a gap year but I am so frustrated with Holy Cross that I am talking to my daughter about transferring..
@Gov posted:Waiting for a NESCAC school to take this leap of online for the fall.
With UMass-Amherst going all-online, one obvious candidate comes to mind...
And for schools that already are only inviting part of the student body back, the decision might be easier. Hopkins was inviting all students on campus.
@Wechson posted:Princeton same deal. Reversed to on-line only this weekend. Why now? What changed? If anything the conditions in NJ improved month over month over the Summer.
Exactly. What has changed? Things have gotten better up here. Now ask yourself what will change by January. Three things can change.
1. Vaccine - prob will be one but not for wide disty to students and healthy teachers (or college employees)
2. Election - will take the heat down a few notches for sure
3. Herd Immunity - prob too quick for that but I think we are close (I've posted why before)
The schools making these decisions on the fall will have to make the same decisions in the spring unless I am missing something. It's a full year on-line at full rates? I don't know.
The tough decision for these schools is to stick with their plans, trust them, and understand the actual risks of students on campus. The easy decision is just to go online and take financial hits. They have the plans, they game theoried but perhaps the game theory was maximizing enrollment and dough in door before pulling rug out of on campus. Well played Holy Cross. Well Played.
@Chico Escuela posted:I'm sorry for you and your daughter, Gunner.
At this point, my son is leaning toward taking a gap year. He only has a few more days to decide.
I'm not sure what he should do. No question that freshman-year-from-home is going to be substandard (even at a 10% tuition discount). On the other hand, in 2020-21 a record number of college students taking time off is going to meet with a record low number of employment and internship opportunities (plus essentially no travel options). I think the next 12 months will largely be a lost year if my son doesn't start college. But maybe that price is worth it in hopes of a more normal 2021-22 freshman year?
For now, my daughter's school is still planning to have students back on campus in 2 weeks.
Meanwhile, Forbes says 20% of Harvard freshmen are deferring admission for a year, and only 25% are opting to live on campus:
That's the dilemma, what attractive or productive things can a kid do by taking a gap year vs taking online courses and beginning college?
All the usual pros of taking a gap year would seem to be extremely limited during Covid. Meaningful jobs/internships, travel, foreign language immersion abroad, service trips, etc. are just as limited as going to college in person. If the kid is just going to stay at home and watch movies or play video games all day, seems that taking online college courses would be a better option to maintain academic progress and stay sharp with learning. Perhaps kid could spend a gap year training athletically to get better prepared for whenever sports resume, but that should also be doable while taking college courses online. If spring sports in 2021 also get cancelled, the athletes would still preserve 4 years of sports eligibility whether they are taking online courses or a gap year but at least they would be further ahead in academic progression.
@Zoom 2020 posted:That's the dilemma, what attractive or productive things can a kid do by taking a gap year vs taking online courses and beginning college?
All the usual pros of taking a gap year would seem to be extremely limited during Covid. Meaningful jobs/internships, travel, foreign language immersion abroad, service trips, etc. are just as limited as going to college in person. If the kid is just going to stay at home and watch movies or play video games all day, seems that taking online college courses would be a better option to maintain academic progress and stay sharp with learning. Perhaps kid could spend a gap year training athletically to get better prepared for whenever sports resume, but that should also be doable while taking college courses online. If spring sports in 2021 also get cancelled, the athletes would still preserve 4 years of sports eligibility whether they are taking online courses or a gap year but at least they would be further ahead in academic progression.
All true. But I'm paying private college tuition (two of them, actually) with no financial aid. If my son uses a year of college online, he's not getting a 5th on my dime. There is the possibility of grad school, of course. I think my son's view is that he gets 4 years for college and he doesn't want to spend one of them online. But yeah, a year of playing video games and lifting weights is, as we used to say in the consulting biz, sub-optimal.
