MLB to Use Pitch Clock for Minor League Games...thoughts?

Love it.  Save the game.

My kid is a tempo pitcher.  His coaches taught the catchers to get the ball immediately back to the pitcher.  He gets it, steps on rubber, gets sign and goes.  Fielder's, parents, coaches, umpires like it when game gets in a rhythm.  

The model actually comes from the Atlantic Independent league who used it this summer (along with other things like declaring an intentional walk). The AZFL tried it out and now as expected it went to AA and AAA for final review before it goes to MLB. Like always someone else can figure out a better way before MLB does.

My son was taught at an early age to pitch quickly, throw the ball get the ball throw it again.  I dont think that is the issue rather than the batter in and out of the box (time out) several times. That is a strategy to slow down the pitcher, so not sure how it really will be accepted on the ML level. In fact unless they make that part of the rule it wont.

What do I think about it, teach young pitchers to do the same, and they wont grow up to be the type who makes the game too slow and too boring. 

I don't like it at all.  Baseball has remained the one game with no clocks and no time limits.  It's fundamentally changing the game.  My son is not a slow pitcher either, he keeps the game going, so I don't think it will affect him at all.  In HS, he pitched a complete game, lost 1-0 and the game lasted just 1 hr. 15 min. (7 innings).  I just don't like the concept.  If they want to speed things up, enforce the rules already there concerning the batters and pitchers.  For that matter, put a time limit on replay calls.  Those things can last FOREVER!!!  I don't like replay to start, but one replay call can extend a game more than the time you will save by having a pitch clock in place.

I am with you bballman. It is a fundamental change and one that impacts the game between the hitter and the pitcher. Most of the speeding up the game talk is for placating people who don't really care about baseball anyway.

I can never figure out why people get so upset about a clock in baseball. The rule below definitely put a clock into the game in 1955.

8.04 When a base is occupied, a pitcher must deliver the pitch within twenty seconds of receiving it from the catcher. If he fails to do so, the umpire may call a ball.

I couldn’t find out when 8.04 changed to the following.

[8.04 When the bases are unoccupied, the pitcher shall deliver the ball to the batter within 12 seconds after he receives the ball. Each time the pitcher delays the game by violating this rule, the umpire shall call “Ball.”

The 12-second timing starts when the pitcher is in possession of the ball and the batter is in the box, alert to the pitcher. The timing stops when the pitcher releases the ball.

The intent of this rule is to avoid unnecessary delays. The umpire shall insist that the catcher return the ball promptly to the pitcher, and that the pitcher take his position on the rubber promptly. Obvious delay by the pitcher should instantly be penalized by the umpire.

My kid was a fast tempo pitcher too, but that didn’t stop any batter from trying to break up that tempo. Heck, when I was a kid back in the 50’s we knew that if a pitcher was allowed to get in a “groove” he could be a lot of trouble, so we learned ways to counteract that without a clock.

I understand your opinion.  I care about baseball.  I'd like for the game to improve and be there for my son and beyond.

My son is a fast pitcher rythm/tempo. His freshman year teams would just let him go, and did not try to slow things down. (not sure why) But from his sophomore year on, Batters are constantly calling time out and stepping out and really slowing him down. Last year his coach worked on the slide step with him to let him get into a rhythm again. That was good for the first game and a half, and the other teams figured it out.

He is still a good pitcher but is much better if he is allowed to work fast.

I'm sure the "pitch clock" is really a "pitcher / batter" clock.  Batter will have to get in box timely (whatever that means) and pitcher pitch within a time period.  Umpires will have to make a judgement on awarding a ball or strike based on the two players?  Looking forward to seeing it in the AA / AAA level.  Didn't see any AZ fall league games to see how it really effects the game.

LH is an uptempo type.  I would like to see the emphasis put on the batters.  But it wouldn't hurt my feelings if it stayed just like it is.  Let the game flow at whatever pace that particular games dictates.

Stats, I think pitchers wouldn't mind abiding by 8.04 as much if batters (and umpires) could abide by rule 6.02.  In other words, stop calling time (and allowing time) once the pitcher is set.  As long as they're within their timeframe and the batter is in the box, time should not be allowed.

Now that Sandoval is no longer a Giant, I'm free to say that yes, there are pitchers who work too slow, and that needs to be addressed, but the main issue is guys like Sandoval, who, either because they are OC, or because they are primadonnas, or both, have elaborate rituals they must complete before stepping in the box, and even between pitches.  If a clock helps, great. But I don't know why the PU can't just say to Pablo, "Hey, big guy, stop writing stuff in the dirt and get in the goshdarn box.  Oh, and by the way, the velcro on your gloves is fine."  Then, when he keeps writing and banging his helmet with the bat, "Strike One."

That would do it.

That's why I said they should enforce the rules already in place.  The umps should have the guts to tell the guys to speed it up without the use of a big play clock in the background.

Originally Posted by GHHS-2016LHP:

Stats, I think pitchers wouldn't mind abiding by 8.04 as much if batters (and umpires) could abide by rule 6.02.  In other words, stop calling time (and allowing time) once the pitcher is set.  As long as they're within their timeframe and the batter is in the box, time should not be allowed.

WHOA! I thought we were discussing having a clock in the game. How other rules are interpreted and call has nothing to do with the subject because I can’ likely find someone who has a problem with almost any rule in the book. Umpires at higher levels are told how they are to interpret the rules, so if batters are allowed to call time or step out, it doesn’t have a whole lot to do with the 12 second rule.

