Mercer University-Macon GA

jonr12
My son is a freshman this year at Mercer U. He loves it.. so far, so good! Mercer is noted for being a great top-of-the line college for academics and they have a very competative baseball program. They are in the Atlantic-Sun Conference. Mercer was exactly what he was looking for...a school that cared about education and a school where he could play Division 1 baseball..! What more could you ask for!!!!!

Thanks for the information. We were impressed with everthing/everyone.

Does any else have any additional info on the Atlantic Sun Conference or Mercer?

Thanks

Spent some time this summer talking to a coach from Mercer. He was an impressive young man, very excited about the future of their baseball program. (I wish I could remember his name!)

jonr12:

My son, my wife and I attended the Mercer "All Skills" camp this last weekend [September 16-17]. It was, as we had been told and as I expected, a camp held primarily as a showcase event for the coaches to look at various players they were interested in recruiting. The camp only cost $100.00 so I doubt it would be considered a "money maker" type camp but an honest evaluation opportunity. There were 32 players at the camp mostly 07 grads with several 08 grads thrown in. I have mixed reactions at this moment and don't know that I see the present situation at Mercer with total clarity but here goes.

First, we found out that Jason Jackson, the pitching coach and head recruiting coordinator for the last three years, has left the school and gone elsewhere. As this was the person my son and I spoke with most of the time both on campus visits and phone calls, we found that quite disconcerting. Second, the only "Assistant Coaches" introduced at the camp were former Mercer Players of fairly recent vintage. I assume from this that they either have not yet replaced Coach Jackson or have chosen to replace him with a recent Mercer grad.

I have done a lot of research on Mercer University and its baseball program and I would be happy to answer any specific questions you wish to ask me by PM.

TW344

I think Jason was the young man I spoke to, that I was so impressed with!!

Do you know where he went??

I belive Jason is now at S. Alabama. Last year Link Jarrett also left Mercer and he's at E Carolina.... From what heard, Mercer is a great academic school with a very good baseball program. Don't pick a school for the assistant coaches.....

puma1:

You probably did speak with Jason. He certainly is a fine young man.

Coach Merc:

I find your last statement a bit of a problem. If you are a pitcher and the Head Coach is a middle infielder and assigns the moniker "pitching coach" to one of his assistants, isn't it important to the potential recruit who that coach is and what his background is? There are several reasons why a young player should choose one college over another [academics, overall offensive philosophy, defensive philosophy, etc.]. Why shouldn't the assistant coaches be one of those reasons?

TW344

Coach Merc

In my mind the assistant coaches are as important, if not more so, than the head coach---they are the guys the players will work with every day--especially if they are specific coaches--ie hitting, pitching, catching et al---a good pitching coach can be invaluable not only for the program but the player himself and the same for other positions

The head Coach is like the Band director and if the band members are out of tempo the Head Coach becomes a bad coach---a good staff makes a real good head coach

it IS correct that assistant coaches are very important - therein lies the problem

nearly ALL assistant coaches are on career paths to become head coaches - that means some moves while "climbing the ladder" as opportunities become available.

prolly what C Merc was referring to (don't make your choice because of the assistant coaches)-
during his 4 yrs a player is very likely to see new assitants, because if they are good at what they do, there will be opportunities for them to advance -



.

Bee,
Thank you... I wasn't trying to say that the assistant coaches should not be a consideration. My point was that if their good and you base your decision on your relationship with them....Chances are they won't be there very long. Last year alone, (one school with the gold lettering on their letter head) was recruiting my son. They had 2 different recruiting coordinators working my son in 3 months and both have moved on. One as a Head Coach and the other to a bigger program.

I feel that every assistant coach aspires to (1)be a head coach, (2)needs to make more money then where he's at (small program vs large), (3) Find the right situation for his family.

Our sons' comfort with the entire coaching staff, academics, geography, school, facilities, conference, opportunity to contribute, etc are all MAJOR factors that should play into the decision. My point was "Don't make your decision based soley on the assistant coach", it should defintely be one of the factors.

