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This is very, very sad. I intend to show this to my teenage sons. Both because they admired Nick Adenhart and also because they are teenagers and it is a reminder that they should NEVER get behind the wheel after they have been drinking.
Never.
Never.
Only 45 years is allocated for the murders. And ONLY 15 years per murder. I don't know what "15 to life" means but he's already been parolled once, could it happen again?
The quote by the defense attorney is simply repulsive. I don't know how those people can sleep at night.
The quote by the defense attorney is simply repulsive. I don't know how those people can sleep at night.
the quote by the DA was the most prescient.
"There's just no good in this, there's just no good in this kind of thing anywhere..."
The only good in this is that Gallo will not kill anyone else for at least the next 15 years.
It does not change a thing for Del Dad or the rest of the Adenhart family.
DelDad, I am sure holidays are tough. I am sure this one is no less tough. I am very sorry for your loss.
It just stinks.
It does not change a thing for Del Dad or the rest of the Adenhart family.
DelDad, I am sure holidays are tough. I am sure this one is no less tough. I am very sorry for your loss.
It just stinks.
quote:Originally posted by playfair:
The only good in this is that Gallo will not kill anyone else for at least the next 15 years.
Our local paper said the sentences were to run consecutively....thus the 51 years.
A tragedy in every way, but especially for the young people who lost their lives or were severely injured and their loved ones. I'm sure there's little to no closure even with this decision. My sincerest condolences to Nick's dad, one of our fellow posters, and his whole family.
It just doesn't stop.
O.C. athlete, father killed; driver arrested
By ERIC CARPENTER
THE ORANGE COUNTY REGISTER
Story Highlights
Douglas Uselton, 17, student at Oxford Academy ID'd in wreck that also killed his father, Steven, 44.
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ARTICLE
BUENA PARK – A father and son were killed early Saturday when the car in which they were traveling was struck by a suspected drunken driver, police said.
Steven Uselton, 44, and his son Douglas, 17, both of Buena Park, died in the crash, police said.
Douglas Uselton, a senior at Oxford Academy, was a star athlete who played baseball and basketball, the school's principal Kathy Scott confirmed Saturday afternoon. He was on his way to the campus for a speech-and-debate tournament when the wreck occurred.
Uselton was a first baseman for the Oxford Patriots, who won a CIF championship last June.
"He was a truly amazing kid, a real leader on this campus," said Scott, who leads the Cypress-based Oxford Academy, a 7th- to 12th-grade school for academically gifted students routinely named among the best schools in the nation.
Uselton was an Oxford student since eighth grade, Scott said
"He was an All-American kid very much loved here at Oxford," she said.
At 5:35 a.m. Saturday, police were called to a report of a car wreck at Crescent and Knott avenues.
Investigators determined that the Useltons were traveling north on Knott in a 2000 Buick LeSabre when the car was struck by a 2009 Mitsubishi Lancer, police said. The Mitsubishi, driven by 18-year-old Angel Lopez of Anaheim, was heading west on Crescent.
Steven and Douglas Uselton were pronounced dead at the scene by paramedics, police said.
Lopez suffered minor injuries and was taken to West Anaheim Hospital.
Investigators determined that Lopez might have been driving under the influence of alcohol and arrested him upon his release from the hospital hours later, police said.
Lopez is being held on suspicion of two counts of vehicular manslaughter while intoxicated, Buena Park police Lt. Gary Worrall said.
No further information on Lopez's blood-alcohol level or whether speeding was a factor in the crash was immediately available. Worrall said the investigation is ongoing.
Douglas Uselton had been scheduled to participate in a speech tournament at Fullerton High School on Saturday morning, Scott said. Oxford instructors called the house, worried when Uselton didn't arrive at the school.
Grief counselors were brought in to talk with Uselton's teammates.
O.C. athlete, father killed; driver arrested
By ERIC CARPENTER
THE ORANGE COUNTY REGISTER
Story Highlights
Douglas Uselton, 17, student at Oxford Academy ID'd in wreck that also killed his father, Steven, 44.
Next Article »
6
Share
ARTICLE
BUENA PARK – A father and son were killed early Saturday when the car in which they were traveling was struck by a suspected drunken driver, police said.
Steven Uselton, 44, and his son Douglas, 17, both of Buena Park, died in the crash, police said.
Douglas Uselton, a senior at Oxford Academy, was a star athlete who played baseball and basketball, the school's principal Kathy Scott confirmed Saturday afternoon. He was on his way to the campus for a speech-and-debate tournament when the wreck occurred.
Uselton was a first baseman for the Oxford Patriots, who won a CIF championship last June.
"He was a truly amazing kid, a real leader on this campus," said Scott, who leads the Cypress-based Oxford Academy, a 7th- to 12th-grade school for academically gifted students routinely named among the best schools in the nation.
Uselton was an Oxford student since eighth grade, Scott said
"He was an All-American kid very much loved here at Oxford," she said.
At 5:35 a.m. Saturday, police were called to a report of a car wreck at Crescent and Knott avenues.
Investigators determined that the Useltons were traveling north on Knott in a 2000 Buick LeSabre when the car was struck by a 2009 Mitsubishi Lancer, police said. The Mitsubishi, driven by 18-year-old Angel Lopez of Anaheim, was heading west on Crescent.
Steven and Douglas Uselton were pronounced dead at the scene by paramedics, police said.
Lopez suffered minor injuries and was taken to West Anaheim Hospital.
