New CBA increases draft pressures

This is interesting. Even with a kid that it may effect, I can see where an MLB team should not be held hostage by a player with no experience.

With that said, teams are going to have to do their homework before the draft in order to really establish signability issues. I wonder if pre-draft agreements will become a more popular avenue?

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I wonder if pre-draft agreements will become a more popular avenue?

If this gives the players less leverage as suggested, then you would think pre-draft agreements would have been more popular under the old system because the players had more options under that system and thus, the pre-draft agreement would provide more certainty for the teams

It's funny, two names came to mind when I read infielddad's post. Scott Boras and Luke Hochevar.

Anyone who believes that anything in the CBA is done with "due consideration" of the needs of the amateur baseball player is a FOOL!.

Pro baseball (MLB) and pro baseball players (minors) don't care about anyone but themselves or we would already have a minor league union in place.

To suggest that somehow, they would do ANYTHING that would benefit talented amateurs, is ludicrous. Simple as that.

FYI

Contract highlights:

http://mlb.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/press_releases/press...b&fext=.jsp&c_id=mlb

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Anyone who believes that anything in the CBA is done with "due consideration" of the needs of the amateur baseball player is a FOOL!.

I know I don't understand all the angles but what "consideration" is due to anyone who is not covered under major League CBA?

rz,
I would imagine there will be LOTS of pre draft talk. I look at this as more favorable because at least player has an idea of what's ahead. It goes against NCAA rules, and could jeopardize scholarships?

I don't see those agents advising clients to hold out for more money being too happy. After all, isn't that what holds things up?

If MLB were smart, they would figure out a way to give each slot in the first 10 rounds a value, a fair value, with some leeway for school. Then you know just what the story is. JMO.

Here are the draft highlites...

Amateur Draft
1. Clubs that fail to sign first or second round draft pick will receive the same pick in the subsequent draft as compensation. Club that fails to sign a third round pick will receive a sandwich pick between rounds three and four in the subsequent draft as compensation.
2. Period of time before a Player must be protected from the Rule 5 Draft is changed from three or four years from first minor league season to four or five years from year of signing.
3. Signing deadline of August 15 for draft picks other than college seniors.

Draft Choice Compensation
1. Type C free agents eliminated in 2006
2. Also in 2006, compensation for type B players becomes indirect (sandwich pick) as opposed to direct compensation from signing Club.
3. Effective 2007, Type A players limited to top 20 percent of each position (down from 30 percent) and Type B players become 21 percent - 40 percent at each position (rather than 31 percent - 50 percent).
4. Salary arbitration offer and acceptance dates move to December 1 and December 7.

Minimum Salary
1. Major League: $380,000 in 2007, $390,000 in 2008 and $400,000 in 2009, COLA in 2011.
2. Minor League: $60,000 in 2007, $62,500 in 2008, $65,000 in 2009.
3. New minimum for first time roster players of 50% of minor league minimum.
4. Maximum cut rule applicable to split contracts reduced to 60% from 80%.

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2. Minor League: $60,000 in 2007, $62,500 in 2008, $65,000 in 2009.
3. New minimum for first time roster players of 50% of minor league minimum.

Can someone explain what this means

The minor league minimum is for what type of players? Triple A? What is the 50% rule? First year minor league players make $30,000?

Confused

Seems to me that the clause would simply shorten up the draft considerably. Most of the later rounds are for draft and follow purposes as far as I can tell so if you can't benefit from having a season to look at a kid why bother drafting them.

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Originally posted by ClevelandDad:

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2. Minor League: $60,000 in 2007, $62,500 in 2008, $65,000 in 2009.
3. New minimum for first time roster players of 50% of minor league minimum.

Can someone explain what this means

The minor league minimum is for what type of players? Triple A? What is the 50% rule? First year minor league players make $30,000?

Confused

me too..confused. Minimum salary, 60K? Now that's BIG news!

ha, i hope we start making 60K a year, it would make life in the minors a LOT easier. I guess i'll just have to wait until i get my next years salary form to see if its true. Where did you get this information from anyway?