One thing you may consider and I take this from what I think TR's thought was....Take a look as part of your homewark at how long the assisatnt coaches have been with the program. Was the Head Coach an assistant in the program before being promoted.."A good staff makes a good head coach"

I did not mean to steal this thread which started out about Mercer University but what is being discussed here is important and relevant not only to Mercer recruits but to others interested in other schools.

It is true that the assistant coach position is usually more "unstable" than the Head Coaches position: especially for the winning programs. But I agreee with TRhit that for many positions, the player, regardless of who recruits him, will be "coached" much more by the assistant coach assigned to that/those positions than the Head Coach. Thus, no matter how much he likes the head coach, if he and the assistant coach cannot get along IMHO it will be a rough 4-5 years.

If the assistant coach leaving is a concern [and it should be], check the roster out and see how long he has been at the same school in the same position. Though certainly no guarantee, that should give the recruit some information about the assistant's committment and where he is headed. Using Mercer just as an example, I checked the website out and they have hired a new pitching coach [that's the good news]. The "bad" news, at least from my perspective if I were a potential pitcher, is that he has been coaching only three years [at least at the college level] and he has changed schools every year. What would you make of that?

TW344

quote:

he has been coaching only three years .... and he has changed schools every year. What would you make of that?

re the 4yr universities

in most cases the head coach "pursues" a short list of qualified candidates to fill his vacancy

in many cases the assistant's salary is heavily (or entirely) dependent on camp income.

in Macon their Christmas break camps are outside & the team is outside practicing in January,
at Monmouth - well, they're shoveling snow til April

and - the Atlantic Sun is a pretty nice conference

and - often the younger assistants relate & work better with the players
.

Mercer has a competitive baseball program, check out their schedule. And guess who they took one game from last year.

Choosing a school based on staff is always a part of the equation in making a decision. My son based part of his decision on his pithcing coach, which bothered us a bit, but we knew son would be happy there regardless. I have learned something though. The first year son worked hours with his pitching coach, the second less and now as a junior doesn't spend much time in instruction with him. He would have survived if he left.

Fortunate for him he has remained, he is a large part of the success at the school.
However, I would imagine the HC will be there for quite a few years, not ready to retire, so I would imagine sometime soon he will move on.

Some assistant coaches are given a lot of freedom and make a lot of the decisions. Many assistant coaches of well run programs get paid better than if they were head coaches of smaller programs. Many assistant coaches are the recruiters and their job is year round with few days off. It's very tiring.

I would be a bit concerned if assistant coaches didn't remain at schools longer than a year or two. It may not be a sign that something is wrong with them, possibly the HC is difficult? Or the young coach is impatient, doesn't want to take time to learn from the HC, or wants more control.

JMO.

MACON, Ga. – Head coach Craig Gibson has appointed Danny McMurtry as Mercer’s new pitching coach, replacing the departed Jason Jackson. McMurtry joins the Bears from Okaloosa-Walton where he had success both as a coach and recruiter.

While at Okaloosa-Walton, McMurtry tutored a pitching staff that saw two of its members drafted in the 2006 MLB amateur draft. Also, the class that he helped bring in had an additional five players drafted over the summer.

Before his stint at Okaloosa-Walton, McMurtry was the pitching coach and recruiting coordinator at Monmouth University. During his time at Monmouth, he guided the pitching staff to school records in ERA and wins. He also helped engineer a recruiting class that featured a 2006 Freshman All-American.

McMurtry began his playing career at Howard Community College and finished at the University of Louisiana-Lafayette. He served as a graduate assistant at Louisiana-Lafayette for one year before leaving for Monmouth.

He is originally from North Platte, Neb. McMurtry’s family is full of athletic genes as his brother Matt was drafted this past June by the San Francisco Giants. His sister Becky was a three-time softball All-American and is currently the head coach at Northwestern State, and his older sister Jamie played softball at Creighton University.

“Danny (McMurtry) is a young, high-energy coach that will definitely be a great asset to our staff,” said Gibson. “He is a great recruiter and a talented young coach.”

catcher09:

I read the same press release. Do you have any issue at all with the fact that Coach McMurtry has coached at four different schools in four years?

TW344

Guess he's either real good or real bad??

Can't imagine Gibson bringing in ANY guy into his program that's not "real good". He seems to be committed to program.