Investigators determined that Lopez might have been driving under the influence of alcohol and arrested him upon his release from the hospital hours later, police said.
Lopez is being held on suspicion of two counts of vehicular manslaughter while intoxicated, Buena Park police Lt. Gary Worrall said.
No further information on Lopez's blood-alcohol level or whether speeding was a factor in the crash was immediately available. Worrall said the investigation is ongoing.
Douglas Uselton had been scheduled to participate in a speech tournament at Fullerton High School on Saturday morning, Scott said. Oxford instructors called the house, worried when Uselton didn't arrive at the school.
Grief counselors were brought in to talk with Uselton's teammates.
quote:Getting What All Drunk Drivers Deserve
I have debated all day about whether to post what I am about to say. My hesitation is related to my anguish for DelDad and his family, as well as my appreciation for Krak who is one of my favorite posters on this site. The deaths of Nick, Courtney Stewart, and Henry Pearson, and the suffering that Jon Wilhite will endure for the rest of his life, are unspeakable tragedies. When thinking about what happened that night, the anger and revulsion towards Andrew Gallo are completely understandable.
With that said, I confess that my perspective on these things has been affected recently. You see, my son, my beautiful, kind, sensitive boy, left for college in mid-August to begin fulfilling his dream of playing college baseball. A month into the semester some friends threw him a party to celebrate his 18th birthday. There was a lot of drinking at the party. What happened next is still murky because my son was so inebriated that he doesn't remember the details. He doesn't remember slipping out of the party and no one seeing him leave. He doesn't remember getting in his car and driving. He doesn't remember being pulled over by the officer and driving his car into a ditch. He doesn't remember being arrested and taken to jail. The first thing he remembers is waking up in jail next to a man who had been charged with murder.
When I got the call the next morning, I left immediately for my son's school. What I saw when I got there was a parental nightmare. The fear, shame, and shock on my son's face were obvious. He was shut down emotionally and could barely speak. I arrived angry at his stupidity and the dangerous mistake he had made. I was ready to remind him of Nick's death by a drunken driver because my son had been deeply moved by the tragedy. But when I saw his face, my anger turned to deep worry. My son was in trouble. I used to be a minister, and now I am a pastoral counselor. I have done funerals for young people who have committed suicide. I have counseled with many individuals who were on the brink of taking their life. The look on my son's face caused me to immediately remember many of those people I had counseled, or buried, over the years.
The days that followed were as painful as any my wife and I have endured as parents. We cried a lot, took turns getting angry, and worried out loud about what was going to become of our tortured son. We went down to his school many more times than we had intended to watch scrimmages and fall games, but mainly to check on him and look in his eyes. He slowly got better. He went to counseling. He went to court and gave a speech to the judge that was so full of genuine remorse that it clearly impacted the judge. He started attending alcohol counseling classes and took them seriously. He found people on his team who had been through the same thing and took whatever encouragement they could offer.
He is and will pay a heavy price for his mistake. He lost the respect of his coaches that he had earned during that first month of hard work. He will likely lose part or all of his scholarship next year. He lost the privilege to drive for at least a year, but it may be several years before he can afford the car insurance. Our family has lost thousands of dollars that we did not have to lose. But my son did not lose his life like Nick, Courtney, and Henry. And he did not lose his freedom.
So, Krak, should my son get what all drunk drivers deserve? Should he spend 50 years in prison? I don't know. But if you are wondering if people who commit this awful crime, and their families, suffer deeply because of it, I can tell you the answer is a painful yes.
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Wow! Powerful stuff!
Your son is blessed. He survived. No one was injured. He has you as a father.
He learned his lesson. I don't gamble, but if I did I would put my money on your son. I think he has learned the maximum lesson from this incident.
One of the most valuable lessons that he can take forward is to never permit someone to do what he did.
His situation, no question, is similar in some respects to Andrew Gallo and it is entirely different in other respects.
Thank you for sharing your story with us Hot Corner Dad.
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Wow! Powerful stuff!
Your son is blessed. He survived. No one was injured. He has you as a father.
He learned his lesson. I don't gamble, but if I did I would put my money on your son. I think he has learned the maximum lesson from this incident.
One of the most valuable lessons that he can take forward is to never permit someone to do what he did.
His situation, no question, is similar in some respects to Andrew Gallo and it is entirely different in other respects.
Thank you for sharing your story with us Hot Corner Dad.
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Sometimes, the medicine is bitter; but, the cure is sweet.
I have to believe that your son's experience will not only keep him out of similar circumstances, but will help him help others who might be prone to making the same mistake.
Thank you for your poignant account, and thank the Lord that he is well.
I have to believe that your son's experience will not only keep him out of similar circumstances, but will help him help others who might be prone to making the same mistake.
Thank you for your poignant account, and thank the Lord that he is well.
Hot Corner Dad- If it was my son I would have and still would do the same thing. I don't have the answers to this problem of drinking and driving. I don't even know where to begin. I was a prosecutor for 14 years. I have seen this epidemic in every shape and size. I have spent many nights called out of my warm bed to assist the police in a fatal investigation. I spent one nightmarish night getting the news myself. If someone would tell me how to stop it, I would spend my life and all my riches to stop it.
The truth is that last year over 1.5 million (1,500,000) people were arrested for DUI. 32,000 lost their lives in alcohol related crashes. If 32,000 soldiers had lost there lives in war or 32,000 people had caught a new disease and died that is all that would be reported.
