JOSE LIMA

I would really like to respond to Lima's antics during the game but it would serve no positive purpose.

Coach

What I saw was Jose Lima being Jose Lima !!!!

He is what he is

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Originally posted by CoachB25:
I would really like to respond to Lima's antics during the game but it would serve no positive purpose.

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Whaaaaaaaaaaa!

He simply kicked the Cards a$$.

Lima has always been animated, but he is not an in your face guy like some. He just honestly loves the game and is appreciative of his secodn chance after the Independent leagues. He has also done some very nice things for young playes as well. A generally fun loving hard working intense baseball player. One of my favorite Jim Rome interviews as well. It's Lima Time!

Soooooo, if a hitter stood at the plate and danced the way Lima did throughout the game after the hitter hit the big fly, you all agree that it would be acceptable. Say, hit one out, dance backwards for some 20 feet then pump his arms as Lima did on K-ing Edmonds.

Guess I have my priorities all wrong in today's age. I would rather a professional act professional. Act like he is used to winning etc. I would rather players professional or otherwise act with class. As I have described myself several times to my players, "I guess I'm a relic."

BigHit, why the rolled eyes, Wait, there's a drive down the right field line. Looks like, could be, it is!!! Gone!!! Edmonds breaks into-----NO WAY, HE'S BROKEN OUT THE MONSTER MASH FROM THE 70'S. Folks this is a classic. Darn, he only did 5 - maybe 10 seconds and then ran the bases. Wow, he's always been animated and some think he is a hotdog. I'll tell you one thing, that boy can dance. Maybe next time he'll break out some disco duck!

This is an issue similar to running up the score.

The act everyone hates isn't quite as bad as getting a red a$$ about it.

I wouldn't do what he did. I wouldn't teach what he did. I wouldn't do what you are doing.

The game itself will take care of this stuff.

The game doesn't take care of your red a$$.

CoachB25 ...

Funny, I have never seen Lima's theatrics as overkill, just entertaining. And although I can understand what you are saying when comparing his "antics" to that of a batter who uses "showmanship" at the plate, I think the difference here is my perception that it is Lima's personality and enthusiasm coming through, not arrogance.

Having watched some one-on-one interviews with him locally, I have developed a monstrous affection for Jose Lima, so I know I am looking at it differently than others might. But, all in all, I must say I just love him and am thrilled he came to the Dodgers this season.

Teacherman, as always...

In case anyone else missed it, I did attempt to interject some humor into this since I obviously am ...

Lima is just another in a long line of baseball characters

Coachb25 ...

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NO WAY, HE'S BROKEN OUT THE MONSTER MASH FROM THE 70'S.

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That was funny !!! But I think you are showing our ages ...

What do Sammy Sosa, Jose Lima, Julian Tavares, Carlos Zambrano and Rey Ordonez have in common?

Right. They are all hot dogs. If an American kid tried to pull that "sh...", they'd get drummed out of baseball.

BBMomma's post is the way I see Lima as well. Funny that what we will accept when we know it is genuine.

I remember a couple of years ago Bonds was blasted for his monster mash delays before running while also admiring. Now it is accepted. Why? It is just his personality.

Lima is just a character. I find it amazing that ther are some pitchers that do that and it would anger me. Others are just being themselves. I feel that is the difference. Baseball is a game where you never get too high or low. Sometimes an infusion of genuine enthusiasm is needed. That is different than in your face stuff meant to show you up. I think the players know the difference.

The reason I rolled my eyes is that I had nothing more to add to:

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As I have described myself several times to my players, "I guess I'm a relic."

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I hear ya, man. Every morning when I wake up. I hear ya!

BabybackMomma, at least I didn't come with some reference to Frankie Avalon! I remember those old movies as well although I was VERY YOUNG! LOL!!!

Emotions are great but where is the line. Edmonds is a hotdog and... because he shows emotions at times. Others aren't. I understand the legitimacy of the personality argument. I simply don't understand how it applies so differently to so many different people. Again, I didn't think all of that emotion yesterday was professional. Again, I admit I must be wrong because nothing was made of it today by anyone other than some stuff old man in Troy, Ill. Guess I showing my red a## Wait, if I were doing that, someone might mistake us for discovering a new moon. LOL!

One cannot mention Frankie without Annette

CoachB25 ...

Ahhhh ... you mean "BLUE moon I saw you standing alone, without a love of your own ... " sounds a lot better than RED moon, I guess. (Now, who is dating herself?)

BeenThere ...