The issue is with the batters, not the pitchers.  IMO, umpires/MLB are reluctant to penalize the batters.  My suggestion would be to start penalizing the batters in MILB and then you would have a class of batters that will not waste time because they were taught not to...and then slowly implement in MLB over a couple of years. You start calling strikes on the batters and they will stop taking so long.

6.02(d)(1).
(2) The batter may leave the batter’s box and the dirt area surrounding home plate
when “Time” is called for the purpose of
i(i) making a substitution; or
(ii) a conference by either team

If there is no conference or substitution then there is no need for time out, therefor no need for a "pitch clock"

Definition of irony:  Stats being taken aback by another board user citing a rule.

Come on Stats, lefthookdad gets it.  If both rules were enforced, there would be no need for the clock.

Originally Posted by GHHS-2016LHP:

Definition of irony:  Stats being taken aback by another board user citing a rule.

Come on Stats, lefthookdad gets it.  If both rules were enforced, there would be no need for the clock.

Why do you think I’m at all surprised someone else knows how to read? But that has nothing at all to do with the discussion. The OP was about clocks in the game, what does that have to do with whether or not a batter calls time out and gets it? There has been a rule about time between pitches for at least 60 years, so why should anyone be surprised by it?

MLB isn’t going to implement a new rule! Rather, they’re goint to change the interpretation of how an old rule will be enforced. Hey, I wish they’d change the enforcement of a lot of other rules, but that’s not what they see as being needed right now. Specifically, I’d love to see batting gloves banned entirely.

Remember, the owners own the game at the ML and MiL levels and determine how they want it’s rules interpreted. There’s nothing that says any other organization has to do the same, so why is there all the angst about what MLB is going to do? Don’t get angry with me. Talk to whatever organization is telling the umpires you’re PO’d at to enforce the rules in a way that makes you mad.

What makes you think I'm angry?  Geez dude, don't go getting all defensive.

Staying on-topic as a parent of a pitcher, I'm not a fan of the rule but I understand it.  MiLB (and more than likely soon MLB) is tasked with making the game more "watchable" for the casual fan (whatever that means).  If marketing numbers don't show an up-tick in attendance or TV ratings, I suspect it will go the way of Mr. Finley's optic yellow ball.

PS:  Yes, I can read....even backhanded compliments between the lines.

MLB owners realize the longer the game, the more beer gets sold, more money.  Let's don't reinvent the wheel.  The mental part of this game is what makes it great.  If you are a up-tempo pitcher, you better learn to deal with hitters stepping out.  If you have a fat third baseman, you better find someone to field the drag bunt.  If you make a travesty of the game, better not dig in the batter's box.  Sorry if I made anyone mad but that's the great thing about this game.  Fans that say it's too long, need to stay home or learn what is 'actually' going on during a game. 

If you start shortening the game because of rules, what's next?  The pitcher can only throw over to 1st two times per base runner?  Baseball is not a clock driven game nor will it ever be.  Good teams will always be able to control the tempo of the game to their style.  You can't run out the clock as in most games.  You have to throw the ball over the plate and take your chances.  No victory formation!

Originally Posted by GHHS-2016LHP:

What makes you think I'm angry?  Geez dude, don't go getting all defensive.

Staying on-topic as a parent of a pitcher, I'm not a fan of the rule but I understand it.  MiLB (and more than likely soon MLB) is tasked with making the game more "watchable" for the casual fan (whatever that means).  If marketing numbers don't show an up-tick in attendance or TV ratings, I suspect it will go the way of Mr. Finley's optic yellow ball.

PS:  Yes, I can read....even backhanded compliments between the lines.

I wasn’t getting “all defensive” at all. I was just stating the truth. There is no new rule I know of being contemplated, but they are looking at enforcing it differently than they have over the last 60 years because the game has changed. Competition for that almighty sports-$$$$$ is fierce, but none of the owners will soon be in the poorhouse. Rule interpretations and how they’ll be enforced change all the time, and I suspect that will never change.

There was no “backhanded compliment” intended, just surprise that this kind of thing comes up all the time and people seem to be surprised at things that are in the book.

milb umpires are learning to become MLB umpires and reality is that they will do what the general ownership wants, not the players or what is better for the game.

I have to agree with stats on this, there has always been a rule but loosely enforced. There is a lot more involved than just selling more beer in enforcing rules.  

I personally think that it will make the game better.

I believe this is the problem with slow games also. 

The rules are already in place to keep the game from slowing down. 

My kid is a tempo pitcher also but takes his time getting back to the mound after each pitch to show the other team that he controls the game.  

I believe if you put a stop watch on him from the time the catcher throws back the pitch to the time he pitches it would be under 20 seconds. 

Also at younger levels what can slow the game down is the coach getting the signals to the catcher for what pitch to be thrown. 

 The pitcher controls the game by getting the ball back to the pitcher and throwing it under the time that he is supposed to with each pitch.  Allowing no time for the batter to figure out how to call time or what pitch might come next.

If your sons are taught this early, it will become automatic. This is what son had to do in HS, mandatory in college and much appreciated in pro ball.  Once the umpire sees that the pitcher is in command of the game, he will give the breaks to him and not the hitters. 

And this will not happen unless the pitcher has a plan everytime he goes to the mound.

In pro ball how often is the pitcher waiting on the batter, no matter how slow the pitcher gets back to the mound after each pitch?

FWIW, new rules include the batter having to keep one foot in the box at all times (barring exceptions). This kind of cuts down on the time he takes fixing his gloves, throwing kisses to heaven, a visit to 3B coach and maybe adjusting his cup several times in one at bat.Intentional walks do not require a pitcher to throw four balls off the plate.

Also 12 seconds between each pitch (without time out) is doable.