Also, a bit of perspective.
We entered a local tournament this week just because it was, well, local and would offer a respite from our recent travel.
I don't know if it's due to the EXTREME heat we've had, or just the event itself, but so far I've seen two schools at our five games combined. And they were there to see guys on our team. The other teams brought NO ONE to the party.
At the WWBA 17u, our least scouted game still had 2 colleges and at least that many pro scouts present. Our most heavily scouted event came when the currently top-ranked pitcher in VA faced a LOADED Florida team with numerous SEC committed kids and potential 2012 draftees. That game was played at Kell HS, which many of you know is the one across the street from the East Cobb complex. So it's easy to get to, but you have to want to see the one game to go over there.
In that one game I was able to identify 30+ collegiate programs present. Many had more than one guy there. Nearly all if not all MLB teams had scouts there as well, again many had more than one. There were a lot of others there whom I am pretty sure were scouts of one type or another but whom I just could not identify.
Our team has not been to any other events anywhere that offer that opportunity. (Too bad we lost! But we had some guys show themselves well nonetheless.)
A more typical game at the 17u would have roughly 10-15 colleges represented. I know because I go behind the backstop, introduce myself, get their schools noted in my scorebook, and hand out rosters to them all. After the game I count them.
Interestingly, our game at East Cobb was one of the least heavily scouted games we had. Unfortunately our opponent just didn't bring anyone to the dance, all we had there were guys following us and a couple of passers by. And our opponent was a good team, too. I guess their players just didn't do the homework in the days prior.
quote:Originally posted by Midlo Dad:
We push our players to identify target schools and then, knowing that they are going to have representatives at this event, to ask the scouts to make time for their games and come see them play. Regular contact by the players is critical.
This is a point I keep trying to get across to my son. He pitched a game at South Cobb that had a few scouts there, one of which had contacted him to get the day he was scheduled to pitch. At least two of the other scouts had been contacted by boys on our team. I keep telling him that it is up to the boys to get the Scouts out to their games by making contact well in advance (not a day or two before).
It's also nice to see that you are pushing your team to make these contacts. Although my son plays for an experienced organization, his team only has one coach and this is his first year coaching this type of team so they are not getting this type of encouragement. Thank goodness for these message boards or we would be totally lost.
It is up to the player to contact the schools. The coaches simply follow up. I know that we are busier before the games (when the schedule comes out) than during the games. We get TONS of texts from different coaches asking about our kids and when they will pitch, expected PT, etc.
Now, keep in mind, that if you throw 78mph, Top 10 programs like Texas, etc. really don't care and won't be out to see you unless you do something special. You need to be realistic. This dose of reality usually involves the coach of your team.
Now, keep in mind, that if you throw 78mph, Top 10 programs like Texas, etc. really don't care and won't be out to see you unless you do something special. You need to be realistic. This dose of reality usually involves the coach of your team.
Targeting schools requires that you assess the player's academic level, as well as his baseball level. Also his financial resources.
If you are having trouble cracking the 1,000 mark on your 2-part SAT's, then you are probably going to have trouble getting a place like Vanderbilt to follow you. It'd be hard enough to get you in, there'd also be questions about whether you could STAY in once there.
And with so many private universities posting 50k+ sticker prices these days, you have to ask yourself if you can cover the net bill if they come with, say, a 25% offer, or a higher offer if you are talented enough to receive a higher offer. There's no point talking to (not to pick on them but just as an example) Vandy if you aren't ready to shell out the money for what the net bill is likely to look like. Unless you are likely to be able to package some other substantial financial aid with your baseball money, at least.
As a counter example, if you have top grades, 1300+ boards and cash to burn, if you go to the 17u, and if you contact all the Ivies in advance, I can guarantee you they will turn out for you. They realize that they can only really look at a small percentage of the guys out there and they will look coast to coast to find the few that fit their profile. Then it's just up to you to perform on the field.
In the end there's no escaping that last part. But if you're seeking opportunities, you can make them for yourself.
