The University of New Orleans has announced that they may move from Division I to Division III.
This follows a similar announcement this past July by fellow Louisiana school Centenary
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Birmingham Southern which had a fine D1 program made this same move a few years back.
I suppose this is yet another economic casualty as state funding has been cut to all universities under the state system. I'm sure that this was not an easy decision to make on the part of the administration. There was supposedly funding that was supposed to be obtained from George Shinn (N.O. Hornets Owner) as well as a weatly supporter's estate who had passed away. Obviously, the funding has not materialized to this point.
I truly feel for the school as a whole as well as the student athletes there even though this is perhaps just another hurdle in theor baseball journey. My son was recruited by UNO and chose another school due to this potential issue. Signing day for us today was a dream come true. However, for the kids who committed early to UNO this was not the case. I'm finding it hard to understand the reasoning of not notifying the kids who gave their verbal commitment to UNO PRIOR TO SIGNING DAY! The only thing I can think is that UNO was holding out hope of "miracle funding" to arrive just in time. No matter the reason for not informing the early signees, the results are gut wrenching. The following is an excerpt (link included) of one of the players and his familie's dream come true turn into a nightmare:
"My son was one of these kids to have schloarship papers pulled today. We had a signing day party planned. I can't even begin to express our disappointment. I have called Mr Ryan to get an explanation but have yet to receive a call back. We had 4 relatives from out of town who were flying in. Is Mr. Ryan going to compensate my family members for travel expenses after pulling this at the last minute. My son decided on UNO over Southeastern, LA Tech, ULL, and several junior colleges. Those schools now don't have any room for my son. What can we do Tim Ryan......
http://www.neworleans.com/inde...id=258028&Itemid=577
For all of us who were lucky enough to escape this type of heartbreak, I hope we realize that we have one more reason to be thankful. Because of this great website, we learned to perform due diligence which may very well have helped us to avoid this type of experience. Thanks to all of you and best wishes to all UNO baseball players.
I truly feel for the school as a whole as well as the student athletes there even though this is perhaps just another hurdle in theor baseball journey. My son was recruited by UNO and chose another school due to this potential issue. Signing day for us today was a dream come true. However, for the kids who committed early to UNO this was not the case. I'm finding it hard to understand the reasoning of not notifying the kids who gave their verbal commitment to UNO PRIOR TO SIGNING DAY! The only thing I can think is that UNO was holding out hope of "miracle funding" to arrive just in time. No matter the reason for not informing the early signees, the results are gut wrenching. The following is an excerpt (link included) of one of the players and his familie's dream come true turn into a nightmare:
"My son was one of these kids to have schloarship papers pulled today. We had a signing day party planned. I can't even begin to express our disappointment. I have called Mr Ryan to get an explanation but have yet to receive a call back. We had 4 relatives from out of town who were flying in. Is Mr. Ryan going to compensate my family members for travel expenses after pulling this at the last minute. My son decided on UNO over Southeastern, LA Tech, ULL, and several junior colleges. Those schools now don't have any room for my son. What can we do Tim Ryan......
http://www.neworleans.com/inde...id=258028&Itemid=577
For all of us who were lucky enough to escape this type of heartbreak, I hope we realize that we have one more reason to be thankful. Because of this great website, we learned to perform due diligence which may very well have helped us to avoid this type of experience. Thanks to all of you and best wishes to all UNO baseball players.
I heard last spring UNO was likely dropping athletics, altogether. It was public information. UNO had a 20% budget cut. The head coach quit in June. I'm sure everyone who needed to know, was aware of the situation. The C/O 2009, 2008 and 2007 guys got a bad deal, though.
We were likewise being recruited by UNO. Something just didn't seem right with all the issues with their funding. I think they will get some funding from Shinn and the estate, it is just a matter of how long before it comes in. We didn't want to take a chance on that being tide up for a few years.
I was reading the same excerpt you shared earlier today and felt terrible for the young man and his family. I hope all works out for the players, their families and the school. Like you feel very fortunate to have listened and learned from others on this site. We are in the ideal place for my son as a result of what has been shared with us by others. Thanks to all.