TW344--
If you understood the economics of college baseball you'd have no problem with a coach being at 3 schools in three years. When they first start out college baseball coaches make little or often times no money. So moving up the ladder (and on to another school) is a necessity if you want to stay in coaching. It has nothing to do with "committment" -- a coach who was uncommited wouldn't get hired anywhere else. Mercer has a good program and a good track record of hiring the right guys (which is why they keep getting good jobs elsewhere in college baseball). So what I would make of a guy getting hired at 3 schools in three years is that he must be doing something right to have all those people want to hire him...bad assistant coaches don't get hired for better jobs.

Yes you do have to like the assistant coaches, but in college baseball the head coach is the only one who really has any kind of stability. Even head coaches move around alot now. I would pick a school not for the assistant coaches or the head coaches, but because the school was a good fit.

We met with Mercer after I started this post.

We were very very impressed all the way around. The coaches we met with were first class people. They were very honest and forthcoming with information. You could feel their excitement in their future. The facilites and campus were top notch and immaculately maintained. Great academic guidance and focus for their players.

smoothglove5:

Let us not let the discussion denigrate into the typical "if you were not an idiot you would see my point of view" verbage found on the hitting forum. To be quite frank with you, I don't really care about the economics of college baseball as it relates to assistant coaches. What I care about is if my son is going to commit 4 or 5 years of his life to a college, I would like for him to learn something about baseball from a coach he likes and respects. I would also hope he would learn something about life from the right kind of coach/person. If he goes to a college and has four or five different assistant coaches that "coach" him about how to hit the way "he" wants him to hit [each one with a different theory on how that is to be accomplished (see HITTING forum for advanced level virulent disagreement on any and all aspects of hitting)] and how to play a position the way "he" wants him to play the position [each one with a different way of doing something that has to be relearned each time] MY SON, at least, would likely become quite frustrated with the whole experience.

Last week my son and I visited a DII school with an outstanding reputation and a long history of often winning their Regional and getting to the DII College World Series. They have had the same head coach for more than 20 years and the same head asistant coach for more than 10 years. I feel fairly sure that they would resent your statement that "bad assistant coaches don't get hired for better jobs."

Thus, I do believe that schools changing coaches and/or coaches changing schools every year is a potential problem for some people. Apparently not for some but I am not speaking to those who don't want to listen. If you don't like what I say, fine, say so and make your counter argument. But stay away from ad hominem attacks on me. I don't care for them nor do I respect the people [however knowledgable they may be on certain subjects] who use them.

TW344

TW344--
The way I see it you were making some pretty strong statements about a coach who you never met. Questioning is commitment, his age, etc. My intention wasn't to "attack" you, I just wanted you to have all the facts about the current climate of college baseball. And to be quite frank with you, you should care about the economics of the situation because it is the REALITY at most schools.

Also I never said that because a coach stays somewhere a long time the he is a bad coach. What I said was that if he was a bad coach he would have no opportunity to have 4 jobs in 4 years. Quite the contrary, there are some great coaches that have been at schools for a long time. The reality of it, however, is that this isn't usually the case.

It is certainly your perrogative to steer your son toward a school that has some stability in the coaching staff. I don't think anyone would ever fault you for that. But that really doesn't give you the right to disparage a program and a coach who don't fit in to your idea of what makes a good program.

So if you viewed it as an attack on you then I apologize, but I would recommend that if you are going to make some of the statements you made then you probably shouldn't be surprised when someone calls you on it.

smoothglove,
I didn't see anything wrong in TW's post, I didn't feel he was saying anything negative about the coach. He was trying to make a point.

As a parent I would be concerned if I saw a coach moved around alot, young or old. I would also be concerned if I saw frequent coaching changes being made at a particular school. Regardless of economics in today's college baseball programs, some do feel that stablility in the caochig staff is an important part of their son's overall experience.

JMO.

In case anyone wanted information on Mercer. Looks like they are getting a good recruiting class for their level of ball:

DIVISION I RECRUITING

smoothglove5:

First, I accept your apology. And, operating on the assumption that it was sincere, I will try one more time to answer your statements. I have never given an opinion on this "coach whom you never met." I never questioned "his commitment, his age, etc." And I never said anything that would "disparage a program and a coach who don't fit in to your idea of what makes a good program."