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Originally posted by ClevelandDad:

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2. Minor League: $60,000 in 2007, $62,500 in 2008, $65,000 in 2009.
3. New minimum for first time roster players of 50% of minor league minimum.

Can someone explain what this means

The minor league minimum is for what type of players? Triple A? What is the 50% rule? First year minor league players make $30,000?

Confused

CD, my guess, and it is just a guess, is that those figures apply to minor league players who have reached the point of free agency and can sign/negotiate to play with any club.
This does not apply to players who sign following the draft and are bound to their club for the next 6 years, or until they are released from that contract by the club. Bottom line, these salaries are the minimums for players who are free agents. They do not apply to minor leaguers covered by the standard contract...although I sure wish it did!!!

infielddad - I just did some googling on the subject of minor league salaries. Under the old system (from article on CBS news site):

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The minimum minor league salary for players on 40-man rosters for at least the second year or with at least one day of major league service will increase from $52,600 to $54,500, the commissioner's office said Tuesday.

I am guessing maybe these minimum numbers published in this new agreement are similar to the old agreement i.e., for those players listed on the 40 man rosters for at least the second year or who have had at least one day of mlb service as the previous agreement was structured.

CD, I think your "Googling" is a lot more accurate than my "guessing."
Your approach makes much for sense. This is the MLB collecitve bargaining agreement and would cover issues at the major league level. Regulating salaries for those on the 40 man and those who are called up during the season would be MLB issues. Free agency at the minor league level would not.
For those who have suggested, in the past, that you do not need an advisor/agent to play professional baseball, this is pretty good information, in my view, to say you do.

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For those who have suggested, in the past, that you do not need an advisor/agent to play professional baseball, this is pretty good information, in my view, to say you do.

This looks like very good advice to me as well The 50% rule then makes sense if viewed in terms of the 40 man roster. Thus, the first time you make a 40 man roster you will be making at least $30,000 if I am interpreting things correctly.

AHSPitcher17 - the next goal is to get you on the 40 man roster

I asked son's advisor.
The 60K is only for major league roster players who are in the minor leagues, not all minor leaguers.
He states he has a meeting with the union soon to try to get interpretation. I guess we are not the only ones confused!

Sorry, AHSPitcher17, no raise yet!

ha, ya i asked my agent about it, a couple of my team mates saw this too and were going nuts, so i called him, turns out it is only for the 40 man

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it would make life in the minors a LOT easier

Isn't this a shame? Professional players in the low minors continuing to complain about the minimal amount of money that they make and they can't support themselves.

Some things never change 1966 to 2006...40 years of screwing minor leaguers.

Been,

I hear where you're coming from and on the side of kindness it sucks. But, I wonder of the 1500 or so that are drafted each year what percentage is considered a throw away resource? Many are there to eat innings, be a pitching machine, and/or live batter for the few that are earmarked a "prospect". This a very short stop in the conclusion of a players dream to go as far as he can playing baseball. In a very shallow way I almost see them as a very high level "limited term employee (LTE)" and in the real business and in the real world those people are treated the same way. Most outgrow their need, some move on to greener pastures, but a few diamonds in the rough show their worth and stay on as a full time employee. The difference is those in the real world do it to survive, in baseball I think they do it for the passion of the game and to realize the end of a great ride. I'll bet that if you asked, many would even do it for less.

rz,

http://www.baseballamerica.com/today/draft/news/262720.html

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I'll bet that if you asked, many would even do it for less.

Sure they would, RZ. That is the shame of the game. MLB has convinced everyone in America that you will make millions and play on TV each night. I would guess that less than 5% of all players drafted each year have more than a cup of coffee in the big leagues.

How can kids survive getting paid minimal money for a 3-4 month period of time? Then, they have to get a menial part-time job as a greeter at Wal-Mart or ruin their bodies in construction to make ends meet. Better still...they depend on mom and dad to pay their bills.