I was reading the same excerpt you shared earlier today and felt terrible for the young man and his family. I hope all works out for the players, their families and the school. Like you feel very fortunate to have listened and learned from others on this site. We are in the ideal place for my son as a result of what has been shared with us by others. Thanks to all.
quote:"My son was one of these kids to have schloarship papers pulled today. We had a signing day party planned. I can't even begin to express our disappointment. I have called Mr Ryan to get an explanation but have yet to receive a call back. We had 4 relatives from out of town who were flying in. Is Mr. Ryan going to compensate my family members for travel expenses after pulling this at the last minute. My son decided on UNO over Southeastern, LA Tech, ULL, and several junior colleges. Those schools now don't have any room for my son. What can we do Tim Ryan......
http://www.neworleans.com/inde...id=258028&Itemid=577
For all of us who were lucky enough to escape this type of heartbreak, I hope we realize that we have one more reason to be thankful.
I wonder if this type of information is making more of a NLI that it really should be. I am not condoning the manner in which UNO managed these issues with their recruits. But, honestly, flying in family members, wanting to know if they will be reimbursed? Escaping the "heartbreak?"
I am probably out on the end of the plank but, to be honest, what really is the NLI? It is an invitation to come and try out for the team, and we pay 25% or more of a one year scholarship.
Is the UNO experience a suggestion that we, as adults, are making more of this, than it needs to be, truly is, and should be?
quote:Originally posted by infielddad:quote:"My son was one of these kids to have schloarship papers pulled today. We had a signing day party planned. I can't even begin to express our disappointment. I have called Mr Ryan to get an explanation but have yet to receive a call back. We had 4 relatives from out of town who were flying in. Is Mr. Ryan going to compensate my family members for travel expenses after pulling this at the last minute. My son decided on UNO over Southeastern, LA Tech, ULL, and several junior colleges. Those schools now don't have any room for my son. What can we do Tim Ryan......
http://www.neworleans.com/inde...id=258028&Itemid=577
For all of us who were lucky enough to escape this type of heartbreak, I hope we realize that we have one more reason to be thankful.
I wonder if this type of information is making more of a NLI that it really should be. I am not condoning the manner in which UNO managed these issues with their recruits. But, honestly, flying in family members, wanting to know if they will be reimbursed? Escaping the "heartbreak?"
I am probably out on the end of the plank but, to be honest, what really is the NLI? It is an invitation to come and try out for the team, and we pay 25% or more of a one year scholarship.
Is the UNO experience a suggestion that we, as adults, are making more of this, than it needs to be, truly is, and should be?
I feel the same way. It's something to be proud of but flying people in seems to be taking things too far imho. It is a free country however, thus - to each his own
I get a sense sometimes that some feel they have arrived when they sign those papers. The arrival is when the coach writes your name in the lineup the first time which may indeed be worthy of flying people in. When/if you get into the lineup, you will have beaten out three or four or more other outstanding high school players who were equally as excited about signing their NLI's. Until then, lots of guys sign papers so humility and perspective is also a good thing imho.
Maybe they should have a big yellow warning label on NLIs.
This site is a great educator and it is important posters tell their stories so that others can go forward prepared for the possible pitfalls.
This site is a great educator and it is important posters tell their stories so that others can go forward prepared for the possible pitfalls.
Warning: Flying in relatives for a NLI signing may be hazardous to your wallet.quote:Originally posted by BobbleheadDoll:
Maybe they should have a big yellow warning label on NLIs.
This site is a great educator and it is important posters tell their stories so that others can go forward prepared for the possible pitfalls.
Sounds about right.
quote:I get a sense sometimes that some feel they have arrived when they sign those papers. The arrival is when the coach writes your name in the lineup the first time which may indeed be worthy of flying people in
I hear what you're saying CD, and as you also stated "each to his own", I think some folks do feel and rightly so they have arrived when they sign that NLI.