I think it was Edison who said something like, when opportunity knocks many people fail to answer the door, because it comes wearing overalls and disguised as hard work. Teenagers will come up with all sorts of excuses not to do their homework. In the end, those who do the prep work on balance will fare better than equally talented kids who don't. There's probably a good life lesson there too, don't you think?
If you are having trouble cracking the 1,000 mark on your 2-part SAT's, then you are probably going to have trouble getting a place like Vanderbilt to follow you. It'd be hard enough to get you in, there'd also be questions about whether you could STAY in once there.
And with so many private universities posting 50k+ sticker prices these days, you have to ask yourself if you can cover the net bill if they come with, say, a 25% offer, or a higher offer if you are talented enough to receive a higher offer. There's no point talking to (not to pick on them but just as an example) Vandy if you aren't ready to shell out the money for what the net bill is likely to look like. Unless you are likely to be able to package some other substantial financial aid with your baseball money, at least.
As a counter example, if you have top grades, 1300+ boards and cash to burn, if you go to the 17u, and if you contact all the Ivies in advance, I can guarantee you they will turn out for you. They realize that they can only really look at a small percentage of the guys out there and they will look coast to coast to find the few that fit their profile. Then it's just up to you to perform on the field.
In the end there's no escaping that last part. But if you're seeking opportunities, you can make them for yourself.
I think it was Edison who said something like, when opportunity knocks many people fail to answer the door, because it comes wearing overalls and disguised as hard work. Teenagers will come up with all sorts of excuses not to do their homework. In the end, those who do the prep work on balance will fare better than equally talented kids who don't. There's probably a good life lesson there too, don't you think?
Hey MidloDad! I think we're at the same tournament (maybe playing you tomorrow?). My son sent out a couple e-mails to local schools about when he was scheduled to pitch. My husband thought that he saw a couple of schools represented on Friday.
As far as connecting with the colleges at the 17U, that is such a great approach that you had. We only have one coach, so there is no way that he could do that since he is out on the field. I did see one scout go over to the coach before the game for a copy of the roster but nothing that was initiated on our side. Probably why you're seeing such success with your verbal commits.
As far as connecting with the colleges at the 17U, that is such a great approach that you had. We only have one coach, so there is no way that he could do that since he is out on the field. I did see one scout go over to the coach before the game for a copy of the roster but nothing that was initiated on our side. Probably why you're seeing such success with your verbal commits.
quote:As a counter example, if you have top grades, 1300+ boards and cash to burn...
I appreciate what Midlo is saying overall (above), however I disagree with the Ivy Financial Aid wording ("cash to burn"). Ivy financial aid can be extremely generous, and their means are substantial. Need based financial aid is how they operate without athletic and academic scholarships. My advice is to not assume you can't afford it if you qualify academically and athletically. Let their FA offices run the numbers, and compare it to the other schools you've been offered. They have a lot to offer financially relative to other top shelf private $$ schools such as Richmond, Vanderbilt or Wake Forest. They do recruit nationally, so expect them at national tournaments and showcases.
I have to agree with fenway. I had discussion with a number of schools out of state prior to my son making his final decision and the ones that I talked to made sure to let me know that there was a much better than average chance to combine academic money with any scholarship money because they knew they had to get the tuition costs down to attract out of state players. Obviously the Ivies don't give athletic but the academic made up for it. Bottom line is to not make assumptions. Have some very frank conversations about money. You'll be surprised what you find out...
The other huge thing to remember is that if your player is using baseball as a means to go to school (obviously some don't much care, they just simply want to play ball at any D-1/2) then he really needs to address that during talks with the school. Many degree programs are literally off the table at a number of schools because the classes clash with the practice/game schedule. You REALLY need to take that into account if the degree your son is going after is what is most important to him. Don't take it for granted that just because a school offers that degree that your son will automatically be able to pursue it if he chooses to play ball at that school. Its not so cut and dry... Many, many things to consider there...
