OPINIONS

Opinions on the subject of baseball are valued and generally appreciated.

Opinions of others, especially those that are intended to be derogatory to other posters, have no value and only detract from this site.

Opinion, knowledge and experience are the intangibles and tangibles that drive this site.

Discord among posters drives folks away and provides no value in return.

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Why do so many people get bent by others opinions.....

That's a good question for you....

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Originally posted by floridafan:
Opinions on the subject of baseball are valued and generally appreciated.

Opinions of others, especially those that are intended to be derogatory to other posters, have no value and only detract from this site.

Opinion, knowledge and experience are the intangibles and tangibles that drive this site.

Discord among posters drives folks away and provides no value in return.

Debate, disagree, or whatever else but do it nicely is all we ask. If you don't like the word nicely then do it respectfully and civilly.

It will never be a free-for-all. It would ruin the place. Political topics and religious topics for example are poisonous here and need to be moderated imho. Advertising is frowned upon unless pre-approved. Our audience is also not all adults or experienced older males. At the end of the day, moderators make judgement calls. If we allowed smack-talk and beat-downs, some of our members would be intimidated from posting in my humble OPINION.

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Originally posted by TRhit:
It is up to the reader to then glean what he can from the information or lack thereof that is given.

It is up to the reader to learn what the background and experience of the posters is.

I think those are two important points. While many may feel that the disagreement between posters is "personal", IMO it is important to qualify the opinions against a posters experience in order to form your own opinion. Many times an opinion, while on paper may seem "spot on", it may not be an opinion that is substantiated by relevant experience. With that said, in the HSBBW scenarios, the experience of one poster may be geographical, talent driven, academically driven, or whatever, and it is important to flesh out what qualifies those opinions from all other perspectives. I guess if you want YOUR opinion included in a conversation, you should be prepared to have it argued. Since I was a kid I've always enjoyed reading the rebuttals to advice columns because they offered a conflicting POV, and that is where you learn the "big picture" that forms your own opinion.

Everyone wants to hear the "best-of" a scenario to satisfy their situation, but, to get opinions that are not based on "potential reality", or a conflicting POV's, is not a complete "drilling" to find your answer.

JMO and I'm open to conflicting opinions without holding a grudge against that poster, or taking it personally. It's easy to "blow-off" these "forum disputes" because we all have a similar passion, Baseball. Besides, I don't really know where anyone really lives

CD

Stop with the PC stuff---I am not talking smack talk and beatdowns--I am talking debate---What about those that defame and talk smackdown to me? I accept it as part of the game and can retort where I think it is worth it--I am well aware that my NY tone, yes I am a NY'er not a New Englander, is not accepted by many--my wife, a MA/NH lady tells me that all the time--but I am what I am and who I am and at my age won't change--we have people on here from all regions and all walks of life as well as different education levels--so be it, that is our country, the best country in the world and it got that way because people did not have small minds and were mature enough to accept diverse opinions--just because a debater believes he is right does not make him/her wrong--if you no diverse opinions you have no intelligent conversation and intelligent conversation does not mean bringing ethnics into it as some are prone to do.

Opinions are just that---OPINIONS !!!!

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Originally posted by ClevelandDad:

If we allowed smack-talk and beat-downs, some of our members would be intimidated from posting in my humble OPINION.

People are already intimidated from making posts and asking questions, even giving advice.

Bullying just continues and nothing is done. We'll all just be told we are thin skinned. BS!

I have LOTS of experience in this game that I could pass along. Coached many travel teams. Listened to many speakers. Have a son playing in a top conference and he has a chance of getting drafted. Went through the advisor and draft deal coming out of HS. I have plenty of experience and knowledge of this great game. I have MANY questions for someone like TPM and the questions I have could benefit others going through the same thing.

AT THIS POINT I WONT EVEN CONSIDER ASKING QUESTIONS IN A THREAD! You know why? Because some snide remark making person with nothing but venom will hijack it and just start slinging insults. All that and doesnt have a son playing the game at that level, but yet he knows more than someone who does have a son playing. Are you kidding me?

GREAT JOB! Way to make everyone feel welcome around here.

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Originally posted by D1:

People are already intimidated from making posts and asking questions, even giving advice.