A young man putting in many years of hard work and a Coach or college offers you something that shows the work has paid off, it shows you are wanted, the NLI.
Of course the next level of hard work is just beginning, the task of having the scholly renewed and the challenge of having your name written into that everyday lineup.
Obviously it did not mean much at UNO, but that is the exception and not the rule.
Again, for some, the NLI is the "first sign" of arrival.
I concur with the sentiments posted here regarding possible "overdoing" of the event by flying people in. I also agree about it merely being a step forward on the road to collegiate success. However, it is a major step and an acknowledgement of your accomplishments "to date" for a 17 year old. As is customary with a lot of high schools, this particular kid was to be part of a ceremony at his school honoring not only himself, but four other members of his team who were signing NLIs at their school. While we can focus on the potential pitfalls that can occur (or be avoided) and discuss them, I'm sure that this is little comfort to the player himself.
I'm sure that this kid can bounce back and most likely will land somewhere. Like life, baseball is a journey that has many turns and twists along the way that cannot be forseen. I'd like to believe that this experience, although negative, will only make this kid stronger. The same can be said for the rest of the players that are currently on that roster who did earn a place on the line up card. The biggest issue I have with this particular occurence is that I can't help but feel some resentment towards an administration that breaks this news ON SIGNING DAY! Anyone would be hard pressed to conveince me that someone woke up yesterday morning and made this decision.
I'm sure that this kid can bounce back and most likely will land somewhere. Like life, baseball is a journey that has many turns and twists along the way that cannot be forseen. I'd like to believe that this experience, although negative, will only make this kid stronger. The same can be said for the rest of the players that are currently on that roster who did earn a place on the line up card. The biggest issue I have with this particular occurence is that I can't help but feel some resentment towards an administration that breaks this news ON SIGNING DAY! Anyone would be hard pressed to conveince me that someone woke up yesterday morning and made this decision.
quote:However, it is a major step and an acknowledgement of your accomplishments "to date" for a 17 year old.
I agree this is viewed as an acknowledgment of your accomplishments "to date." But so is graduation, getting accepted to college, standing up for what is right in school, standing up for a classmate who is being bullied and we don't see such fanfare for those.
Is it a "major step?"
It can be "created" as a major step. On the Rivals board, they are already posting the NLI's and recruiting classes. Colleges are doing the same. Signing parties do the same.
My question is whether all this effort by colleges and message boards and travel teams and showcases is creating something about an NLI that it isn't.
I question if it truly is a "major step." I am in full agreement with CD.
The reasons I am bringing this out is there is a great post by J H on this exact topic. He did not sign an NLI and he described the process of "not" signing one and how he felt. He also talks about how he is doing now. He puts into a wonderfully written thread a perspective that the NLI is a moment in time with nothing lasting.
Personally, I think the NLI can set up too many expectations, too high of expectations and is a very premature celebration.
When we are seeing a large number of topics on this site about players being cut/released/non-renewed, those threads, along with the post by JH, brings a reality to the process, for me at least.
Why is there such a major emphasis and celebration when some of the players for whom all this celebration is occurring will be headed out of that same program by December of 2010, or June of 2011, at the latest?
All I am suggesting is maybe it is time to rethink this entire process and question whether recruiting sites, colleges, and those who make their living off the reporting of this information are making, through advertising and commercialization, something about the NLI, which it really isn't.
Well now that the scholarship papers were pulled, and it is a D3, your son can back out.Be glad it happened now, and not a year from now when it would probably cause him to sit out a year to transfer.(I wonder how the NCAA would deal with this appeal.If program changes and scholarships are pulled, would they let a kid transfer wothout penalty.)
It is a bummer that he has to start over, but maybe a blessing that you know maybe the coach wasn't upfront.Unless coach did'nt know until after that program was changing for sure.
It is a bummer that he has to start over, but maybe a blessing that you know maybe the coach wasn't upfront.Unless coach did'nt know until after that program was changing for sure.