Andrew Gallo had his chances. He was arrested. Given probation. Sent to treatment, Failed at treatment. Violated his probation. Was not punished. Went back out and got drunk and got behind the wheel of a car. But the most offensive thing he did that night was after the crash, he ran. He left his own brother and four people in the other car to save his own arse. I think that above all else showed his character. I just don't want to ever have to worry about my son or Jon Wilhite running into him on the street.
I don't know why those cars were put on that collision course that night. The mere logistics of them meeting in that intersection is mind boggling and beyond my comprehension. I have thought hours about the fact that 2 seconds on either side would have made all the difference in the world. 2 Seconds.
Hot Corner Dad tell your son that Nick's stepdad wishes him the best and to keep his head up. That when we meet to come say hi. That mistakes are what make us human. Learning from those mistakes is what makes us men. The fact that his dad is brave enough to get on this website and tell that story makes me have faith that the young man will grow up to be just fine.
The truth is that last year over 1.5 million (1,500,000) people were arrested for DUI. 32,000 lost their lives in alcohol related crashes. If 32,000 soldiers had lost there lives in war or 32,000 people had caught a new disease and died that is all that would be reported.
Andrew Gallo had his chances. He was arrested. Given probation. Sent to treatment, Failed at treatment. Violated his probation. Was not punished. Went back out and got drunk and got behind the wheel of a car. But the most offensive thing he did that night was after the crash, he ran. He left his own brother and four people in the other car to save his own arse. I think that above all else showed his character. I just don't want to ever have to worry about my son or Jon Wilhite running into him on the street.
I don't know why those cars were put on that collision course that night. The mere logistics of them meeting in that intersection is mind boggling and beyond my comprehension. I have thought hours about the fact that 2 seconds on either side would have made all the difference in the world. 2 Seconds.
Hot Corner Dad tell your son that Nick's stepdad wishes him the best and to keep his head up. That when we meet to come say hi. That mistakes are what make us human. Learning from those mistakes is what makes us men. The fact that his dad is brave enough to get on this website and tell that story makes me have faith that the young man will grow up to be just fine.
.
Wow! More powerful stuff!
Thank you for that response deldad. That is a true gift. Merry Christmas to you.
.
Wow! More powerful stuff!
Thank you for that response deldad. That is a true gift. Merry Christmas to you.
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quote:Hot Corner Dad tell your son that Nick's stepdad wishes him the best and to keep his head up. That when we meet to come say hi. That mistakes are what make us human. Learning from those mistakes is what makes us men. The fact that his dad is brave enough to get on this website and tell that story makes me have faith that the young man will grow up to be just fine.
Deldad, the grace and generosity in these words are a true gift to me. Thank you for your kindness and understanding.
My thought when posting that 'subtitle' was in consideration of drunk drivers who end up killing or maiming others, notably those who had previous convictions for the same **** thing, like Gallo. That is about all I can say other than I'm sorry for the devastation this kind of thing is causing across the nation (many nations).
quote:Hot Corner Dad tell your son that Nick's stepdad wishes him the best and to keep his head up. That when we meet to come say hi. That mistakes are what make us human. Learning from those mistakes is what makes us men. The fact that his dad is brave enough to get on this website and tell that story makes me have faith that the young man will grow up to be just fine.
Deldad, the grace and generosity in these words are a true gift to me. Thank you for your kindness and understanding.
Best post ever in the history of HSBBW.I am no longer a poster, but could not pass this up.
Deldad,you are one of THE classiest people I have ever come across. Nick would be proud that his dad could lift somebody up that has fallen and is hurting.Two days before Christmas and these words touched my heart.You are a blessed man, I know you lost so much, but your ability to touch others in crisis is special.God Bless you.
This is a very emotional situation. If it's your family member who is killed you want the killer to get all that's coming to him. If your family member is the killer you don't want him to spend the the rest of his life in prison. To the family of the killer: Your son has just forfeited his rights to the will of the state. Unfortunately the state's will usually isn't very strong. There was a story in the Boston Globe a few months ago about a guy with nine OUI convictions and not one prison sentence. There were nothing but suspensions. He was caught four times driving drunk while under suspension.
What I don't understand is such a light sentence for a convicted drunk driver who is currently on parole for prior DUI offenses. I don't know if the following would be allowable. But when this guy gets out of prison part of his parole should be if he's ever caught consuming alcohol again he goes to prison for the rest of his life. He should never be allowed to drive again. But we all know better based on how the courts work.
What I don't understand is such a light sentence for a convicted drunk driver who is currently on parole for prior DUI offenses. I don't know if the following would be allowable. But when this guy gets out of prison part of his parole should be if he's ever caught consuming alcohol again he goes to prison for the rest of his life. He should never be allowed to drive again. But we all know better based on how the courts work.
quote:Originally posted by Hot Corner Dad:quote:Hot Corner Dad tell your son that Nick's stepdad wishes him the best and to keep his head up. That when we meet to come say hi. That mistakes are what make us human. Learning from those mistakes is what makes us men. The fact that his dad is brave enough to get on this website and tell that story makes me have faith that the young man will grow up to be just fine.
Deldad, the grace and generosity in these words are a true gift to me. Thank you for your kindness and understanding.
I have never been more touched by the courage, spirit, kindness and humanity of two unbelievable people, speaking from almost polarized experiences.