When I started on this site in 2003 I felt the same way. I was intimidated to ask a questions and share opinions because there were posters who I felt "looked down" on newbies. Then I figured out that while some were jerks, some full of BS, they all bled red, and my general opinion of them was shared by others. Until you realize that there no stupid questions and only stupid answers, you will be left by the wayside wondering. IMO, people should "stand up", let loose, and share their questions, thoughts, and experiences. For the most part the moderators here do a good keeping the peace and my advise would be for those intimidated to stiffen the spine because you will find allies out there. Don't use it as an excuse not to post, because IMHO, that is a weak excuse.

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Originally posted by rz1:

quote:

Originally posted by D1:

People are already intimidated from making posts and asking questions, even giving advice.

When I started on this site in 2003 I felt the same way. I was intimidated to ask a questions and share opinions because there were posters who I felt "looked down" on newbies. Then I figured out that while some were jerks, and some full of BS, they all bled red, and my general opinion of them was shared by most. Until you realize that there no stupid questions and only stupid answers, you will be left by the wayside wondering. IMO, people should "stand up", let loose, and share their questions, thoughts, and experiences. For the most part the moderators here do a good keeping the peace and my advise would be for those intimidated to stiffen the spine because you will find allies out there. Don't use it as an excuse not to post, because IMHO, that is a weak excuse.

Good post.

D1 - perhaps send me a pm so we could discuss offline.

DI,
I can tell you are frustrated.
If you want to see a post I found so offensive to every woman and mother on this site, there is one in the TX forum that is about as belittling and nasty as one can imagine. But, they are dealing with it.
In my view, none of us on here are perfect and sometimes that shows.
Sometimes the written word just makes communication difficult.
Sometimes things are likely as you feel and describe them.
IMO,we all need to work around the frustration.

Does the contention and seeming vitriol impact potential new posters? My guess would be yes, but who ever knows if they don't post or give up.
Also, I believe some of the frustration might relate from the Milb threads that got started and stopped.
One opinion was rendered and then some "facts" that were not correct got inserted to attempt to support certain opinions.
When the incorrect facts were pointed out to each of those who posted the incorrect facts, opinions started that sent the threads downhill further.
Such is the nature of many threads on this site.
In my view, if you have the type of information you suggest and the types of very important questions about your son and his college/draft future, you post them.
Knowledgeable folks will respond and then you just work around the rest. In the end, we end up with some very good threads, not as many as we used to I don't think, but still pretty valuable for those who need information.
To me, the core in posting is the realization this is not my site. I don't set the rules but realize rules need to be set. I also respect those who make the rules(Julie) and those who enforce them(moderators).
If the topic is one I don't know about or have an opinion to express or facts to offer, I don't post. But that is my approach.
If someone posts facts I know or believe to be incorrect on issues I might know or care about, I will say so.
If someone expresses opinions based on incorrect facts, I will talk about that.
No one will know what works and the best answers if the questions are not asked and answered. If some threads have difficulty in the process, that isn't likely to change. Still, getting questions asked and answers provided should be paramount. While it is a complete headache for them at times, if we leave the rule making to Julie and enforcement to the moderators, the exchange of reliable and valuable information will continue on the HSBBW.
To me, it is far more important to know there is good and reliable information to obtain or provide, than to let those you think are a problem get in the way of both.

Please stop with the...

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Stop with the PC stuff

Debating does not include giving orders.

There are times when posting....just isn't worth the hassle you know will come from it.

From the movie Home for the Holidays

Home for the Holidays (1995)~ "Opinions are like a**holes. Everybody's got one and everyone thinks everyone else's stinks."

To chime in on this; I really thought the comments would become more positive as our respective Seasons got under way. Also, I expected we would have more good wholesome baseball topics.

I'm not sure either has occurred. I too must stop and consider whether a response or new topic is really worth the "return fire" before posting.

Recently 2bmom was turned away from the site because she had the audacity to post positive, exciting recounts of her son's play on a Thread, started by CD, for that very purpose. But, low and behold, someone came along and said" they were tired of hearing about all the good stuff .... why isn't anyone posting negative happenings??

Go figure, takes all kinds I guess to make our world go-round.

By the way, my kid is having a great Senior H.S. season and we are really enjoying it.... LOL.

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By the way, my kid is having a great Senior H.S. season and we are really enjoying it.... LOL

Great. I am happy for you and your son. With baseball being a game of failure its good to here about the success, and at any level.

