Leaning into the pitch

When I saw this (live) I immediately thought he would call him back to the plate, in my judgment, he did not move out of the way, in all baseball rules, this is illegal, and the pitch is ruled a ball or a strike if it is in the zone

I thought the college rule was different - that the batter does NOT have to avoid. Am I wrong?

Assuming I am right, the question becomes can a player lean into a pitch that is a ball, and get the base.

They have to move. A Louisville player was called back when they played Rice in the first round because he didn't make an effort to get out of the way.

Rob,
You are right (now that I think about), in either 06 or 07 they made it that you do not have to avoid, I am positive about that, but you cannot lean into it, and as stated above is either a ball or a strike, and it is a dead ball, no runner may advance.

Here's the NCAA 2007 rule 8.2.d:
"d. When hit by a pitched ball at which the individual is not attempting to strike;
A.R.—If the batter intentionally gets touched by moving or rolling any part of the body into the pitch, the umpire shall call a strike or ball in accordance with Rules 7-4 and 7-5.
(1) If the batter is hit by a pitch in the strike zone, the pitch is a strike, the ball is dead, no runners may advance and the batter is not awarded first base.
(2) If the batter makes no attempt to avoid being touched by the ball and the pitch is out of the strike zone, the pitch shall be called a ball. The
ball is dead, no runners may advance and the batter is not awarded first base.
A.R.—If the batter freezes (makes no attempt to avoid the pitch) and is hit by a pitch that is clearly inside the vertical lines of the batter’s box, the ball is dead and the batter is awarded first base.

OK thanks three finger. That makes sense.

1) No, the batter can't create the contact.
2) If the ball is in the batters box, he doesn't have to move.
3) If the ball is out of the strike zone but not in the batters box, he has to avoid.

Now I understand!

What a shame for Cal State Fullerton to have the game and their season end because of a botched call. (I realize this particular batter/runner did not score the winning run -- but based on how things unfolded after his AB, I still view the HP call as the primary cause).

RPD,
The umpire had to make a ruling and he did, in his judgement, the batter did not lean into the pitch. Do I think it was the right call, no, but did it cost them there season, no. The players play the game and had plenty of opportunity to score some runs. The umpire didn't end their season, the players ended their season.

quote:

Originally posted by RPD:
What a shame for Cal State Fullerton to have the game and their season end because of a botched call. (I realize this particular batter/runner did not score the winning run -- but based on how things unfolded after his AB, I still view the HP call as the primary cause).

Typical post, guess we shouldn't expect any better.

quote:

What a shame for Cal State Fullerton to have the game and their season end because of a botched call. (I realize this particular batter/runner did not score the winning run -- but based on how things unfolded after his AB, I still view the HP call as the primary cause).

Unless I balk the winning run in, I will never believe that one of my calls is the primary cause of the end of a season for a team......

Jontaine, Lon & PIAA -- after reflecting on your responses to my comment, I do agree that my harsh words towards the umpire were not appropriate. Thanks for calling me on it.

I think more than anything else I was upset at the batter's action and agreed with the announcers when they said, "That's not the way baseball was meant to be played."

I respect the game and I respect the experience and expertise that you bring to this forum. Give me the heave-ho on this one -- you responses were right on.

RPD:

no harm, no foul


..but the culprits on 'thats not how the game should be played' are the RULESMAKERS. THEY changed the rule to allow a batter to be HBP with impunity (in the box). The umpire is enforcing the rules that the NCAA WANTS CALLED.

I saw that play and agree that it could have been called either way (leaning into it or not)....but the *rule* that lets the batter take a shot without moving is the NCAA's.

Everything in sports is cumulative - one play or one call does not win or lose a game.

I believe all levels (high school and above) should have the NCAA rule of you odn't have to make an attempt to get out of the way but don't initiate the contact.

If you are man enough to let a fastball hit you by choice then you deserve to get first.

quote:

If you are man enough to let a fastball hit you by choice then you deserve to get first.

Unless they're up there with all the body armor on

I'd have to disagree. The leadoff batter in the UNC/OSU game had his arms over the plate, and was all armored up on his left elbow. The pitch came in high over the plate and he let it hit the elbow pad.

The pitch was high, but it was over the plate. No way that should be a free base.

I don't think it was over the plate but it was borderline as to whether it was inside the box. The not having to move is for inside the box itself.

MST:
Boy I have to disagree ... I played it back on DVR two or three times. That pitch was over the inside part of the plate, and the batter's set up all day long was over the plate.

There is no way that pitch was even questionable as to being in the batters box.

quote:

I played it back on DVR two or three times.

And therein lies the rub......how many times did the umpire in question get to review the pitch?.....


just once at game speed.......


easier said than done........

PIAA, that was the point that I was trying to make. The rule says anything inside the batters box he doesn't have to move. Over the plate he has to attempt. The pitch was inside, which means it wasn't over the plate. The PU at real speed isn't going to try to figure whether it was over the box or somewhere in between. HBP, go to first.
I have called NCAA for a while and it has been both ways and back. I wish they used the OBR rule and umps had the cojones to actually call it. But it is the way it is and so it wasn't a bad call.

It is a truism that is VERY true in baseball:

If you want a rule changed, the quickest way is to call it EXACTLY as it is written.

Since the announcers went on and on about how this CWS 'shattered' the record for HBP (previous record: 38...this year: 51), then the NCAA poo-bahs can meet this winter and decide if they want to change how they view this issue.

Believe me, the umpires will only call whats there. Remove it, and wala...no more calls!