Hot Corner Dad,
Thank you for posting your son's story. It is very important for parents and their future college students (with or without sports) to be aware of the drinking that takes place on every college campus.
Words are hard to find, but do know that I wish him nothing but the best for your son in the future.
Deldad,
Thank you for being who you are, you have taught me a lot over the past several years.
I hope Nick's Dad is well, Merry Christmas to all.
Thank you for posting your son's story. It is very important for parents and their future college students (with or without sports) to be aware of the drinking that takes place on every college campus.
Words are hard to find, but do know that I wish him nothing but the best for your son in the future.
Deldad,
Thank you for being who you are, you have taught me a lot over the past several years.
I hope Nick's Dad is well, Merry Christmas to all.
I think that post tells you all you need to know about Deldad. And I know Hot Corner Dads son. He is one heck of a young man.
i've driven drunk a hundred times, today i thank goodness i never hurt anyone but myself. i've been a recovering alchoholic for years now,and i can't tell you why people drink like they do. young or old. it causes more heart ache than any other drug ,yet is looked at as a part of everything social.a right of passage if you will. just remember these young men when your at the company xmas party
deldad, hot corner. you are both very brave in posting your story's. thank you for sharing.
kind of ironic who gets wet when we paint with such a broad brush.
deldad, hot corner. you are both very brave in posting your story's. thank you for sharing.
kind of ironic who gets wet when we paint with such a broad brush.
If you ever wondered why this site is so special, a short read of this thread should set you straight...its the people...
Through unspeakable tragedies and personal ordeals, we come together to share...and to support....if you cant feel the spirit evident in here tonight you just arent listening to your heart.....
Through unspeakable tragedies and personal ordeals, we come together to share...and to support....if you cant feel the spirit evident in here tonight you just arent listening to your heart.....
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Well said piaa_ump!
My paternal grandfather was an alcoholic and it killed him eventually. He died alone in a VA hospital. I was quite young at the time.
My father, on the other hand, did not drink. I don't drink much at all either. I have seen the ravage of alcoholism, the toll it takes on people, their family, and their friends.
It took me a long while to piece it all together, but I finally understood how important it was for my father to break the chain and protect his boys from alcohol's allure.
Just a handful of years before he passed I thanked him for the choices he had made. I try to do the same with our children. I can't say I've been entirely successful, but I won't stop trying. My father showed me the way. I will always be grateful to him.
This thread is truly amazing. We have quite an assortment of imperfect, yet perfect enough, members here. All willing to provide something of good measure to our community. This is as it should be. Thank you everyone.
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Well said piaa_ump!
My paternal grandfather was an alcoholic and it killed him eventually. He died alone in a VA hospital. I was quite young at the time.
My father, on the other hand, did not drink. I don't drink much at all either. I have seen the ravage of alcoholism, the toll it takes on people, their family, and their friends.
It took me a long while to piece it all together, but I finally understood how important it was for my father to break the chain and protect his boys from alcohol's allure.
Just a handful of years before he passed I thanked him for the choices he had made. I try to do the same with our children. I can't say I've been entirely successful, but I won't stop trying. My father showed me the way. I will always be grateful to him.
This thread is truly amazing. We have quite an assortment of imperfect, yet perfect enough, members here. All willing to provide something of good measure to our community. This is as it should be. Thank you everyone.
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I wish every player and parent would read this thread, its a true reflection of how very fragile life is and the consequences of making poor choices can change a person and others life's.
For both Hot Corner and Deldad, thank you for sharing this with all of us. May God bless you and your families.
Everyone should hug your family members tonight and tell them you love them.
For both Hot Corner and Deldad, thank you for sharing this with all of us. May God bless you and your families.
Everyone should hug your family members tonight and tell them you love them.
Deldad, thank you and your family for your love. You have touched my family in a very deep and meaningful way.
Hot Corner, that story will touch many and I truly appreciate it. The best to your son as he becomes that friend to others.
Hot Corner, that story will touch many and I truly appreciate it. The best to your son as he becomes that friend to others.
quote:Deldad, thank you and your family for your love. You have touched my family in a very deep and meaningful way.
Hot Corner, that story will touch many and I truly appreciate it. The best to your son as he becomes that friend to others
Backstop17 - I have been trying to think of something right to say for a couple of hours... You said it perfect...
so.. ditto.
I just cried my way through the posts in this thread. It touched me about as much as anything I have read here.
Hot Corner Dad, thank you for having the courage to share your story. And DelDad... well, you are just an amazing human being. Thank you.
Julie
Hot Corner Dad, thank you for having the courage to share your story. And DelDad... well, you are just an amazing human being. Thank you.
Julie
as did this 48 year old dad....think I'll say I love you to my son tonight when he gets home from work....first time i said it in years...thanks to both of you for sharing....best gift I'll get this Christmas
After reading these posts a few hours ago I had no words....
I felt like I had walked among angels.
This is a precious resource we all cling to, I appreciate you all and wish only the best for your families.
I felt like I had walked among angels.
This is a precious resource we all cling to, I appreciate you all and wish only the best for your families.
I understand where Krak was coming from with his link title but I also see where Hot Corner is coming from as well. I'm also completely amazed at the type of character DelDad has. This truly is an amazing thread. It's an amazing community.
I have a sister who is a recovering addict from drugs and I don't know if she ever tried to drive while under the influence but based on some of the things she did I would be surprised if she hadn't. There is a forgotten group in this process and that's the family of the one who did drink and drive. They are at a loss as to why their family member would do such a dumb thing.