To prove this to you, please go back and reread my posts. I will try to guide you. In my first post I pointed out that I had attended the Mercer all skills camp with my son. I described the atendees at the camp and said I did not think it was a '"money maker" type camp but an honest evaluation opportunity.' Do you see anything disparaging the Mercer program so far? Please reread that paragraph if you still think you do.

In the next paragraph I pointed out that upon arrival my son was told the pitching coach and head recruiting coordinator had left for another job and that was "quite disconcerting" to my son who had grown quite close to him. I then said who were the asistant coaches introduced at the camp [a purely factual statement] and what school they were from and assumed they had either not replaced Coach Jackson or were using one of their own graduates.

I then offered to jonr12 who started the thread that I had a lot of research on Mercer that I was willing to share. To this date, he has never sent me a PM or anything else.

In my second post I simple asked questions of Coach Merc as to why he made the statement "Don't pick a school for the assistant coaches ....." I asked these question because I grealy respect Coach Merc and his opinions as I am sure do others on this website and I truly wanted to understand the analysis that brought him to that conclusion. He later posted again and refined his position and, in so doing, indirectly answered my question.

In my third post I tried to indicate how important I thought this discussion was to the causual reader and others who are trying to make the same decisions as I am about the "best fit" for my son. I tried to thread my thoughts with those of TRHit as to the "real coach" of a player that attends a certain school and how important coaching staility might be. I then said "Using Mercer just as an example" [since an inquiry about that school was what started the thread] I noted that they had already hired a new pitching coach [the good news] but the '"bad" news, at least from my perspective if I were a potential pitcher, is that he has been coaching only three years [at least at the college level] and he has changed schools every year.' These statements are FACT. They are verifiable by looking at the website.

I am not in any way giving an opinion on Coach McMurty's abilities as a pitching coach. He may be a great pitching coach. I don't know. If you know him and you think he is a great pitching coach, then you should say so. Nobody knows how good a coach he is except the players and coaches at the three schools he left each year. If you really like Mercer and you or your son is a pitcher, check out those schools and find out why he left. But the FACT that he left each school for another is there for all to see and everyone can form their own opinion. It is a FACT that I find worth considering in th where am I going to go to school decision. Obviously, you do not. OK. We agree to disagree. Let us leave it at that. Others can read our positions and the support for them and reach their own conclusions.

My next post was to note that the poster ahead of me had posted the Mercer press release that touted the hiring of Coach McMurtry and his background. I asked the poster if he had any issue with the fact that, according to that press release, he had been at four different schools in four years. He never answered my question and has not posted on this thread since.

Then you arrived with your first post directed specifically at me. Your first sentence was this, and I quote: "If you understood the economics of college baseball you'd have no problem with a coach being at 3 schools in three years." Do you see at all how I might be offended by that? You then proceded to give me your lesson in College Baseball Economics 101. But you were making several assumptions about me and generalizing about the motives of everyone who chose to coach in this sport at the college level that simply are not universally true. To avoid calling you out on those assumptions directly, I followed up on my statements in my next post by pointing out it was the result of assistant coaches moving on and not the alleged cause of it that I was interested in for my son. It was, I thought, a nice way of saying that your argument was irrelevant.

Further in that post I provided an example of a stable coaching and highly sucessful DII college program whose coaches had been together a long time and that my son and I had just visited. And, I must confess, I couldn't resist a reducto ad absurdum dig at your statement regarding "bad . . . coaches don't get hired for better jobs" since the reverse implication {if you don't get hired for another job, you are a bad coach} was the logical outgrowth of one of your assumptions.

Then, your last sentence was an expression of your personal opinion that you "would pick a school not for the assistant coaches or the head coaches, but because the school was a good fit." My first reaction to that opinion was this: how in the world can any school be a good fit unless you like and respect the head and assistant coaches? I reacted that way because I see the "fit" as including the persons that will spend the most time with you and, probably, have the most influence on you for the next 4 to 5 years. But that is just me and my opinion. Obviously, again, we agree to disagree.