I'm not talking about the first few rounds where they get nice bonus money. I'm talking about the drafts from the 10-50 rounds who get virtually nothing except a plane ticket to a short season league and $10.00 in McDonald's tickets. Then, a couple of seasons later, when they get released...they're shell-shocked about the experience.

I've talked with several minor leaguers (drafted in the lower rounds each year) in the past few years who are absolutely STUNNED when they are not even offered a "nominal" bonus ($1,000-5,000) to sign!

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by rz: "limited term employee (LTE)"

that's a pretty good analogy - and MLB is like a "Manpower Temps" service managing a low wage labor pool of those "limited term employees"


it's really a sweet deal for all except the players "temps" -

MLB gets very good afiliate & franchise fees from the minor league team owners

Team owners are provided "skilled temps" AND are doing record business - parks are packed

AND, being a taxpayer, I helped build two "A" ballparks and a "AA" staduim in the area so the "temps" have a nice place to work



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BA has a series of relatively informative articles on the changes to the June draft(Rule IV) and the Rule V draft. It is clear from the Manfreddi interview that MLB sees the Rule IV changes as a way to control bonuses, try and enforce slot money more consistently and to avoid bigger bonuses paid to later picks/former draft and follows. One article says the changes will cause some "agents" to leverage things so only the bigger market teams will sign the "better" talent and they will pay above slot in the first and later rounds. From my reading of this, it seems the top tier draft picks with the best "agent/advisor" will leverage small market teams with potential demands. Those players will fall to the bigger market teams for several rounds. Slot money will be pressured on small market teams. To my way of thinking, those using an "advisor" and who don't wish to risk NCAA eligibility are really going to be at a disadvantage unless they know how this works and can make this work. Those represented by Boras and the like seem to have even more leverage. All this of course depends on MLB being able to control...or not the Yankees/Red Sox/Cubs, etc. If they continue to rebel, then Boros, et.al have leverage. If they all went pure slot money, which won't happen, things get quite interesting.
While it could have been more in depth, there is a good article showing how the Rule V changes impact. Describes a number of very disgruntled players who went to the Arizona Fall League thinking a good performance could get them a better or different opportunity come December and the Rule V draft. For those who just completed their 3rd year and are in a logjam with their club, or in need of a change of scenery, they are stuck for another year as the Rule V changes are effective immediately. While the MLBPA rep, reading between the lines, comes across as saying we wanted to "protect" the minor leaguers, he also clearly says the owners wanted these items and "we" didn't care too much and used them as giveaways to save things the major league level.

Changes to the rule 5 draft again helps the big clubs save money on the backs of the minor leaguers. but the major league players got a nice raise

Yup!!! Wonder what Marvin Miller would say?

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Amateur Draft
1. Clubs that fail to sign first or second round draft pick will receive the same pick in the subsequent draft as compensation. Club that fails to sign a third round pick will receive a sandwich pick between rounds three and four in the subsequent draft as compensation.

Unless some information is missing this tells me that in a weak draft a team might "intentionally" low ball not sign their first rounders and save their pick for the next year when the draft would be considered better.

Take 2006 vs. this year. 2006 by all accounts was terrible and 2007 is supposed to one of the best ever hmmm. Stategy -- Offer your pick peanuts, if he takes it sign him, if not get a better guy in the same spot next year. This seems too obvious to me. What am I missing?

What happens when a team has say the 1st overall pick - doesn't sign him where does the worst team then pick?

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What happens when a team has say the 1st overall pick - doesn't sign him where does the worst team then pick?

Do they loss the right's to that player after aug.15th

If so does player become free agent after aug. 15th

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Do they loss the right's to that player after aug.15th

If so does player become free agent after aug. 15th

EH, good questions. The answer to the first is yes, they lose the draft rights to that player. The team gets "compensation" though. In the next draft, they, apparently, have that same pick in the draft in addition to their regular pick.
The answer to the 2nd is a resounding NO. If the player is not signed by 8/15, unless he is a senior sign, he goes back into the draft and waits until next June.