Hot Corner the jury is still out on your son but from what you've posted I think / hope you have a changed son. He's learned from this and it will never happen again. I'm thankful for that just the way I'm thankful that my sister is recovering and hopefully will never do the things she did. You were a parent and a good man for working with your family to get your son through this. He's got a lot of bridges to rebuild but he will. Things will get better between him and his team mates and coaches and with his family.
First time offenders need to be punished and given the opportunity to learn from their mistake. But 2nd and 3rd time offenders need to be dealt with. This Gallo guy needs to be put under the jail. The guy RJM posted about needs to never step foot out of jail. They had their chance to learn and they failed. They need to be punished now.
I have a sister who is a recovering addict from drugs and I don't know if she ever tried to drive while under the influence but based on some of the things she did I would be surprised if she hadn't. There is a forgotten group in this process and that's the family of the one who did drink and drive. They are at a loss as to why their family member would do such a dumb thing.
Hot Corner the jury is still out on your son but from what you've posted I think / hope you have a changed son. He's learned from this and it will never happen again. I'm thankful for that just the way I'm thankful that my sister is recovering and hopefully will never do the things she did. You were a parent and a good man for working with your family to get your son through this. He's got a lot of bridges to rebuild but he will. Things will get better between him and his team mates and coaches and with his family.
First time offenders need to be punished and given the opportunity to learn from their mistake. But 2nd and 3rd time offenders need to be dealt with. This Gallo guy needs to be put under the jail. The guy RJM posted about needs to never step foot out of jail. They had their chance to learn and they failed. They need to be punished now.
First of all, deldad, you're the best. And Hot Corner Dad, I will pray for your son and your family to get through this.
I understand how perspective can alter this discussion. I guess I have a similar perspective to Hot Corner Dad, although I haven't received that middle of the night phone call yet. With those different types of perspective, I am angered with the "light" sentence Gallo received yet I am happy that HotCornerKid has a chance to learn from his mistake.
My oldest is a senior in HS and will be off to college next summer. I never drank in high school, however I surely made up for that in college and my early adult years. Never arrested but did wreck the car once and somehow got away unpunished.
In my son's early years, I preached to him how he needs to stay away from alcohol. Then on Christmas Eve (coincidence today!) about five years ago, my father in law offered me a beer. After I took the first swig, my son looked at me and said "so it's okay for you but not for me?"
I poured that beer down the drain and didn't take another drink for almost three years. By then, he was older and we've had conversations about being of legal age and about enjoying certain things in moderation.
However, he is surrounded by a society that glorifies the use of alcohol. TV commercials, TV shows, movies, scores of local bars, etc. He goes to a Catholic HS where after events, everyone goes to the KofC and the parents all swarm to the bar while the kids hang out on the other side of the room.
In my weaker moments, I am scared out of my wits to send him to college next year. It gives me chills to think about receiving the kind of phone calls that deldad and HotCornerDad have received in the last two years.
All I can hope is that his mother and I have provided a sound upbringing and that he will make the best possible choices as he enters the real world. I'm realistic enough to know there will be bumps in the road, I just pray they are small ones.
God Bless those of you who have shared your stories here and I pray that you all get through the next couple of weeks safely. Merry Christmas!
I understand how perspective can alter this discussion. I guess I have a similar perspective to Hot Corner Dad, although I haven't received that middle of the night phone call yet. With those different types of perspective, I am angered with the "light" sentence Gallo received yet I am happy that HotCornerKid has a chance to learn from his mistake.
My oldest is a senior in HS and will be off to college next summer. I never drank in high school, however I surely made up for that in college and my early adult years. Never arrested but did wreck the car once and somehow got away unpunished.
In my son's early years, I preached to him how he needs to stay away from alcohol. Then on Christmas Eve (coincidence today!) about five years ago, my father in law offered me a beer. After I took the first swig, my son looked at me and said "so it's okay for you but not for me?"
I poured that beer down the drain and didn't take another drink for almost three years. By then, he was older and we've had conversations about being of legal age and about enjoying certain things in moderation.
However, he is surrounded by a society that glorifies the use of alcohol. TV commercials, TV shows, movies, scores of local bars, etc. He goes to a Catholic HS where after events, everyone goes to the KofC and the parents all swarm to the bar while the kids hang out on the other side of the room.
In my weaker moments, I am scared out of my wits to send him to college next year. It gives me chills to think about receiving the kind of phone calls that deldad and HotCornerDad have received in the last two years.
All I can hope is that his mother and I have provided a sound upbringing and that he will make the best possible choices as he enters the real world. I'm realistic enough to know there will be bumps in the road, I just pray they are small ones.
God Bless those of you who have shared your stories here and I pray that you all get through the next couple of weeks safely. Merry Christmas!
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This is going to sound trite, but...
Like you papi, our son did not drink in high school. Zero tolerance...one strike and no baseball. What did he get for his respect for the game? What did he get for his desire to play at a higher level? What did he get for being a son that made his parents so proud? He got shunned...that's what!
It broke our heart. He made the right decisions...alone. Most of his teammates, on a good team, would show up for Saturday double headers with a hangover. Our son was one of the best on the team. He couldn't wait to get to college and play with serious players. Earn their respect.