I'm hoping things loosen up some in the new year, so that maybe some travel, etc. becomes possible then. Which is not to say I'm convinced a gap year is a good idea in the current climate.
Also in the mix: My son plans on a Chemistry major and was supposed to be taking a 5-hour intensive lab this fall. The prof teaching that lab emailed previously (before JHU went online-only) to make sure students knew it was meeting in-person, because he felt it could not be taught properly online. Online science labs aren't terrible, but I wonder if they really provide the foundation necessary for extended further study.
This is all so disappointing and ridiculous. Presumably the rationale is that they have now realized that student-aged people are not going to behave, no matter how many pledges you make them sign, and no matter how many tests you have. Anyone could have told them that, back in May. I honestly can't see how big schools can open, but the smaller ones decide to close. It should be the other way round (although I guess we'll see what happens with the big schools). My son's school announced closing relatively early, and he has been depressed all summer - so maybe this way is better, a short, sharp shock. We have also gone round and round on a gap semester, at least, with nothing available to do.
Ironic that every year, there are questions on here about whether a baseball player should take a gap year to become bigger and stronger for college recruiting...
@Chico Escuela posted:All true. But I'm paying private college tuition (two of them, actually) with no financial aid. If my son uses a year of college online, he's not getting a 5th on my dime. There is the possibility of grad school, of course. I think my son's view is that he gets 4 years for college and he doesn't want to spend one of them online. But yeah, a year of playing video games and lifting weights is, as we used to say in the consulting biz, sub-optimal.
I'm hoping things loosen up some in the new year, so that maybe some travel, etc. becomes possible then. Which is not to say I'm convinced a gap year is a good idea in the current climate.
Also in the mix: My son plans on a Chemistry major and was supposed to be taking a 5-hour intensive lab this fall. The prof teaching that lab emailed previously (before JHU went online-only) to make sure students knew it was meeting in-person, because he felt it could not be taught properly online. Online science labs aren't terrible, but I wonder if they really provide the foundation necessary for extended further study.
Although it's understandable not wanting to pay for a 5th year of college, taking a gap year entails an opportunity cost that should be considered in the overall economic calculus. This opportunity cost includes not only the direct costs associated with kid staying at home (food, personal expenses) this year but also the future income that would be lost by graduating one year later.
Especially if grad school is in the cards, probably better to get started with college now than a year later.
Today's Inside Higher Education has some interesting survey data. E.g., forty percent of incoming freshmen say they are likely or highly likely not to attend their planned 4-year college this fall. (I assume the actual number of deferrals won't be nearly that high. But there are going to be a lot of them.) Just 7% of students trust their fellow students to follow COVID safety protocols. Some other interesting findings, too -- https://www.insidehighered.com...ny-four-year-college
My son at Hopkins is not happy and the letter from the coach didn't help. Here's hoping it opens back up in the Spring, but it's going to be a mess.
@whoknewwhatwhen posted:My son at Hopkins is not happy and the letter from the coach didn't help. Here's hoping it opens back up in the Spring, but it's going to be a mess.
Out of curiosity, what the coach say in his letter about sports/academics this year?
@Gunner Mack Jr. posted:August 20th, 1pm.... that's my son's move in date. I hope that holds up..... I did see/post the Forbes article too. Neither of mine will take a gap year but I am so frustrated with Holy Cross that I am talking to my daughter about transferring..
Wish my son took me up on my suggestion several weeks ago. Guess he’ll never learn that dad is always right.
@Zoom 2020 posted:Out of curiosity, what the coach say in his letter about sports/academics this year?
Encouraged them to consider deferring/LOA.
The northern states are in good shape currently but so many students coming from states with higher rates. Local school just uncovered positive cases from out of state kids who just moved in, which essentially doubled our state's daily case rate. If only we could get a handle on this nationally.
*Edited to add that I agree it's totally wrong to have to pay full price for online experience vs in person and the schools should pass on campus ops savingsto their students or dip into their rainy day funds.
