MONIES

quote:

Originally posted by dbg_fan:
The gov't intervention you reference at the turn of the last century that solved all the labor problems is a direct ancestor of the player's union and the working salaries (outrageous bonuses for new players) you complain about now. You can't have it both ways. Either you agree to direct gov't regulation in your economics (See GM, Bank of America) or you don't (See Ford, USAA).

Bottom line: why do we care what these guys make? It is none of our business. If you argue that it is imperative for the world to know & restrict what Strasburg's bonus will be this year, then it is equally imperative for you to publicize your compensation package for society's approval & accept a potential restriction of your income.

Just because it went bad doesn't mean it is bad. Do you really want to go back to the 16 hour days 6 days a week? Without unions and government regulations to stop those practices that is what it will go back to.

I grew up in Southern WV in coal mining country. I was born union, raised union and support the union - IF IT'S DONE RIGHT. Right now it's not being done right. That is where the government needs to step in. The automobile industry is in trouble because of the union. They got so strong their workers were making outrageous salaries. So that leads to higher priced cars and that leads to buying foreign cars. When I was a young kid the union was strong and made tremendous strides in the area. Men and women put their hours in, got a good wage and was able to spend time at home with their family. Now the union has almost died out because things got too good. Plus non-mines started paying higher which attracted guys who are now my age when they were getting out of high school. They didn't bother to look at the whole picture. That higher salary made them think it was a better deal when in fact for now they are going back to the way it was. Guys are putting in 60 hour weeks and if they want to take the day off to be at their kids birthday parties they get fired. Trust me I graduated with a guy this happened to.

There has to be that balance between government, workers and owners. If not one side or the other will take over and it will get ugly. True socialism doesn't work. True communism doesn't work. True capitalism doesn't work. It takes a little bit of a mixture of all three to make it work. You need to protect the workers from the owners but you also need to protect the owners from the workers (high salaries when the market won't / can't handle it).

I personally think that baseball is different than other sports. MLB gives them a 1 time bonus, then they get the 1k or so per month after that...for six months. The NBA gives them a 3 yr deal on the sliding scale. Most 1st rounders in MLB dont get more than a 3 million dollar signing bonus and thats about what the sliding scale guys get over 3 yrs. But the biggest difference is the NBA guys go right into the league, so most all the 1st rounders sign some type of endorcement deals that makes their sliding scale salery chump change....imo

quote:

I grew up in Southern WV in coal mining country. I was born union, raised union and support the union

My maternal grandfather and both maternal great grandfathers worked in those same mines. (Omar & Bluefield, WV. Norton & Calvin, VA). I am familiar via family stories with the conditions you describe.

Regardless of one's background, IMO it boils down to whether you respect liberty and private property rights (including the right to large MLB signing bonuses) or if you prefer Gov't intervention into the private lives of citizens (such as regulating income levels of citizens in various industries - like MLB bonuses).

I enjoyed the exchange of ideas.

quote:

Originally posted by dbg_fan:

quote:

I grew up in Southern WV in coal mining country. I was born union, raised union and support the union

My maternal grandfather and both maternal great grandfathers worked in those same mines. (Omar & Bluefield, WV. Norton & Calvin, VA). I am familiar via family stories with the conditions you describe.

Regardless of one's background, IMO it boils down to whether you respect liberty and private property rights (including the right to large MLB signing bonuses) or if you prefer Gov't intervention into the private lives of citizens (such as regulating income levels of citizens in various industries - like MLB bonuses).

I enjoyed the exchange of ideas.

It has been a great exchange and I have enjoyed. I grew up in Matewan which was pretty close to Omar so we are talking the same neighborhood. Glad to see another great person on here.

I see where you are coming from but I just think that when people are involved it doesn't work. On paper capitalism, communism, socialism and all the others actually work. It gets messed up when people - private citizens & government - get involved. I stronly believe there has to be a balance between the two groups to make it work but it's a very difficult thing to achieve.

I would love to see it be a true laissez faire situation but it's not going to happen when there are greedy people / governments in the world.

Almost started preparing lunch.

What Hall of Famer said:
"M....M...., along with B... R... and J.. R..., is one of the most important men in baseball history?"

Too bad for the NBA, NFL & NHL, the MLBPA figured it out the first, & a long time ago. Baseball is that great, isn't it!

quote:

There has to be that balance between government, workers and owners. If not one side or the other will take over and it will get ugly. True socialism doesn't work. True communism doesn't work. True capitalism doesn't work. It takes a little bit of a mixture of all three to make it work. You need to protect the workers from the owners but you also need to protect the owners from the workers (high salaries when the market won't / can't handle it).

I couldn't have said it better. You are right on the money. As a big union supporter, I agree there has to be a balance where CEOs can make their loot off the backs of the workers these peeps get rich off should have a fair share in good wages. When the balance shifts completely to one side, it's a recipe for economic disaster.