Off to school he goes and what did he find? Upperclassmen with nothing much better to do than drink. And drink. And drink some more. And they made sure the rookies were marinated too. What did our son decide to do? He decided to not make the same decision he had made in high school...the decision that left him shunned. He was bound and determined to be "one of the guys". The results were not good. There were times when we were very, very concerned for his safety.
The door to his fourth floor dorm room opened to an outdoor walkway protected by a modest railing. One night he called, very agitated, very drunk, and in the midst of a brawl. He screams that they're trying to break the door down...then click. The phone goes dead. I'm thinking...the door, a brawl, a fall! I had never heard my son in this condition. What did I do? I called Campus Security and asked them to please check it out. They did. They called me back to fill me in. They found everyone on the scene quite drunk, but somewhat calmed down. Not a huge relief, but at least there was some assurance that no one was going to be catapaulted over the railing.
It turns out that the door that was being battered by his drunken teammates was the interior door to the common bathroom shared by four rooms. My worst fear, a brawl on that outdoor walkway, had not occurred. My son did tell me a year or so later that it was not uncommon for drunk students to hang from the rail...on the outside of the rail. I was apalled by the situation. Drinking was rampant and unfortunately it seems that it was tolerated. And this after a young coed had lost her life to alcohol poisoning on campus only a couple of years before our son had enrolled. I discovered that fact after the brawl.
We tried, from 550 miles away, to work with the school to help correct the situation. Very little assistance was offered. Because of our attempt to diplomatically intervene I think our son was shunned once more. Certain individuals who we were hoping would stand up and be supportive were, I'm quite sure, wrestling with their own cork wielding demons.
Those first two years were horrible...absolutely horrible. Things are good now. Should we have been better prepared? Less naive? Yes. Looking back on those times I realized that the ground work to assure relatively smoother sailing needed to be done while our son was still at home in high school. To his credit our son was never inhibited to call us. We pretty much knew everything that was going on. It was a long distance nightmare. But we learned.
If, somehow, we could have helped our son to shun the alcohol and earn respect at the same time we would have been satisfied. Our son's quest for respect led him down the wrong road...a road without any traffic cops. It turns out that particular university was not a good fit for someone like our son. And as bad as my portrayal has been that university is indeed a good fit for others. Go figure.
Do your homework folks. It pays off. We discovered this website too late to be helpful in our college search for our oldest, but the information and advice here is proving to be very helpful with our younger children.
My advice to you papi is to be realistic and keep communications open. From your experience at that age you know that nothing and no one is perfect. The armada of alcohol is out there. If your son, through whatever motivation, desires to stay out of trouble he will. Help him along. Keep him focused.
.
This is going to sound trite, but...
- Your son has to want to not drink.
Like you papi, our son did not drink in high school. Zero tolerance...one strike and no baseball. What did he get for his respect for the game? What did he get for his desire to play at a higher level? What did he get for being a son that made his parents so proud? He got shunned...that's what!
It broke our heart. He made the right decisions...alone. Most of his teammates, on a good team, would show up for Saturday double headers with a hangover. Our son was one of the best on the team. He couldn't wait to get to college and play with serious players. Earn their respect.
Off to school he goes and what did he find? Upperclassmen with nothing much better to do than drink. And drink. And drink some more. And they made sure the rookies were marinated too. What did our son decide to do? He decided to not make the same decision he had made in high school...the decision that left him shunned. He was bound and determined to be "one of the guys". The results were not good. There were times when we were very, very concerned for his safety.
The door to his fourth floor dorm room opened to an outdoor walkway protected by a modest railing. One night he called, very agitated, very drunk, and in the midst of a brawl. He screams that they're trying to break the door down...then click. The phone goes dead. I'm thinking...the door, a brawl, a fall! I had never heard my son in this condition. What did I do? I called Campus Security and asked them to please check it out. They did. They called me back to fill me in. They found everyone on the scene quite drunk, but somewhat calmed down. Not a huge relief, but at least there was some assurance that no one was going to be catapaulted over the railing.
It turns out that the door that was being battered by his drunken teammates was the interior door to the common bathroom shared by four rooms. My worst fear, a brawl on that outdoor walkway, had not occurred. My son did tell me a year or so later that it was not uncommon for drunk students to hang from the rail...on the outside of the rail. I was apalled by the situation. Drinking was rampant and unfortunately it seems that it was tolerated. And this after a young coed had lost her life to alcohol poisoning on campus only a couple of years before our son had enrolled. I discovered that fact after the brawl.
We tried, from 550 miles away, to work with the school to help correct the situation. Very little assistance was offered. Because of our attempt to diplomatically intervene I think our son was shunned once more. Certain individuals who we were hoping would stand up and be supportive were, I'm quite sure, wrestling with their own cork wielding demons.
Those first two years were horrible...absolutely horrible. Things are good now. Should we have been better prepared? Less naive? Yes. Looking back on those times I realized that the ground work to assure relatively smoother sailing needed to be done while our son was still at home in high school. To his credit our son was never inhibited to call us. We pretty much knew everything that was going on. It was a long distance nightmare. But we learned.
If, somehow, we could have helped our son to shun the alcohol and earn respect at the same time we would have been satisfied. Our son's quest for respect led him down the wrong road...a road without any traffic cops. It turns out that particular university was not a good fit for someone like our son. And as bad as my portrayal has been that university is indeed a good fit for others. Go figure.
Do your homework folks. It pays off. We discovered this website too late to be helpful in our college search for our oldest, but the information and advice here is proving to be very helpful with our younger children.