Infielddad, I am not disagreeing with you. I fully understand where you are coming from and agree. There are a ton of things that are overblown, IMO. My only point was that I felt bad for the player who was affected and his family to some extent. Although we as adults, are able to put these things into perspective and know the ups and downs that go with the journey of baseball, most 17 year old kids do not. Being disappointed to this extent in front of other students had to be gut wrenching I'm sure. Fortunately, I don't have a dog in this hunt. But, I cannot help but feel for these kids.
Fanofgame, fortunately it was not my son that was involved. But I agree with you as well that these kids who committed early will have the opportunity to explore other options.
This is just one more example of how researching this process through wonderful sites like HSBBW are so helpful. Perhaps this thread will be visited by many and will be filed away in their memory banks when they are going through the recruiting process.
Do any of you have any opinions as to why these kids were not notified earlier assuming that the school's administration was aware of this prior to yesterday? Was it to protect the current roster from bailing? Just curious.
Fanofgame, fortunately it was not my son that was involved. But I agree with you as well that these kids who committed early will have the opportunity to explore other options.
This is just one more example of how researching this process through wonderful sites like HSBBW are so helpful. Perhaps this thread will be visited by many and will be filed away in their memory banks when they are going through the recruiting process.
Do any of you have any opinions as to why these kids were not notified earlier assuming that the school's administration was aware of this prior to yesterday? Was it to protect the current roster from bailing? Just curious.
Can someone clarify what is going on at UNO? There's a difference between announcing that they MAY go to D-3 on the one hand, and then finding out that they are already pulling NLI's (which I take it means they aren't shipping out paperwork to kids they'd promised them to).
Has "may" turned into something more definite?
I guess I know now why UNO's baseball coach was hitting the job market last June. Their loss is Wake's gain.
Has "may" turned into something more definite?
I guess I know now why UNO's baseball coach was hitting the job market last June. Their loss is Wake's gain.
philsdad,
When we look at this entire situation, a group of adults set up expectations on every side.
The coaching staff and athletic administration at UNO on one side and the families, coaches,etc on the other.
Right in the middle are the 17-18 year olds.
I could not agree more that for UNO to wait until now and withhold the NLI is...well, it is.....disgusting would be too nice of a word to choose.
Even more disgusting than withholding them is the apparent lack of any communication with/to those involved. These are supposed to be school administrators charged with teaching and guiding teens and setting examples to follow. Ugh.
When we look at this entire situation, a group of adults set up expectations on every side.
The coaching staff and athletic administration at UNO on one side and the families, coaches,etc on the other.
Right in the middle are the 17-18 year olds.
I could not agree more that for UNO to wait until now and withhold the NLI is...well, it is.....disgusting would be too nice of a word to choose.
Even more disgusting than withholding them is the apparent lack of any communication with/to those involved. These are supposed to be school administrators charged with teaching and guiding teens and setting examples to follow. Ugh.
There has been talk of this happening for over a year...And news coverage, as well, so no one in Louisiana should have been caught off guard...
Here's the full text of the press release from UNO:
The University of New Orleans is investigating a move from NCAA Division I-AAA to NCAA Division III status.
After the severe budget cuts of the 2009-2010 fiscal year and the failure of the student referendum to increase student fees for Athletics in the spring of 2009, the University administration established plans to maintain a Division I Athletic program with far more stringent financial constraints. This, along with fundraising efforts offered by outside entities, as well as a windfall donation from the Wick Cary estate seemed to shore up UNO Athletics, at least for the current fiscal year.
Unfortunately the private fundraising efforts did not materialize and the Cary estate is far less than anticipated and may take years to complete its distribution. These factors have forced the University administration to consider the future of UNO's Division I status.
"We had to reduce funding for athletics in the previous round of budget cuts and since then the financial picture of the University and the athletics program has not improved," said Chancellor Tim Ryan. In addition, the Governor has suggested that future budget reductions for higher education are likely.
This has prompted the University to investigate many options for athletics with the main goal of maintaining and enhancing UNO's mission and its focus on academics. Recently the administration began investigating the possibility of moving from Division I to Division III as a viable alternative.