I am not sure why you say that. Lots of players have been questioned over the years for their antics on the field. As have many people in the past, I have never liked what I perceived to be the arrogance displayed by Barry Bonds but have learned to accept it as part of his personality (actually, I don't think he does it quite as much). But again, I go to my point that it is a matter of personality. I think it says a lot when we see that Jose Lima is this flamboyant even when he is NOT on the mound but is standing on the top step of the dug-out, playing head cheerleader for his squad at every game, first one out to congratulate his teammates for a job well done or to encourage his teammates when things are not going well for them.

All in the mind of the beholder, I guess. As long as he isn't doing it to show up his opponents (funny, I just heard the announcers of the Houston/Atlanta game comment on that very aspect of Lima's decorum ... it is never to show up his opponents), I will enjoy it.

Babyback...The reason why I say that is because it is true.

If you saw an American player with those antics, he would be "drummed" out of the league as being a "hot dog".

Only Latin players can get away with that stuff in the U.S. The gm's in pro ball call that "flair". I call it "hot doggging".

Been,Here we go again. What's happened to your baseball memory? I don't recall Mark Fyrich being "drummed out of the league", or Al Hrobosky, or Turk Wendell or many other "American players" who showed their emotions on their sleeves. Why do you seem to have tunnel vision when it comes to Latin ballplayers? Is this supposed to be a game played by a bunch of robots? Is that what you'd like to see? If so, baseball would have missed Ty Cobb, Babe Ruth, Pete Rose,et all.

Maybe Jose Lima's behavior wouldn't fly at Princeton, but last night I got to watch and enjoy a fantastic baseball game and was never even close to being upset with Mr. Lima. You could never accuse him of being an overpaid primadonna who is only hanging around to collect a paycheck. Try chilling out a little and enjoy the unusual. I'd like to see more emotion in the game, and while I do consider myself a baseball purist, last nights performance was a pure as it gets!

Its...I'm convinced. You are stalking me and following me around the boards.

No, I wasn't around to see Ruth. I don't think you were either. Fidyrch, Hrabosky and others don't mock or embarrass other PLAYERS. Rose definitely didn't try to embarrass other players. He just bet on games and got caught.

All of these other mopes, that I've mentioned, did and do!

I suppose you believed that Lima's bat didn't double hit the ball on his bunt attempt...because the umps didn't call it, right?

So he beat the Cardinals. So what. One game.

A hot dog is a hot dog, whether Latin or otherwise. It just so happens that Sosa, Tavares, Lima, Ordonez and Zambrano are Latins.

Not sure what Princeton has to do with it, but, oh well. Nothing personal, I'm sure. Right, its?
You just picked Princeton out of all of the schools in America because you weren't being personal. I don't think so.

Been, I was not being personal. I tried to make a point that Major League Baseball is not being played in the Ivy League or any other collegiate venue.It is and never has been played by lilly white, well behaved gentlemen. But I do have a small problem with your seemingly tunnel vision misguided criticism towards exclusively Latin ballplayers. Others on this thread mentioned the Cardinals' Jim Edmonds. I don't appreciate that guy because of his grandstanding at home plate when he hits one out, and this running up the center field wall when a ball is hit 50 feet into the stands. Where is your indignance towards him?

As for stalking you, don't flatter yourself.

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No, I wasn't around to see Ruth. I don't think you were either. Fidyrch, Hrabosky and others don't mock or embarrass other PLAYERS. Rose definitely didn't try to embarrass other players. He just bet on games and got caught.

All of these other mopes, that I've mentioned, did and do!

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Been:

I know you were addressing someone else's post...but I wanted to respond. I think you're wrong about Lima. I don't think he has any intent to mock or embarrass other players. He really is a "character". Now...if you want to argue that he's a little "nuts"...so be it. He actually kissed the pitching coach on the lips after the game...on national TV! If you had watched him the whole season, like BBM and I have...you'd understand. The guy is a little wacko but very sincere and endearing to many of us.

123K ...

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The guy is a little wacko but very sincere and endearing to many of us.

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I think it's the "wacko" part that I like ... maybe a part of me wishes I could act the same way and make the same kind of money he does.

Been ...

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don't mock or embarrass other PLAYERS

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I have yet to see what Lima has done that even appears to be intended to mock or embarass other players. His enthusiasm seems entirely directed at the successes on the field, inning by inning, perhaps play by play. He is not the kind of player who makes excuses if he has a bad outing ... holds all his own blame. There are many qualities about him that accompany that "wacko" personality that people who don't get to watch him and read about him on a regular basis may not see. And so, just as people have learned to accept Barry Bonds' behavior because he is as good as he is, many of us here on the Left Coast who follow the Dodgers have become very fond of Lima and his antics.