My advice to you papi is to be realistic and keep communications open. From your experience at that age you know that nothing and no one is perfect. The armada of alcohol is out there. If your son, through whatever motivation, desires to stay out of trouble he will. Help him along. Keep him focused.
.
Gotwood, thanks for that story.
Apologize in advance if this is a little winded:
My son too found himself on the outside of popularity on the high school ball team. He found that it takes a lot of inner strength to not participate with the rest of the group. His high school team had its issues, and the coach turned his head when some of the better players got caught up with it.
You see, at the high school level, the majority of kids on the team will not go on to play at the next level, so those kids wield a big pack of peer pressure. Son did not have a lot of friends from the team that he hung with, mainly one other player who also did not party.
His freshman year in college, where most of the players are transfer upper classmen, many of them were of legal age and imbibed a bit from time to time. Nothing to the extreme as several of them had pro aspirations. (10 of them went onto MILB.) He found a couple of upper classmen who were like him and that was enough to know that he would be alright.
Now in his sophomore year he has moved back home after his freshman year in the dorm because he couldn’t get the sleep and study time in the dorm. He relates to me sometimes with anger that the average student who doesn’t have a job or sport must have tons of free time to fill, and much of that free time involves alcohol, or planning for alcohol. It is just a fact of life, and it doesn’t make it right but that is the norm at almost all colleges.
This year the coach has outed son a few times in front of some new guys on the team and said be like him when it comes to social and study time. We have heard through son’s high school grapevine that a high school teammate who is now a freshman on son’s College team, has told his high school friends that “the kids on the college team are a bunch of Adams (son’s name).” We know what he meant by that – non-hard partier, not out solely for a good time, serious ball players. It may or may not make that freshman player happy now, but in the end it may be beneficial for him. I know for a fact that the coach recruits good kids like that purposely.
So for those of you with kids who want to stay on a solid track and not abuse alcohol, there are others out there, but they just have to be willing to seek them out and walk away from the rest. IMO, eventually they will attract others who either are like them or want to get away from abusing alcohol too. I think in the end all the real players want to get to that point but some struggle on their way there.
Apologize in advance if this is a little winded:
My son too found himself on the outside of popularity on the high school ball team. He found that it takes a lot of inner strength to not participate with the rest of the group. His high school team had its issues, and the coach turned his head when some of the better players got caught up with it.
You see, at the high school level, the majority of kids on the team will not go on to play at the next level, so those kids wield a big pack of peer pressure. Son did not have a lot of friends from the team that he hung with, mainly one other player who also did not party.
His freshman year in college, where most of the players are transfer upper classmen, many of them were of legal age and imbibed a bit from time to time. Nothing to the extreme as several of them had pro aspirations. (10 of them went onto MILB.) He found a couple of upper classmen who were like him and that was enough to know that he would be alright.
Now in his sophomore year he has moved back home after his freshman year in the dorm because he couldn’t get the sleep and study time in the dorm. He relates to me sometimes with anger that the average student who doesn’t have a job or sport must have tons of free time to fill, and much of that free time involves alcohol, or planning for alcohol. It is just a fact of life, and it doesn’t make it right but that is the norm at almost all colleges.
This year the coach has outed son a few times in front of some new guys on the team and said be like him when it comes to social and study time. We have heard through son’s high school grapevine that a high school teammate who is now a freshman on son’s College team, has told his high school friends that “the kids on the college team are a bunch of Adams (son’s name).” We know what he meant by that – non-hard partier, not out solely for a good time, serious ball players. It may or may not make that freshman player happy now, but in the end it may be beneficial for him. I know for a fact that the coach recruits good kids like that purposely.
So for those of you with kids who want to stay on a solid track and not abuse alcohol, there are others out there, but they just have to be willing to seek them out and walk away from the rest. IMO, eventually they will attract others who either are like them or want to get away from abusing alcohol too. I think in the end all the real players want to get to that point but some struggle on their way there.
there are some great souls on this board.
And let me add a little advice to give your kids that I have given mine:
Much of the alcohol abuse in college is a result of “fitting in” or trying to fit in. It is used as a way to drop barriers with others and find yourself or prove that you are cool. It is done to be that someone who others will want to be with or around.
Now remind your boy, who is off to play baseball at the next level, that very few kids get this opportunity to play baseball at that level. That, in and of itself, being a bonafide college baseball player, has already set them apart from 99% of the rest. Bammm!!! They arrive automatically set up as soon as they step foot on campus. Chicks will dig them for their athletic capability, not for their drinking capability. 90% of the males at a college can drink as well as them, but less than 1% of the males on that campus can:
a. Hit a 90 mile an hour fastball
b. Throw a 90 mile an hour fastball.
I know at son’s University, just wearing the workout tees and shorts of the baseball team through the cafeteria gets him way more talent OPPORTUNITY than a week of late nights in the clubs. Just for clarity, I capatilized opportunity just in case his steady at FSU ever reads this!
Much of the alcohol abuse in college is a result of “fitting in” or trying to fit in. It is used as a way to drop barriers with others and find yourself or prove that you are cool. It is done to be that someone who others will want to be with or around.
Now remind your boy, who is off to play baseball at the next level, that very few kids get this opportunity to play baseball at that level. That, in and of itself, being a bonafide college baseball player, has already set them apart from 99% of the rest. Bammm!!! They arrive automatically set up as soon as they step foot on campus. Chicks will dig them for their athletic capability, not for their drinking capability. 90% of the males at a college can drink as well as them, but less than 1% of the males on that campus can:
a. Hit a 90 mile an hour fastball
b. Throw a 90 mile an hour fastball.