"The good thing about Division III is the focus on student-athletes. Division III is about students having a NCAA Conference experience that is an enhancement to their academic pursuits and is also much more cost effective," noted Ryan.
The NCAA requires a multi-year process to move from Division I to Division II and UNO has made initial contact with NCAA officials to understand the requirements. "In Division III, universities cannot offer athletics scholarships and we are taking steps to ensure that we follow all NCAA guidelines and recommendations in this, the initial stages of consideration," Ryan said.
The possible move to Division III would allow UNO's club football and s****r teams to move to NCAA Division III as well. NCAA requirements for Division III are six sports per gender. UNO feels confident it could easily field the required number of sports if not more under the reduced costs of Division III programs.
The University hopes to complete its investigation in the coming months as the application would be due to the NCAA by May 15, 2010 to start the transformation process in the fall of 2010. All moves such as this are subject to approval by the LSU System as well as the NCAA.
Here's the full text of the press release from UNO:
The University of New Orleans is investigating a move from NCAA Division I-AAA to NCAA Division III status.
After the severe budget cuts of the 2009-2010 fiscal year and the failure of the student referendum to increase student fees for Athletics in the spring of 2009, the University administration established plans to maintain a Division I Athletic program with far more stringent financial constraints. This, along with fundraising efforts offered by outside entities, as well as a windfall donation from the Wick Cary estate seemed to shore up UNO Athletics, at least for the current fiscal year.
Unfortunately the private fundraising efforts did not materialize and the Cary estate is far less than anticipated and may take years to complete its distribution. These factors have forced the University administration to consider the future of UNO's Division I status.
"We had to reduce funding for athletics in the previous round of budget cuts and since then the financial picture of the University and the athletics program has not improved," said Chancellor Tim Ryan. In addition, the Governor has suggested that future budget reductions for higher education are likely.
This has prompted the University to investigate many options for athletics with the main goal of maintaining and enhancing UNO's mission and its focus on academics. Recently the administration began investigating the possibility of moving from Division I to Division III as a viable alternative.
"The good thing about Division III is the focus on student-athletes. Division III is about students having a NCAA Conference experience that is an enhancement to their academic pursuits and is also much more cost effective," noted Ryan.
The NCAA requires a multi-year process to move from Division I to Division II and UNO has made initial contact with NCAA officials to understand the requirements. "In Division III, universities cannot offer athletics scholarships and we are taking steps to ensure that we follow all NCAA guidelines and recommendations in this, the initial stages of consideration," Ryan said.
The possible move to Division III would allow UNO's club football and s****r teams to move to NCAA Division III as well. NCAA requirements for Division III are six sports per gender. UNO feels confident it could easily field the required number of sports if not more under the reduced costs of Division III programs.
The University hopes to complete its investigation in the coming months as the application would be due to the NCAA by May 15, 2010 to start the transformation process in the fall of 2010. All moves such as this are subject to approval by the LSU System as well as the NCAA.
Infielddad.....I have read a lot of your posts and once again.....I agree. My only concern is for the players who are affected by this......well....let me use the word mess. I know some of the kids that were to either sign with UNO or are already playing there. They were aware of issues but naturally were assured that there were no worries. Economic factors have caused a lot of cuts everywhere. My issue is not so much with the decision, as it may be the correct one. My dissatisfaction is with the timing.
quote:My dissatisfaction is with the timing.
Yup, could not agree more.
Personally, I am not overly impressed with the communication aspect either, based on what I have read. If those locally feel the potential has been clearly explained and the risks understood, that is good enough for me.
CD & IFD
To my son and family members the NLI is a big deal. We'll have a dinner and invite a few coaches who have been instrumental in his development the past 9 years to celebrate the event.
It's a "major step" because it's his first contract. Albeit a one year contract, it does have the potential to represent 10's of thousand of dollars over the course of his college career. He'll be required to perform. If not, he'll suffer the disgrace of being cut. The game he's played over half his life, is now a business.
