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P PGStaff10,000+ posts
Often tools and statistics are mentioned here.

What does everyone think regarding the use of statistics when it comes to the various levels of baseball.

I’m not sure how many statistics are available to study, but here are some that I think would be interesting and possibly give a perspective into what college coaches at the different levels look for.

Number of walks per game at DI vs DII vs DIII?

I really don’t know the answer, but what if we found that the total was fairly equal at all three levels? What, if anything, would that tell us?

What if the number of walks was lower at DIII than DI? What would that tell us?

Would it mean that DIII pitchers rely on control more than other things? Or would it tell us that DIII hitters are less patient than DI hitters? Would it tell us that DI recruiters covet velocity over control and the opposite is true at DIII? Or does it mean anything at all.

I have noticed that at the lower levels of professional baseball, pitchers sometime seem to have very low walk numbers. As these pitchers move up their walk numbers increase. Sometimes pitchers who didn’t give up walks in Rookie ball, give up lots of walks when they reach AAA. This is obviously a case of the hitters being better and more patient. The higher the level the less they chase pitches. At the entry levels there are many hitters who are free swingers and simply aren’t going to be patient enough to make a pitcher throw strikes.

Anyone have any thoughts or statistical evidence on this topic.
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coach2709coach270910,000+ posts
I don't have any statistical evidence to back things up and people may be able to shoot all kinds of holes into what I am going to say but oh well.

I think if you compare the numbers / percentages at each level of baseball you will find the average to be about the same with a fairly small plus / minus range. Look at it as a standard bell curve in that the majority of players will be at the level they need to be so the competition will be equal.

The higher you go the better the pitching but the flip side is you will have the better hitting to it balances out. The lower you go the weaker the pitching and the flip side is the weaker the hitting.

Now with each level you will have the guys who are just better than others and their numbers won't match the majority but then you have the guys who don't need to be there and their numbers won't match the majority either.

Think of it like this, and this might be a horrible example, you take an average major league player and have him hit a groundball to an average high school shortstop. The MLB player won't beat out every groundball but he will beat out more than an average high school player would. Obviously attributed to the skill level.

When you have great versus average the numbers will be out of proportion but if you go bad versus bad, good versus good and great versus great then the numbers should all balance out.
TPMTPMHSBaseballweb Member since 2003
PG,
Interesting.
I suppose an answer could lie within the coach that is recruiting a particular player and what he bases importance for his program. For instance some programs base their strength upon defense, while another program will base their program on offense. If pitching is a priority, then I would imagine that a control pitcher is very important, if a program is based on offense than a patient hitter is very important. Speed may be more important than power hitters than can't beat out the throw. You'd have to be a rocket scientist to figure it all out. Eek JMO.

We also have to remember that within each college division, there are tiers. We all know the possibility that a strong D2,D3 team might beat out a weaker D1 program. You might see a pitcher be able to dominate in one program but not in another, the same for hitters.

You bring up great points about pro level. A pitcher may be able to dominate in lower levels, but struggle as he moves along with better hitters and those having more discipline. You might also see those that rely on defense do better than those that don't. The same for hitters, those that dominate lower now struggle against bettr pitching. There is a strong correlation of this also at LL, HS, college. How often do we hear about the player who dominates in their particular area or state then faces competition from all over and struggles.
RJMRJMHSBaseballWeb member since 2007
quote:
I have noticed that at the lower levels of professional baseball, pitchers sometime seem to have very low walk numbers. As these pitchers move up their walk numbers increase. Sometimes pitchers who didn’t give up walks in Rookie ball, give up lots of walks when they reach AAA. This is obviously a case of the hitters being better and more patient. The higher the level the less they chase pitches.
It could also be as the pitchers face better hitters they pick and finesse pitch more often and miss the zone.

A perfect example is a pitcher I saw from an ACC program. He was either walking the park or getting ripped on 2-0 and 3-1 versus Florida State and Georgia Tech. Then I saw him pitch against a low level D1. He brought his 90+ stuff down Main Street on them and blew them away.
P PGStaff10,000+ posts
Below is an interesting case using Nic Ungs as an example. He started in the New York Penn League as a rookie and threw 61 innings and did not give up a single walk! He also had very low walk totals at both low and high A ball. Each level above that he walked more hitters per 9 innings pitched.

Question... Did he lose some of his pinpoint control or was it only because the hitters were better? Less wild swingers who are making him throw strikes? More precise pitches needed causing him to throw outside the zone more often? Just a coincidence? I know of many others who experienced the same coincedent.

2001... R..... 61.0 IP.... 0 walks
2002... A-.... 118.1 IP... 19 walks
2003... A+.... 113.1 IP... 14 walks
2004... AA.... 161.1 IP... 35 walks
2005... AA.... 120.0 IP... 34 walks
2006... AAA... 144.1 IP... 45 walks
2007... AAA... 112.0 IP... 45 walks

Just something to think about. Disciplined professional hitters make a pitcher throw strikes.

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