I know at son’s University, just wearing the workout tees and shorts of the baseball team through the cafeteria gets him way more talent OPPORTUNITY than a week of late nights in the clubs. Just for clarity, I capatilized opportunity just in case his steady at FSU ever reads this!
quote:Like you papi, our son did not drink in high school. Zero tolerance...one strike and no baseball. What did he get for his respect for the game? What did he get for his desire to play at a higher level? What did he get for being a son that made his parents so proud? He got shunned...that's what!
Wow, so glad to see this posted! The same thing happened to me in high school. My HS years were some of the most brutal, and why? Because I didn't drink. Guess how I decided to make things better for myself in college?
I see the same thing happening today, to my own boys. Not so much in HS here, but certainly the eldest's first two years of college were tainted by exactly this situation. Shunned. "Hey, there, whatcha doin'?" "Sitting in my room." "Oh. What are all the other guys doing?" "Drinking, smoking dope, the usual." "You could always go along but just not partake, just hang out." "Nope. I don't like being around that stuff. Everyone acts totally different."
I felt horrible for him, but I was glad to see that he was stronger than me - didn't cave in to what he didn't want to do just to find a social toehold. He's almost 21 and still doesn't have a car, mainly because he hasn't needed one yet. But he will likely need one now - summer ball, a summer job, internship, maybe living off campus next year....I'm supposed to buy him one this coming summer and the FIRST thing that comes into my mind when I think of this is -- will he just be driving out onto the highway of disaster? But you can't really keep them safe. You just give them the keys, fly back to wherever you came from, and just hope to never get that call. I know he'll be careful. I know he won't be drinking. But I don't know what else is out on the road every day, every night, 24/7, 365xhowever many years he'll be driving. And then my next son will be out there, and then my daughter will be out there.......
Yes, it's a very emotional, worrisome thing, and as others have mentioned it is one that can swiftly swing around your perspective, change your life, end a life. It's just a shame.
I'm sorry for all who've been effected by this, whichever side of it you've been on; it's just a no-good scourge that has all of us worried as hell. But I guess all we can do is bury the worry as much as possible, get on with it, and hope like heck the fates are kind.
[CLARIFICATION: My post of my son's experience has nothing to do with the baseball team, but roommates and neighbors in general.]
quote:I know for a fact that the coach recruits good kids like that purposely.
Just thought I'd emphasize Backstop-17s little known recruiting tip.............
quote:Originally posted by gotwood4sale:
.
What did he get for being a son that made his parents so proud? He got shunned...that's what!
.
I'm not sure I can use the word "shunned" for my son but he is looked at differently by some of his peers. And for that, I am very happy. He seems to be okay with it as well.
BTW, I got chills reading your post about your older son's experience.
quote:Originally posted by piaa_ump:
If you ever wondered why this site is so special, a short read of this thread should set you straight...its the people...
Through unspeakable tragedies and personal ordeals, we come together to share...and to support....if you cant feel the spirit evident in here tonight you just arent listening to your heart.....
Agreed.
Overcome with emotion here....
How many of us have sinned this very way and merely gotten lucky...
Hotcorner Dad - perhaps your son got lucky by getting caught. My thoughts and prayers for him and your family for healing and recovery. Maybe your son can guide someone else in the future and ultimately save someone's life. He can turn this into a positive. Humility is a great thing when its lessons are understood and applied.
deldad - graciousness and class. Not sure what else I can say but God bless.
20dad - my thoughts and prayers continue for you and your family.
I know I have been lucky and have made too many mistakes of my own to recall. Let me share what I told my son when he left for college...
For starters, I assume that ALL college students drink and work from that premise and realize that there are notable exceptions out there. Given that "premise" I told my "beloved" son:
"I don't care if you call me at 3:00 in the morning from almost 1,000 miles away, I'll pay for a cab to get you home and I don't care how much it costs and I'll never yell about it. We'll worry about getting the car home in the morning. Please, please please never get in a car if YOU have been drinking and please, please, please, never get in the car of SOMEONE else who has been drinking."
I believe we can all share those simple instructions with our kids. Sure I wish they wouldn't drink but peer pressure and social norms are too great to believe that outcome is realistic imho. Lets assume worst case a cab ride costs $300 to get our kids home one night safely (doubt it would ever be that much btw). How many of us would trade a one-time charge to our credit or debit cards of $300 for the alternative... the legal fees to defend a DUI which in many cases are three to five thousand dollars... the increased monthly premiums for high risk insurance which probably cost thousands or devastatingly worse... the loss of our most important treasure - our sons themselves
... or worse yet... the loss of someone elses treasure at the hand of one of our sons.... or worse yet... the loss of our own son and someone elses beloved treasure...Call each one of your kids TODAY and insist they never, ever, never drive again or be driven by someone or themselves after they have been drinking. Encourage them to arrange a designated driver before taking the first drink and if that means you pay for it so be it. Let them know you will bare all expenses to get them home safely. Let them know there will be no repercussions for calling you at the wee hours of the morning to arrange a cab fare. Let them know that your treasure is far too important to allow it to be transported less than an IDEAL manner.
God bless the high school baseball web. Special blessings to Hotcorner Dad and deldad this holiday season.