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When I started on this site in 2003 I felt the same way. I was intimidated to ask a questions and share opinions because there were posters who I felt "looked down" on newbies

I wonder how many felt or feel the same way, and never asked the question.

I can respect the opinon of others when they are answering a question. But the belittling of others, should not be tolerated. The questioning their motives, or even funnier of who the poster is, as in the Coach wont coach thread cracks me up sometimes.

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Originally posted by GapFinder:

quote:

When I started on this site in 2003 I felt the same way. I was intimidated to ask a questions and share opinions because there were posters who I felt "looked down" on newbies

I wonder how many felt or feel the same way, and never asked the question.

My bet is most do. I don't find it unusual that people would have this anxiety when first entering an interactive web site especially if message board participation is new to them. Until they face their "fears" they will never overcome them. We all have different ways of expressing ourselves and we all have a trigger at what is acceptable. Just like we all have opinions on coaches and their ways of expressing themselves, posters are the same way. We seem to accept differences in coaching personalities, why not with posters personalities?

I can respect the opinon of others when they are answering a question. But the belittling of others, should not be tolerated....

"Belittling", now there is another accusation that is in the eye of the beholder. If you completely disagree with an opinion of a poster and state that their opinion is not the same as yours, is that belittling? Personal attacks should not be tolerated but they usually occur after back-n-forth bantering, or, after a third parties take it upon themselves and determine what they think is right-n-wrong.

Infielddad has some good points here. When I saw this post I knew what was coming. My experience has been pretty much the same, sometimes when I ask a question or post a topic, I get negative feedback. Now I will not call out names, but certain posters have replied in a more demeaning nature or whatever you want to call it, then is necessary. I won't let them stop me from expressing my opinions or experiences and neither should anyone else.

But these posters share some of my ideas on things and they have provided useful information. In some cases they amuse me as well. This site has provided some much useful information I tell all my baseball friends about it. I appreciate Julie's work and what the moderators do. So keep posting.

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Originally posted by D1:
....The fact of the matter remains that relavant questions or advice WILL NOT be posted because people are tired of the BS created by one person and nothing continues to be done about it.

D1- I know that for years some of my opinions and responses have rubbed some people the wrong way and not only would I liked to apologize to those I insulted by my opinions, but also let you know that they were not intended to belittle, nor were they meant to hurt anyone's feelings. They were just my opinions and sometimes I may not respond as eloquently or as sensitive as others would find acceptable and my point may inadvertently be taken out of context.

My apologies, I'll try harder in the future

rz1, you have class.

quote:

Originally posted by D1:

quote:

Originally posted by ClevelandDad:

D1 - perhaps send me a pm so we could discuss offline.

Nah, I would rather iron it out right here. Im not really a newbie and neither are others around here who have grown tired of the aggrivation ONE person creates.

The fact of the matter remains that relavant questions or advice WILL NOT be posted because people are tired of the BS created by one person and nothing continues to be done about it. Like I said GREAT JOB to everyone involved.

I just wonder what anyone is supposed to get from a post like that. Finger pointing, sarcasm, venom, and then speaking as though it comes from the voice of the masses.

From appearances, it would seem that the ideas being expressed are exactly those that are being so vigorously detested.

It is very simple in my opinion.
This site is what it is. Nothing is going to change and it's up to you to take what you want from it.

These discussions happen all the time and the site continues to be what it is, a place to get some very good information if your seeking it. A place to get frustrated whether your seeking it or not.

You can't let folks discourage you. If there is anything you take from this site other than the great advice that is offered, let it be to put blinders on and look past those who ridicule, insult or hammer your opinion. Believe me, I have had my share of false accusations and yet life goes on. I've taken what I wanted from here and moved on. All the other BS stays here once I log off.
Once you realize and accept the board for what it is, then all the other trivial stuff really doesn't matter. Good Luck!

Tools of the internet generation are great about getting information, and misinformation, to you quickly. Lot's of good facts/advise, lots of opinions not based in facts, lots of BS. It's up to you to determine which is which.

Unfortunately, one of the drawbacks of internet generation tools is that people seem to be able to edit their mouth much easier than their fingers. So you get unfiltered, harsh comments much more frequently than you would in normal conversations.

This website it's unique in those things...it's actually a little toned down from a lot of what you see out there. And, just so we're clear, those are my OPINIONS...not facts, although in this case I think they are the same.