The other huge thing to remember is that if your player is using baseball as a means to go to school (obviously some don't much care, they just simply want to play ball at any D-1/2) then he really needs to address that during talks with the school. Many degree programs are literally off the table at a number of schools because the classes clash with the practice/game schedule. You REALLY need to take that into account if the degree your son is going after is what is most important to him. Don't take it for granted that just because a school offers that degree that your son will automatically be able to pursue it if he chooses to play ball at that school. Its not so cut and dry... Many, many things to consider there...
I should not have phrased that so carelessly, I apologize. But one thing you have to watch with any big ticket school is whether the particular school has a reputation for assuring that aid is renewed year to year. That goes whether you're talking about academic money, financial aid money, or baseball money.
If you're at an in-state school where the typical student has a budget of, say, 18k, then you're not as exposed. But when you're getting a big chunk of 52k/year paid, you need to make sure that money is going to be there for the duration. If you get 35k as a freshman and then see it drop to 20k the next year, given that you'd have to sit out a year of baseball if you transfer, you can be exposed.
I don't have any experience with Ivy League aid packages so I'll defer to Fenway on that topic. But I have certainly seen this when it comes to baseball money, at Wake and other places like it. (Happily not in my own situation, but certainly in the situations of others.)
If you're at an in-state school where the typical student has a budget of, say, 18k, then you're not as exposed. But when you're getting a big chunk of 52k/year paid, you need to make sure that money is going to be there for the duration. If you get 35k as a freshman and then see it drop to 20k the next year, given that you'd have to sit out a year of baseball if you transfer, you can be exposed.
I don't have any experience with Ivy League aid packages so I'll defer to Fenway on that topic. But I have certainly seen this when it comes to baseball money, at Wake and other places like it. (Happily not in my own situation, but certainly in the situations of others.)
quote:Obviously the Ivies don't give athletic but the academic made up for it.
Are you inferring that the Ivies offer academic aid? If so, you are mistaken. Ivies offer NEED BASED AID only.
I know harvard has the 10pct of your income policy. Does anyone know if this is considered a violation or not? A friend of mine said his some was not offered a scholorship but the school waived the out of state fee for him..seems like that is more than most scholorships are worth.
Out of state fee? For private U's?
You may be thinking of a place like Clemson, which has a policy across the board (not just for athletes) that if you graduate in the top 10% of your high school class, you get in-state tuition as an out-of-state student.
Not sure if that's good at all SC universities, but I do remember that Clemson offered it. And in a partial scholarship sport, it's a great opportunity.
You may be thinking of a place like Clemson, which has a policy across the board (not just for athletes) that if you graduate in the top 10% of your high school class, you get in-state tuition as an out-of-state student.
Not sure if that's good at all SC universities, but I do remember that Clemson offered it. And in a partial scholarship sport, it's a great opportunity.
I have seen that the "typical aid" package at the Ivy's runs roughly 75-80% of the cost. So that probably means that there are a number of students recieving almost free rides being offset by those that have the means. I know the Endowment funds at some of these places are huge but are not as big as they were about 3 years ago.
quote:Originally posted by gamefan:quote:Obviously the Ivies don't give athletic but the academic made up for it.
Are you inferring that the Ivies offer academic aid? If so, you are mistaken. Ivies offer NEED BASED AID only.
A. The Ivy League schools certainly do offer academic assistance...if they didn't, they would have an enrollment of 12 (obviously a joke, but if you have "Ivie", you'd get that)
B. "need based" = talent based...either academically or athletically...don't foll yourself
quote:Originally posted by dblemup:quote:Originally posted by gamefan:quote:Obviously the Ivies don't give athletic but the academic made up for it.
Are you inferring that the Ivies offer academic aid? If so, you are mistaken. Ivies offer NEED BASED AID only.
A. The Ivy League schools certainly do offer academic assistance...if they didn't, they would have an enrollment of 12 (obviously a joke, but if you have "Ivie", you'd get that)
B. "need based" = talent based...either academically or athletically...don't foll yourself
Don't foll yourself? Need based means FINANCIALLY in its best sense of the word.
Everyone can't afford an "Ivie" tuition