So, please point out to me THE SPECIFIC STATEMENT IN ANY OF MY POSTS where i exercised my God given and free speech right "to disparage a program and a coach who don't fit in to {my} idea of what makes a good program." I would like to know since what I thought I was doing all along was to pose questions for others to consider in making the all important decision about what school to attend. But since no one has yet asked me which DII school my son and I visited that has the baseball success AND the stable head and assistant coaches, it appears the issues still being debated on this thread are now moot.

TW344

Specific statements? I don't really need to point you to specific examples because you just included them in your last post: "that should give the recruit some information about the assistant's committment and where he is headed." and "The "bad" news, at least from my perspective if I were a potential pitcher, is that he has been coaching only three years [at least at the college level] and he has changed schools every year." I would tend to think that comes across as being a little negative. And since you are so concerned with "logical outgrowth" my logical assumption of these statements would be that you think that you can choose a school by surfing the internet. So I guess we can forget about official visits and all that actually talking to the people nonsense. Gimme a break-- a logical outgrowth of my assumption? It was actually an assumption on your part that I meant that because a coach is at a school for a long time then they are a bad coach. All I meant by that was that if the guy got hired at 3 (or 4) or however many schools he must be pretty good because if he wasn't how would he ever get hired that many times?

I'm just telling you the reality of Division 1 baseball. Assistant Coaches will come and go. You will find a few programs with stability in the coaching staff, but for the most part there is some turnover of assistant coaches at some point during a players 4 years. Whether the coach is there 1 year or 15 years there is always the chance that he's going to leave. The good news is that good programs are attractive to good coaches so even though a good one might get away, there will be another good coach waiting to step in. Places like Mercer (with strong academics, conference, etc.) will probably always have good coaches because its the kind of place that people want to be at. Thats why you pick a school for the school (oh yeah and the fact that we're all an arm injury away from not playing anyway). Now I'm not saying that you pick a school if you hate the head coach or don't agree with the hitting guy's philosopy, but the school should be the biggest factor. It is after all still COLLEGE baseball.

tw seemed pretty harsh on the program re the hiring of a young guy moving up thru the ranks -
having NO info on him or the program & just generalizing
Mercer has a pretty good history

quote:

by tw: my son is going to commit 4 or 5 years of his life to a college . . . learn something about baseball from a coach he likes and respects . . . learn something about life from the right kind of coach/person . . (if he has) different assistant coaches that "coach" him about how to hit the way "he" wants him to hit each one with a different theory on how that is to be accomplishedwould likely become quite frustrated with the whole experience

btw: if that's your story AND you're sticking to it -
your odds of being frustrated in 4/5 yrs are prolly close to 75%+

there was about a 10% turnover in DI head coaches last yr who "swore" to their recruits they'd be there forever - a way way higher % for assistants "swearing" the same thing
extrapolate that to D II, D III, & NAIA
(there IS no demand for bad coaches) that's NOT to say a coach staying put is bad, but coaches "climbing the ladder" are in demand because they are getting the job done

good luck, but be realistic -

this IS the real world

quote:

by tw: we visited a D II - They have had the same head coach for more than 20 years and the same head asistant coach for more than 10 years

btw II: with those #'s a sharp math guy might see bad odds & a change due -
even if not to "climb the ladder", then retirement or fishing with the grandchidren, etc


.

OK. i am sick of this and concede ALL POINTS MADE. Mercer is great. There is nothing wrong at all with Mercer. There is no reason to look behind what ever they tell you. It is perfect. Its THE ideal University. In fact, why look behind and research any school before sending your son or daughter there. You will get all you need to know on the "official visit". Good luck to all.

As Kartman often says, "$@)&^ you guys", i am going home."

quote:

by tw: Nobody knows how good a coach he is except the players and coaches at the three schools he left each year.

don't forget his new boss who likely has a pretty strong read on that as well -


I'll accept your compliments of the Mercer staff on their behalf as they'll read but not post -
keep in touch with them & remember
that "during April, shades, sun screen & short sleeves are the norm in Macon"





.

I have not posted here in a while b/c this seemed like it was personal and less about Mercer.

We did visit and meet with the coaches. We were EXTREMELY impressed with them, their program, their facilities, the campus and the academics. It was a perfect fit for our player and family.

We have got all the information we needed from the visit.

Best Regards