1. Everyone is equally enititled to an opinion.

2. Not all opinions are equal.

3. Some posters present opinion as "fact." It's your job to know the difference.

4. Don't look at certain posters as "bullies", consider them comic relief.

.

That makes a whole lot of sense to me.

At least Nine Western States are being well served!





(That's two in a row for you Jimmy03!)

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Talk about crotchity! WOW.

I'd look into anger management classes if I were you D1. Relax.

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Originally posted by fillsfan:
Talk about crotchity! WOW.

I'd look into anger management classes if I were you D1. Relax.

That's D1's modus operandi...sit in the weeds and then jump out and rip on people for what they do wrong. He even goes to other web sites and rips on HSBBW.

If you read his post, he belittles a poster for belittling posters. There's just nothing there that's redeeming about this person.

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Originally posted by D1:
Fact of the matter remains that you let one person lift his leg on whomever he wants and there are no ramifications.

I'd like to think that we are all given the right to "lift a leg". Some don't want to, some have no reason to, some are to embarrassed to, and some let others do it for them. Regardless of your reason, some opinions need back-up noise in order for the point to be made. If you have a problem with it, there are all sorts of noise reduction methods on this site, D1 chose one, and it's free.

I think that some people such as D1 do not have mirrors in their house--if they do they sure do not use them

I don't put anyone on ignore. If I don't like what I'm reading I stop and move on. I'll even watch Keith Olbermann once in a while for a laugh.

Is not the word ignore derived from the term ignorance!!!

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Originally posted by RJM:
I'll even watch Keith Olbermann once in a while for a laugh.

What kind of masochist are you ?

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Originally posted by rz1:

quote:

Originally posted by RJM:
I'll even watch Keith Olbermann once in a while for a laugh.

What kind of masochist are you ?

Title IX clearly states you must include Rachel Maddow!

I think this site often has a certain herd/mob mentality. Don't think we're terribly welcoming to newcomers a lot of times. I got my a$$ jumped when I started...just asked a simple question about a player I had seen during the summer...got a nasty response.

I kept on. Wonder if the the personality of the average 'old-timer' or those of us that 'stick' here mirrors the guy who jumped my a$$? Maybe us 'old-timers' are a bunch of a$$-jumpers? Maybe not?

In any case, opinions are good. Sometimes I know I come off harsh to a few folks with my own opinions. I'm trying to stop it. It detracts from the message/conversation.

All I know is I rarely get anyone to see my side of a debate by yelling at them or making them feel stupid (either virtually or in person). Grudges don't work well either and there seems to be plenty of that around here at times.

If your purpose is to impart information to those that are asking or need to know...think about how you deliver the message and how effective your delivery is (or is not).

Fungo is a master at it. PGStaff too (even when I disagree with him, I don't feel stupid for saying my point).

Something to think about.

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Vigorous, respectful debate between posters with knowledge is what makes any forum worth visiting. I am surprised to hear people say that they have refrained from asking a question regarding an aspect of baseball, but they are willing to chime in on this thread which deals only with the process.

When my son was in high school, I had no idea how to help him figure out his baseball path. Those who had helped their children or coached others posted here and I took the advice which best suited our needs. I don't remember being called an idiot, but even if I had, I would have checked to see if there was some validity in the comment and also consider the source.

Threads cannot get hijacked by one person. Even the most persistent debater gets tired of arguing with him/herself. If a thread contains important information to the readers and posters of this forum it will survive and assist, even if some posters decide to argue about that which seems irrelevant to many of us.

I prefer when we debate the merits of DI vs. DIII, Stanford vs. Headfirst, and infiled in vs. double play depth.

quote:

Originally posted by Danny Boydston:

quote:

Originally posted by rz1:

quote:

Originally posted by RJM:
I'll even watch Keith Olbermann once in a while for a laugh.

What kind of masochist are you ?

Title IX clearly states you must include Rachel Maddow!

Rachel Maddow is Keith Olbermann in drag. When I watch I think Olbermann's ratings double. A person yelling out the window has more viewers than MSNBC.

When I need a bump in self esteem, 15 minutes of Nancy Grace elevates me to the top on the food chain.

RJM, did you see that funny Saturday Night Live skit that Ben Afleck did on Keith Olbermann?
It had me laughing my brains out!

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A person yelling out the window has more viewers than MSNBC.

Now, that's funny! Also....true.