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NCAA allowing Florida State to use its Seminole mascot

Bighit15Bighit155,000+ posts
from USA Today

NCAA allowing Florida State to use its Seminole mascot
From staff and wire reports
TALLAHASSEE, Fla. — The NCAA will allow Florida State to use its Seminoles nickname in postseason play, removing the school from a list of colleges with Native American nicknames that were restricted by an NCAA decision earlier this month.

Florida State is free to use its Seminoles mascot at NCAA events.
By Phil Coale, AP

The NCAA said it was recognizing the relationship Florida State has long enjoyed with the Seminole Tribe of Florida, which assists the university with its pageantry and celebration of its culture and supports the school's use of its name.

"The staff review committee noted the unique relationship between the university and the Seminole Tribe of Florida as a significant factor," the NCAA said Tuesday. "The decision of a namesake sovereign tribe, regarding when and how its name and imagery can be used, must be respected even when others may not agree."

Florida State President T.K. Wetherell had threatened to sue the NCAA immediately after its Aug. 5 announcement that the school's highly visible nickname, "Seminoles," was defined as "hostile and abusive" by a committee.

The NCAA said it would handle reviews from other schools on a case-by-case basis. The Illinois Fighting Illini, Utah Utes and North Dakota Fighting Sioux are among other prominent school nicknames that remain affected by the edict.

No other school has appealed, however North Dakota says it has approval from the Sioux Tribe. Utah is working with the Utes on its appeal.

Under the NCAA restrictions, teams with American Indian nicknames would not be able to use them in postseason tournaments.

Florida State was among 18 schools that were told earlier this month by the NCAA that its use of Native American mascot was inappropriate. The NCAA said those schools would be required to cover any offensive images during postseason events and would ineligible to host
"Don't sweat the small stuff." "I am responsible for the effort -- not the outcome. "
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H HiHardHeat1,000+ posts
1. The NCAA has relented on punishing baseball for kids going pro after their junior seasons. PROVIDED that they end their junior year in good academic standing, it won't be counted against the program.

2. The very fact that the NCAA has relented in the Florida State situation takes all of the teeth out of their political correctness. Now, if they decide to ban a program because of being politically incorrect, the are subject to a huge expense justifying it in court ... and they don't have a leg to stand on. The only reason that they surrendered to Florida State is the threat of lawsuits and political pressure. This "NCAA proposal" can be honestly ignored by all colleges and universities if they so desire and are willing to defend their position. I wouldn't be changing my mascot TO a seminole or a redskin or any other similar name, but there is no use to change it away from that.

3. I personally feel that we discriminate against other minorities and groups. The negative use of "Vikings" is offensive to at least one Norseman (who doesn't live in Minnesota). The "Fighting Irish" cast them in a bad light as being unable to adjust to politically correct society (they could be the pacifist Irish ... that would be Ok).

4. If you are going to be politically correct, then go all the way!!!!!! Get rid of any mascot that can be identified with any racial, ethnic or working group. Camels, Elephants and Hippos are always safe to choose. Ditto dingbats, wombats and wallabys. Avoid Triggerfish (to violent).
AKBaseball6AKBaseball61,000+ posts
Why does FL State get off the hook in this case? Is it because the school is big and has a lot of $$ and a good athletic program to boot? Or is it really the Seminole character that they suddenly decide isn't offensive anymore?

Personally I don't mind what school names are as long as it isn't blatantly offensive to a majority. I just don't understand why Florida State gets off so easy when it looked like something that the NCAA was going to pursue in a hard manner. What about the other schools that don't have the big name school or the booming athletic department?
hokieonehokieone5,000+ posts
Gee, what a novel idea, the NCAA actually listened to the Seminoles (the real ones) say they weren't offended.....

Personally, I think it's right darned demeaning and condescending for the NCAA to decide certain groups are offended, whether or not in fact they are. Why not simply put the burden on the schools (like they need more paperwork) to submit verification that their mascot is not demeaning?

Gee, then Virginia Tech can submit affidavits from Turkey growers, UVA can garner letters of support from swash-buckling pirates (that's what their horse-riding "thing" most resembles), Maryland can get letters from Turtle Lover Societies, etc.,etc., and the NCAA can hire a few more employees to read all of this stuff.