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The team gets "compensation" though. In the next draft, they, apparently, have that same pick in the draft in addition to their regular pick.

That just doesn't sound right to me, That they get 2 pick's because they lost one.
But it would allow the small market team's a chance to get player's in there farm system.
Maybe 1st rd. player won't play for the small market team??
And that way the small market team could be compensated?
Just a thought.
I can't imagine any player not wanting to play for whomever want's you in the draft.
EH

Also if player was a Senior in College, And had a steller year.
Was thought to be a 1st or 2nd rd. pick.
He could wait out the team that Drafted him, and become a free agent.
Now that doesn't sound all that bad for the player.
But the same thing happen's, small market team's might lose player to the larger market team's??
EH

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I can't imagine any player not wanting to play for whomever want's you in the draft.

EH, most do. However, enough don't so that MLB has negotiated these changes.
As I indicated before, one BA article says this will result in more maneuvering in the draft because the big market clubs will pay above slot, agents will price their client out of slot so small market teams won't select them and, seemingly, the rich will get richer.

Signability will come into question for sure.

EH,

I have in front of me a reasonable facimale(sp) of the new CBA. The key phrase in relation to your post appears to be ......"except for those players who have utilized all of their NCAA eligibility".

I would guess that unless you are a 4th year college SR.(now,after 15 Aug., a free-agent), you will be re-entered into the next year's draft process.

I would also guess that most MLb clubs may be prepared to deal with a Sr. draftee in the "Harrington" manner after August 15th.

Thank's OPP, That make's more since.

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Unless some information is missing this tells me that in a weak draft a team might "intentionally" low ball not sign their first rounders and save their pick for the next year when the draft would be considered better.

Take 2006 vs. this year. 2006 by all accounts was terrible and 2007 is supposed to one of the best ever hmmm. Stategy -- Offer your pick peanuts, if he takes it sign him, if not get a better guy in the same spot next year. This seems too obvious to me. What am I missing?

MrMom, I am with you on this one.

I have been reading some of the discussions going about the new CBA and I must be confused. I, too, can’t see how this couldn’t or wouldn’t be abused. Like this year, we all kept hearing about how bad 2006 drafting class was and that 2007’s would be one of the better drafts in years. To me if a club thinks it can have a MUCH better prospect next year in the first or second round, then what would keep that organization from picking a kid they know won’t sign for the better pick next year?

As far as the DFE’s go, IMO it will probably hurt the clubs that develops their players more than the wealthier clubs who can pay for them already developed. A club will no longer be able to draft a player they think might “develop” and keep them under their control. I really can’t see it hurting the draft and follow prospect that much since he isn’t guaranteed anything by going to JUCO in the first place.

I am still trying to figure out how all this will affect next year’s draft.

What % of Draft and Follows sign anyway?

What % of the total draft sign after 8/15 in the past 5 years?

If baseball is having trouble signing the really good athletes and they lose them to football, how will this affect that? Is there that many where it doesn't matter?

How many players sign on average in any given draft? How many less will sign?

How many teams will drop out after 30 rounds, or do you keep drafting because the early rounds may actually be harder to sign?

MLB gets a bargain because it is not subject to anti-trust laws. If the economic value of a MLB player is $1.2M on average and 5% of these kids feed to MLB, then bonuses should be related to future worth. Assuming that baseball breaks even on minor league players as they develop to major league quality, and assuming 5% make it to the "show", the worth of the draft should be 5% x $1.2M x 1,500 players (less the cost of the draft system). That is $90M less the costs of the draft. Is that about what is paid out each year in signing bonuses? What this agreement did is shift the payment by increasing league minimums to proven players who have been through the system. The contract did not create more money in the system, it merely transferred it to the proven players by increasing the ML league minimum.

To be continued...