As for the umpires' call regarding the bunt ... I read in our local paper today that the umpires did just what an umpire is supposed to do ... they didn't see it so they couldn't call it. LaRussa didn't make too much of a fuss after that, either. And besides ... it is a moot point since the Cardinals scored NO runs on only 5 hits ... all singles ... in 9 innings. Bottom line ...he threw the best game of his season. Maybe it is only one game to you but for some of us, it was a heck of an accomplishment for a pitcher who many doubted would be able to rise to the occasion.

John, are you for the 75% rule as well?

Interesting, that people note Lima's demeanor on the mound, but not that he pounded the Cards inside most of the day with a nice 87 mph sinking fastball. Most pitchers that throw 87 will just nibble away until they nibble their way out of the game. This guy has the heart of a lion and knows how to pitch.

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that he pounded the Cards inside most of the day with a nice 87 mph sinking fastball

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That is besides the point....

Life is too short not to kick out the jams when the spirit moves you. Life's routine can be pretty hum-drum for a lot of people, and they have no outlet for genuine physical exuberance. Since many of us live vicariously through our athletes, we can revel in the moments when something great happens and the athlete embodies the thrill of the moment through his actions.

As far as where the line is drawn, it's when the opponent of the moment is singled out for the in-your-face kwrap such as the jabbing finger, the mocking follow-behind, the puffing up 'you wanna a piece of me' act over the other guy - you know, stuff seen every day in basketball.

John, An (American) pitcher just went into the Hall of Fame this year that used to strike guys out and then shoot them with his finger and then pretend to blow the smoke off his finger tip. Had long hair too

I'm rooting for the Cards, but I do like Lima. And so do a lot of people around baseball:

"Jose Lima, the Dodgers' candidate for the prestigious Roberto Clemente Award, which honors service to the community and actions on the field....." (from mlb.com)

Glove...What is the 75% rule?

He is what he is...We haven't seen the real "Jose Lima" yet.

I'm happy that you are all so "happy" for him and his antics.

To me, he's a HOT DOG. And, I would really be pis... if my pitcher didn't drill him once when he did what he did several times. Maybe the Cardinal pitchers don't have any "caj..."! I don't know.

Consider the "problem" that LaRussa has with the Cubbies in unimportant games, I'm surprised that nothing has happened in such an important game.

Play the game, Jose.

BeenThere ...

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We haven't seen the real "Jose Lima" yet

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Interesting comment ... perhaps you know something about him that the rest of us would benefit from knowing.

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Play the game, Jose

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Seems to me he did ... and did a darn fine job of it as well yesterday.

Oh well ... some of us like him, some of us don't and none of us are going to convince anybody else to change their minds.

"We havent seen the real "Jose Lima" yet? When do you think you will? He has been pitching in the bigs since 1994 when he broke in with the Tigers. It is now 10 years later and his demeanor has been consistent throughout his career. What haven't we seen?

Jose Lima reminds me a comment made by the Crash Davis in Major League.

If you have moldy shower shoes and your losing in the bigs, you are just a slob, But if you are a 20 game winner with moldy shower shoes, then you are a character.

As a Tiger fan I can assure you that when he was a Tiger, many of us just thought he was an idiot. Now if he had won 20.....

There are two things I like about Lima, both of them belong to his wife.

Keller...you had to go to there didn't you

I don't think i need that Lasik app.

No wonder he is so happy!

What the........somethin' just poked me in the eye!

I don't think LaRussa believes there are any unimportant games, particularly within your division, most particularly aganst the Cubs. LaRussa was criticized by some Cardinals' fans for not retaliating against the Cubs to the same level of the Cubs' involvement; he was applauded by others for retaliating in the best possible way, by beating them. No way LaRussa would call a purpose pitch when the team's getting smacked down.

I like characters in the game (although I believe Lima's riding the line between "character" and "obnoxious" purty durn close), and he beat my Cardinals. Fortunately, all it meant was that we got to enjoy another game.

My beef with him was in '98, when he said he was grooving pitches late in the season so fellow Dominican Sosa could gain a few on McGwire.

But despite anyone's opinion of Lima, and Bradley's antics, there was a superb show of class and sportsmanship this evening after the game, when the Dodgers and Cardinals shook hands on the field in front of fans. Word was that it was Larry Walker's idea prior to postseason (he was a hockey player and is an NHL fan and wanted to emulate their tradition). LaRussa approached Tracey with the idea and he agreed. I would imagine it had Gagne's full support as a former hockey player as well, and he seemed to lead the team over.

In the post game wrap-up, Jeannie Selaski (sp?) seemed puzzled by the display, and the Fox commentators only mumbled a "what was that all about". That was to be expected as "Fox Sports" and "classy" can't be used in the same sentence during this baseball postseason.

It will be interesting if the Braves and Astros continue the idea. I'm thinking there's not much chance in the ALCS.