IMHO, just a dumb area for the NCAA to enter, when there are more important issues out there. NCAA should just withdraw it's edict, and if groups are offended by any particular mascot, they can take it up with the school. The NCAA can use all that otherwise unused "enforcement money" to fund baseball scholarships.
Last edited by hokieone
CADadCADad5,000+ posts
HHH,
Whoa there. Camels, Elephants and Hippos tend to be from certain geographic locales and could be connected to some ethnic groups or nationalities. I don't think they are politically correct at all. How insensitive can you be? I'll have to forward this to the NCAA so they can make an appropriate knee jerk reaction. Smile
H HiHardHeat1,000+ posts
The "Spartans" may be offensive to a Greek (unless the team has a winning record like the originals under that name).

You can't have an Indian name, but you are allowed to use "Saint" and "Monk" ... does that mean the the NCAA is being blind to certain forms of prejudice? It's Ok to brand a school as being "inappropriate" for ethnic but not religious names?

tisk, tisk .....

.........................and, with my tongue firmly embedded in my check ... later.
S soxnole1,000+ posts
AKbaseball.....since you posed the question:

The Florida State University and the Seminole Tribe of Florida have worked hand in hand for over 35 years to reflect the true traditions of the ONLY un-conquered Indian Tribe. Colors, Symbols (such as the palomino horse Renegade and the charachter Chief Osceola), garments and logos have ALL been approved by the Seminole Tribe. This is an on-going tradition with a very mutual respect. The Seminole Tribe and FSU consider Chief Osceola a "symbol" not a "mascot". Chief Osceola was probably the bravest of all Indian Chief's and his people survived the slaughter purpetrated by Union soldiers during his entire lifetime. His history is to be revered and the NCAA found out about him and the Florida Tribe's enthusiastic acceptance of the University's use of thier name only after lumping all school's with Native American reference together.

Pdog. The Seminole Tribe of Oklahoma voted to support the Noles use of the seminole name 18-2!
A fellow named David Narcomey (Oklahoma Tribe)is a vociferous opponent. I believe the Oklahoma vote has shown that he is in the extreme minority.

hihardheat. I am actually in agreement with the NCAA with regard to the demeaning nature of schools using "Indians or Savages" etc. I am not in agreement with thier becoming an enforcer rather than a guiding light to these schools. As an example the University of Illinois has a "Chief Illiniwek" which is a ficticious charachter that does silly dances and basically would be an embrassment to any Native American.
O OldVaman500+ posts
As someone who grew up a Patriot and a Brave, and a parent of an Islander, Ram, Spider, Roadrunner, Eagle and Spartan, I have a different take on all of this.

I think the NCAA should pass a rule that nicknames SHOULD BE as offensive as possible.

Nicknames are supposed to raise the spirit of a team. Well, call Notre Dame the Drunken Irish and see what happens to you. Call a Colt a Gelding, a Tiger a Puddytat ... you get the picture.

They keep saying these games are going to be wars, well, let's give 'em one (horrible news pun intentional). Let's have fans taking up arms for games, stuff like that.

Yo, OldVa, they do that now. Ever been to West Virginia? Or Army?

Oh ... never mind.

Saluki.
AKBaseball6AKBaseball61,000+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by soxnole:
AKbaseball.....since you posed the question:

The Florida State University and the Seminole Tribe of Florida have worked hand in hand for over 35 years to reflect the true traditions of the ONLY un-conquered Indian Tribe. Colors, Symbols (such as the palomino horse Renegade and the charachter Chief Osceola), garments and logos have ALL been approved by the Seminole Tribe. This is an on-going tradition with a very mutual respect. The Seminole Tribe and FSU consider Chief Osceola a "symbol" not a "mascot". Chief Osceola was probably the bravest of all Indian Chief's and his people survived the slaughter purpetrated by Union soldiers during his entire lifetime. His history is to be revered and the NCAA found out about him and the Florida Tribe's enthusiastic acceptance of the University's use of thier name only after lumping all school's with Native American reference together.


Sox Nole, Thanks for the clarification. It is starting to make some sense. Smile

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