I say celebrate the moment
To my son and family members the NLI is a big deal. We'll have a dinner and invite a few coaches who have been instrumental in his development the past 9 years to celebrate the event.
It's a "major step" because it's his first contract. Albeit a one year contract, it does have the potential to represent 10's of thousand of dollars over the course of his college career. He'll be required to perform. If not, he'll suffer the disgrace of being cut. The game he's played over half his life, is now a business.
I say celebrate the moment
quote:He'll be required to perform. If not, he'll suffer the disgrace of being cut.
There are some that performed very well and had their scholarships cut or not renewed.
dswann - I apologize. I probably went a bit too far with my comments. Flying people in sounds a bit much to me but if someone can afford it why not? What you describe sounds like a fun evening. Congrats to your son
dswann-
Congrats to your son. I agree with you, it is a big deal and a NLI is evidence that someone noticed the hard work that your son put in both on the field and in the classroom. NLI's do matter to some.
Again, congrats and keep up the good work!!
Congrats to your son. I agree with you, it is a big deal and a NLI is evidence that someone noticed the hard work that your son put in both on the field and in the classroom. NLI's do matter to some.
Again, congrats and keep up the good work!!
quote:To my son and family members the NLI is a big deal. We'll have a dinner and invite a few coaches who have been instrumental in his development the past 9 years to celebrate the event.
I did not mean to communicate, and don't feel that I did, that the NLI does not have meaning. My comments were directed to the information in the post about "heart broken," flying family members in, wanting the school to "reimburse: for these. My comments were also directed to the poignant post of J H who never signed a NLI, experienced all the "why not" you experiences, and is doing great in college and college baseball.
My question was whether the commercialization by the internet and those who "profit" were making the NLI take on a life and be something the NLI isn't.
dswann, it is neither my right nor my intent to interfere or contest the way you and your family and son choose to view and have a family/coaches celebration of the signing of his letter.
I am a player advocate.
I am a "game" of baseball advocate.
I almost "detest" the business of baseball and its every growing influence, at every level, into a "game." I have seen the "business" side and hope it does not impact your son in his effort to love and enjoy playing the game.
Our son has now transitioned from player to coach. Eventually, he will, hopefully, be offering NLI's. Clearly the NLI will be important to him if he gets a chance to run a DI program at some point.
The point I tried to make, and I think dswann helped crystallize, is the perspective of what the NLI means, and not letting those who profit from the NLI make it have a meaning that is more or different from the meaning of those who play the game, and their family.
infielddad,
Great post.
Great post.
I think infielddad was trying to make a point rearding his feelings toward commercialization of the NLI and not necessarily the meaning and merit of accomplishing this task. Even though I spent the evening celebrating my son's NLI with him last night, we did it our own way in the setting that he chose (with his mother's influence of course)lol. Our experience was not commercialized in any way. However, I do understand the point that infielddad is trying to make. If I understand correctly, his issue is with "businesses" that "USE" the NLI as the dangling carot and profit off of this document. For example, if you look at the high profile travel team's websites you will most likely find a list of the players who played for them who signed a NLI on the home page. While I am sure that many (most I assume) of these teams and their coaches are sincerely happy and proud that their kids were offered a NLI, I think we would all be naive if we did not acknowledge that this serves as much as an advertisement that says "pay me and I'll get you a NLI".
As I posted earlier, I feel that a NLI is a "major step" towards the dream of every kid who has ever swung a bat. I think it should be celebrated and acknowledged as a major accomplishment (see thread on grim stats). How it is celebrated or acknowledged will vary from individual to individual. Soak up every second of the accomplishment and then remind your son how much work he has left to do STARTING TODAY !!!
As I posted earlier, I feel that a NLI is a "major step" towards the dream of every kid who has ever swung a bat. I think it should be celebrated and acknowledged as a major accomplishment (see thread on grim stats). How it is celebrated or acknowledged will vary from individual to individual. Soak up every second of the accomplishment and then remind your son how much work he has left to do STARTING TODAY !!!